They were gradually BOILED!!!!

I live in the sand hills of NC where the summers are often in the 90's. My patio/bonsai are south facing with pretty much sun all day. The patio is concrete. I had 2 real nice bald cypress still in training pots and another pot with several smaller for a forest. Well last spring I decided I would put them in water for the summer. A black cement tub from Lowe's, some water and in they went. They began to decline in late summer (often the hottest). And by fall they were pretty much history. But why.

Well after a discussion with John G he finally suggested that they had probably been literally cooked alive. The combination of the hot direct sun, concrete and a black container spelled the disaster.

SO my friends be aware of my lesson and the strength of the sun in overheating containers, not only with water but your pots as well.

So good repotting to y'all

if you ever try it again, you should actually check the temp of the water just so we know for sure...

Sorry for your loss!

On a related note, this is a good time of year to remind people to be careful using black tubing in an automatic watering system.

When temperatures go up, the water sits in that tube between waterings and it gets very hot. If you turn on your hose and the water is scalding hot on a July afternoon, you can assume that the water in your 1/2" or 3/4" black flexible tubing is at least as hot. If the timer goes off mid-day, especially if you have the sprayers close to the foliage or root and/or you have a drop or strong sprayer (instead of, say, a mister-fogger), you are scalding your roots or foliage.

I have mine set to water in the morning, except for my misting system for cuttings and recently collected stuff. Those go off every few hours, but they are on foggers. The water that hits the foliage is never any worse than merely warm.

Yes black pots collect more heat that other ones. I used to paint mine white. Now that I'm aware of that, I put them in a spot where they don't get full sun all day. Roots can get overheated in there...

Around 95F (35C) is too hot for roots.
Measure it rather than guess what it might be.
An inexpensive ($15 or less) meat thermometer from the grocery store will do the job.

Hmmm, I have mine in water that is in a black cement mixing tub. I also use oil change pans and have experienced any issues. May be the concrete, mine are on cider blocks and wooden benches.

Think about it. Leave a bowl of water outside and at the hottest part of the day, out your hand inside? It absolutely, never, can be boiling hot. Literally impossible. It may get warm, but it will always be cooler than the air temp.

You had another issue.

The Cypress I keep at home sits in water for at least 2 months of the year, August and September, also after each repotting. Currently it is sitting in water. We're back in the mid 80's with 85% humidity. Same set up as you, black mixing tub, on concrete block.

This Bald Cypress sat in a Black Cement Mixing tub in water... in full sun for about 6 years, on the ground, cement slab, on benches, you name it... never had a probs.
Water temp will never get to a boiling point sitting in the sun if it is exposed to air. This is a myth... air actually keeps the temps from ever getting close. The only time water will reach these kind of temps is when it is confined within a sealed environment and left in the sun. Like a hose, or a jug of water.

Often these kind of incorrect suggestions are usually thrown around by individuals that are in the camp of one should not under any circumstances grow BC in water. That they don't do well... they will deal with it, but don't actually grow or thrive in water... and that they as has been suggested here will boil in a tub of water out in the sun. None of which is actually true. This tree was collected from a lake, was potted in water and sat as I said for years in the sun, in water and as one can tell from the third picture posted had a container full of nothing but fine feeder roots, from what? sitting in water...

Where the actual problem lies is not the water, but the transition for the tree, from one environment to a completely different one. You cannot expect a tree that has spent years in dirt in a pot, watered here and there... to all of a sudden go to living submerged in water, without it having some sort of impact on the tree. And vice versa from water to soil... This is a life altering scenario. Plants like consistency, and nine times out of ten when they suffer it is a result of a lack of this consistency.

So, how does one grow a BC in water?

Well... first off, the biggest mistake everyone makes is planting the tree in dirt, in the water... the dirt they soon find floats away, and does not give the tree anything to anchor onto. This is the only scenario one will ever hear me say this but, in this case... one actually needs to grow the tree in sphagnum moss within the water. It is the closest thing to replicating the layers upon layers of decomposing mass that normal make up a the bog of a swamp floor, which is very spongy. Remove first all the soil, and then pack it in tight with wet sphagnum moss, making sure to cram it in all of the areas. You don't run into issues here about compaction... the water will run right through it. Then fill with water. You will find that you will end up using around at least 3 or 4 bales of the moss for the large cement mixing tub.

Second, how to transition from soil to water... or water back to soil? I have found that the best way to do this permanently, by this I mean not just putting your potted soil tree, in a tub of water for the day... is to do it when dormant, but after any fear of frost or freezing... and to do it almost as though one was collecting the tree for the first time. Cut back hard on everything, branches, roots, etc. This slows the tree down tremendously and at the same time enables it to easily make the transition.

I then add new water to the tub every time I water my trees normally. Water will evaporate, and If you want, you can periodically dump the water and add new. Although the sphagnum moss actually helps to create a very healthy environment for the tree, so not really to much of a concern here. I use to maybe dump out the water once a month or every other month. One can use liquid fertilizer like the one's you spray through the garden hose. Careful of any animals wanting to drink from the tub if you do, like your cats or dogs... and do not let the water get to low or dry up, or you will have issues with your tree. I also have red and black mangrove growing in water through the same setup, that I have had for a long time, and started from seeds collected from the ocean. Last thing I wanted to mention, is that being in Florida, obviously we have issues with misquotes... and they breed and grow in any stagnate water to be found around here. But will not grow funny enough in the sphagnum moss filled tub of water.
Easy Peasy!

DougB said:

SO my friends be aware of my lesson and the strength of the sun in overheating containers, not only with water but your pots as well.

Click to expand...

In my dabbling with honeybees, I do on occasion use the heat of the sum to melt beeswax in a solar oven(145-147 degrees F). Make a simple wooden box and lay a sheet of glass over the top. Thought I could make it easy on myself by simply using an igloo cooler, lid replaced by glass. It worked but I'm seeing some literal melting of the inner plastic shell, and it is unpainted white plastic. To get an idea of solar heat absorption, put something black and something white in the sun for an hour. Now (carefully) feel the surface of each. If you have a black bowl of water in the sun for hours theres a good chance the water will reach a temperature uncomfortable to the touch. Can roots withstand that kind of heat? Sounds like maybe not.