identifying tree in backyard to see if I should make into bonsai

jostage · Jul 19, 2017

Hi all
A good friend is going to remove a tree from his backyard and I was wondering if I should harvest it to bonsai. I'm not sure what species it is and whether it's one worth bonsaing. Please see pics. Sorry for the bad angles on the pics.
best
Jose

BrianBay9 · Jul 19, 2017

Looks like American elm. Where do you live? You can make credible bonsai from them, and they survive collection pretty easily, even out of season. It's always best to collect in the spring, but a young American elm has a really good chance of surviving collection pretty much any time.

jostage · Jul 19, 2017

Thanks Brian. I live in Washington DC. How similar is it to a chinese elm? Would you know?

rockm · Jul 19, 2017

American elm is a very strong tree and makes excellent bonsai. This one is a little on the spindly side, but it you leave it alone in the ground for a couple of years, it will bulk up.

Leaves on American Elm don't reduce as much as Chinese elm, but the American Elm is a more graceful tree. It is all over the D.C. area, the National Mall has older specimen American elms whose vase-shaped profiles can be easily replicated in bonsai form.

jostage · Jul 19, 2017

Excellent news rockm. Do you also confirm it looks like an American elm? Btw - how were you able to ID it, just by leaf?

Bonsai Nut · Jul 19, 2017

jostage said:
Excellent news rockm. Do you also confirm it looks like an American elm? Btw - how were you able to ID it, just by leaf?

Yes, it is an American elm. Since many were devastated by Dutch Elm Disease, you don't see as many gigantic ones around any more, however through the process of natural selection and selective breeding by the nursery trade, many new trees in the wild and landscape are much more resistant to the disease. I don't doubt that shortly they will be very prevalent again. You will see a lot of young ones pretty much everywhere, but the old large individuals are not as common.

BrianBay9 · Jul 19, 2017

jostage said:
Excellent news rockm. Do you also confirm it looks like an American elm? Btw - how were you able to ID it, just by leaf?

Leaves alternate on the stem (not immediately opposite each other), toothed margin, strong central vein with all secondary veins joining it, uneven base where it joins the petiole, very common as volunteer trees in the eastern US.

rockm · Jul 19, 2017

jostage said:
Excellent news rockm. Do you also confirm it looks like an American elm? Btw - how were you able to ID it, just by leaf?

The base of the leaves (which are "toothed"--a common elm feature) gives this away as American Elm away. The base of their leaves tends to be very asymmetrical, with one side shorter than the other. Other elms have even bases...This is variable however.

rockm · Jul 19, 2017

Bonsai Nut said:
Yes, it is an American elm. Since many were devastated by Dutch Elm Disease, you don't see as many gigantic ones around any more, however through the process of natural selection and selective breeding by the nursery trade, many new trees in the wild and landscape are much more resistant to the disease. I don't doubt that shortly they will be very prevalent again. You will see a lot of young ones pretty much everywhere, but the old large individuals are not as common.

View attachment 153642

View attachment 153644

https://www.ars.usda.gov/news-event...fferson-trees-resistant-to-dutch-elm-disease/

If you live in D.C., you can see A LOT of BIG American Elms, including the one that spawned all those Dutch Elm Disease clone/saplings. Just take a stroll down on the National Mall between the Lincoln Memorial, Reflecting Pool, then on over to the Washington Monument to the U.S. Capitol. The vast majority of the trees lining the mall are big old American Elm. One near the Smithsonian Castle is the "Jefferson Elm" that is the parent of all those "Jefferson" DED-resistant trees being planted around the nation.

GGB · Jul 19, 2017

Good find, I'm on the hunt for one around that size

defra · Aug 17, 2017

GGB said:
Good find, I'm on the hunt for one around that size

The seeds i posted to you never arived
I got message they lost my package o.0
Got some dutch elm seeds left tough so going to try again you have not been forgotten

The difference with chinese elm is the leave size and probably the hardines too

GGB · Aug 17, 2017

@defra thanks buddy. I was just wondering the other day if they were ever going to show up. I appreciate the update

defra · Aug 17, 2017

GGB said:
@defra thanks buddy. I was just wondering the other day if they were ever going to show up. I appreciate the update

I guess the bonsai enthousiast mail man snatched them lol let you know when i send batch 2

CasAH · Aug 17, 2017

defra said:
The seeds i posted to you never arived
I got message they lost my package o.0
Got some dutch elm seeds left tough so going to try again you have not been forgotten

The difference with chinese elm is the leave size and probably the hardines too

The USA does not want your dirty filthy fungus ridden Dutch Elm seeds.

Why do you think we call it Dutch Elm disease, instead of Chinese Elm Disease when the fungus wiped out all the American Elms in the USA?

It is because the US Forest Service did not want elm wood imported from Holland, because of the fungus. The untreated lumber was imported anyway and the USA lost millions of trees.

defra · Aug 17, 2017

CasAH said:
The USA does not want your dirty filthy fungus ridden Dutch Elm seeds.

Why do you think we call it Dutch Elm disease, instead of Chinese Elm Disease when the fungus wiped out all the American Elms in the USA?

It is because the US Forest Service did not want elm wood imported from Holland, because of the fungus. The untreated lumber was imported anyway and the USA lost millions of trees.

Dutch elm disease strikes only tall mature trees

The tree the seeds come from wouldnt be alive by now if it was contaged with the disease

Good to see you speak in the name off all the usa !

BrianBay9 · Aug 17, 2017

It's called Dutch elm disease because the fungus was identified by a Dutch phytopathologist. Appears to have originated in Asia.

CasAH · Aug 17, 2017

defra said:
Dutch elm disease strikes only tall mature trees

The tree the seeds come from wouldnt be alive by now if it was contaged with the disease

Good to see you speak in the name off all the usa !

Defra, there were supposed to be several smiley faces after that first line. Apparently they did not post from my phone. For that I am sorry that the humor did not show in my post.

just.wing.it · Aug 17, 2017

BrianBay9 said:
It's called Dutch elm disease because the fungus was identified by a Dutch phytopathologist. Appears to have originated in Asia.

All Asian stuff kills our stuff....diseases, fish, bugs.... kamikaze pilots....its crazy man!

CasAH · Aug 17, 2017

BrianBay9 said:
It's called Dutch elm disease because the fungus was identified by a Dutch phytopathologist. Appears to have originated in Asia.

Brian, I know this as I was friends with people, since pasted away, that spent their life's work trying to develop a Dutch Elm disease resistant elm that would have the classic weeping vase shape of the original mature American elm.

They worked at the Morton Arbiritum in Lisle, IL. I helped them in the field studying other native trees and priairies in the Chicago area.

The disease was introduced through imported lumber through Holland shortly after WWII.

defra · Aug 17, 2017

@CasAH
No problem

I was not feeling offended

I mean i know it sucks that much trees died by the disease but i realy dont think me sending someone some elm seeds will cause such an tragedy from happening again

So in fact we could call it the chinese elm disease from now on lol

identifying tree in backyard to see if I should make into bonsai

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