Better take a seat for this one...Fukien dropping leaves

Alberello

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Been trying really hard to resist burdening folks with my FT issues. I know it's a constant with those of us with less experience and/or have FTs in unideal zones, and I know there's plenty of info online. But I can't get this tree back on track no matter what I do so I'm breaking down and appealing to the nice concentration of experts here. Had it a couple years. Was able to limp it thru last winter and most of this years' ok. But coming into the homestretch this year it's quite unhappy. Have it in the fish tank by a Southeast window with a humidifier under a T5. It keeps trying to push new growth which then immediately shrivles and dies. A month into this issue I seen no evidence of pests 'til yesterday when I noticed I white goopy spot on it which as far as I could tell didn't contain any pest...does this looks like scale? I just don't know if I should persist at what I'm doing or if I'm somehow killing it with kindness i.e. doing something I'm thinking is helping it but putting more stress on it. My thoughts: Is it possible It's getting to much heat/humidity and is wilting or cooking the growth? Could too much time under the grow light be cooking the growth? Is it possible that even with good indoor provisions it's not gonna push new growth til the weather breaks and I could get it outside? Any experts Fukien or otherwise care to weigh in.
 

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Anthony

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I suggest you try seeds and then cuttings.

Scratch gently to see if there is still green for life.

How about a nice local tree or shrub ?
Might be easier on your nerves.
Condolences.
Good Day
Anthony
 

Bonsai Nut

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Fukien-4.jpg

I wanted to post this photo to help you understand what to look for. See my arrow? The branch I am pointing to looks all wrinkled. That is because when a branch dies, it dries out, and the inner layers shrink as they desiccate, leaving a wrinkled skin. If you try to bend the tips of those branches, they are not going to bend - they are going to snap off like kindling or matchsticks. In the case of a tropical like Fukien Tea, that means the branch is totally dead and isn't coming back.

If there is any life left in this tree, it will be in the trunk or the roots. However I am not too optimistic. These guys have finicky root systems and if they are not kept in warm, humid conditions, the roots are often the first thing to go. Slowly the tree dries out from the roots on up, and then the leaves droop, fall off, and you are left with a sculpture of a dead tree. If it is a short term thing (like you accidentally left it by a cool open window) you might have a chance if you move it back to a good environment. But if you were just caring for it as normal and it turned up like this, I think it is a goner.

Hard to know what started the chain of events that led to its demise, but it might have been too much humidity which led to rot. The white on the trunk could be fungus under what is now dead bark. But I am strictly guessing and have no real fact-based advice to offer.

Don't feel bad - I killed a number of these guys when I lived in Chicago and now that I live in California I know they wouldn't take the dry. Great tree for Miami, Florida or Hawaii!
 
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Alberello

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Well thanks very much for the input guys. I appreciate it. Had a feeling it was gonna be bleek. Here are some shots of the scratch test? Suppose it would be wiser to stick to trees hardier in my region here. Thanks Bonsai Nut for the insights. Not happy about leaving another dead tree in my wake but lessons learned.
 

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Lazylightningny

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Mine likes to drop its leaves when it gets dry, but sprouts new leaves fairly soon. Give it a little time before you toss it, just in case.
 

Bonsai Nut

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Get a Chinese elm and practice your air-layering technique. Pretty soon you'll have more trees than you know what to do with and won't feel bad when you kill one or two. I've stopped taking shimpaku cuttings for this very reason - I have too many!
 

Alberello

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Oh your winters are about the same as mine lazylightning. How do you over winter yours?
And while we're on the subject of air layering when is the best time to start an air layer? Right when the tree breaks dormancy. Let it grow for a bit?
 

sorce

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Nice!

If you want to burn it...
There's a thread for that!

Congratulations!

That bulge aint pretty, I'd chop it below that.

Welcome to Crazy!

Sorce
 

Vance Wood

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A member of the Ficus family would be OK as well, not to mention a Scheffelara.
 

Alberello

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Oh good I'm not the only to turn a tree to firewood then. Thanks very much Sorce.
 

Victorim

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Nice!

If you want to burn it...
There's a thread for that!

Congratulations!

That bulge aint pretty, I'd chop it below that.

Welcome to Crazy!

Sorce

Got a great burn planed for you.. pyre, music, the lot.. just nothings dieing
 

Lazylightningny

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Oh your winters are about the same as mine lazylightning. How do you over winter yours?
I keep mine on a dresser facing an east window. My south-facing windows have heater vents that dry out the plant too rapidly, and they are very sensitive to drying out. Also, I made a cage out of wire that fits over the plant and covered it with a clear plastic bag. I also have a humidity tray under it. This keeps more humidity in the plant, so if I miss a watering, it doesn't drop leaves. It seems pretty happy now.
 

Leo in N E Illinois

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Fukien Tea and to some degree Serissa are frustrating trees. If they like your conditions, and watering habits, they are very easy to grow. But if they don't like your conditions, they can be an endless frustration. Some people grow them well, some don't. Even some very experienced people have trouble with these two species. Myself for one, over the 40 years I've been growing bonsai, neither species has remained alive in my care for more than 3 years. At some point, I goof up.

Not much comfort, I know, but some species simply won't grow for everyone. On the other hand, I had a pomegranate that I kept alive for over 32 years. It was often on the shelf next to my sad attempts at keeping a Fukien Tea alive. Try a dwarf pomegranate, they forgive the occasional missed watering and will bounce back. They do need as much sun as possible when grown indoors, and at least a half day of sun outdoors. A good species for summer outdoors and a cool windowsill for the winter.
 

Alberello

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I keep mine on a dresser facing an east window. My south-facing windows have heater vents that dry out the plant too rapidly, and they are very sensitive to drying out. Also, I made a cage out of wire that fits over the plant and covered it with a clear plastic bag. I also have a humidity tray under it. This keeps more humidity in the plant, so if I miss a watering, it doesn't drop leaves. It seems pretty happy now.
Yeah I'd say mine was a drying out issue. I had it just next to a humidifier. When I moved it into a fishtank enclosed with the humidifier it was to far gone. To little to late I suppose. Thanks. Hope yours continues to thrive.
 

Alberello

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Fukien Tea and to some degree Serissa are frustrating trees. If they like your conditions, and watering habits, they are very easy to grow. But if they don't like your conditions, they can be an endless frustration. Some people grow them well, some don't. Even some very experienced people have trouble with these two species. Myself for one, over the 40 years I've been growing bonsai, neither species has remained alive in my care for more than 3 years. At some point, I goof up.

Not much comfort, I know, but some species simply won't grow for everyone. On the other hand, I had a pomegranate that I kept alive for over 32 years. It was often on the shelf next to my sad attempts at keeping a Fukien Tea alive. Try a dwarf pomegranate, they forgive the occasional missed watering and will bounce back. They do need as much sun as possible when grown indoors, and at least a half day of sun outdoors. A good species for summer outdoors and a cool windowsill for the winter.
Thanks for the words of encouragement Leo. Not fun to lose something you put a lot of work into but I knew going in, most people find em difficult to sustain. But they're cool little trees and I'm sorry I failed it. It's exactly like you said. It was ok last year, than this winter just took a sharp downturn. I seen one person on one of the threads from up North in Canada that had a 65 year old one they've had for years. Forgot who but very impressive. Maybe I will try the Pomegranate. I like em and I like trying stuff that's a bit more exotic other than what's native or hardy here. Thanks very much for the advice. Be well.
 

sorce

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Fukien Devil trees.

Something about a tree in a bag makes it so much less enjoyable, if enjoyable at all!

Imagine a Bonsai show with all the trees in bags.....

And then ask yourselves....

"What the hell am I doing!?"

This is the horticultural version of
Munchausen syndrome by proxy.

Fukien Them!

Sorce
 

ml_work

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They're a pain in the ass and only grow decently in perfect light/heat/humidity conditions. These conditions are very very rarely found in a house, sadly.

Very good description and true.. I have owned and killed/died a couple of small ones like the OP has. Few years ago I got what I thought was nice and larger trunk, very aged looking it got Scale and died... I said that was it no more. Well sometime I am just a slow learner (thinking Ok the last one was Scale, not me). The past two times at Brussels they had some, but there were 3 way apart from the others, that I liked ( I have found some nice trees set apart / back tables) . Skipped the last time or may have been the last 2, but this time I gave in. I ask Terry why where they apart from the others and had not been purchased, what was wrong with them. He said nothing, they had come in with the top broke off and had been set aside to get some growth. As of tonight I saw some leaves turning yellow (one week home) and figured (hoped) it is just adjusting to the move. Then I read this and laughed, Jeremy is correct, the Green house at Brussels will not be reproduced in my home and outside may be worse.... :eek:
 

Lazylightningny

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When the weather turns nice, they do just fine outside, but the dry winters indoors are rough on them. Mine got spider mites this winter. I caught it and eradicated them before they did permanent damage, and constructed the "terrarium" for it after that. It seems to be doing well now, so this may be a solution.
 

sorce

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When the weather turns nice, they do just fine outside, but the dry winters indoors are rough on them. Mine got spider mites this winter. I caught it and eradicated them before they did permanent damage, and constructed the "terrarium" for it after that. It seems to be doing well now, so this may be a solution.

I greatly appreciate you allowing a bit of humor at a bit of your expense!

I appreciate the fact that you are making it work even more!

Nice!

Sorce
 
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