I can see why you would think non professionals can’t innovate. It really feels like the majority of your trees look like they were cloned in a replicator five years ago.Mostly done
You are helping me prove my point....and you don't even know itI can see why you would think non professionals can’t innovate. It really feels like the majority of your trees look like they were cloned in a replicator five years ago.
Speaking of non professional not innovating, who was that Japanese guy that made that big elm broom and a couple pancake nebari? He didn’t have another job before he started selling his trees, did he?
Is it the part about your trees or Ibihara.You are helping me prove my point....and you don't even know it
Um, no. Both statements are pretty much untrue. Bonsai is Japan was created AND MAINTAINED BY THE ELITE. That is were it grew from--the Imperial Palace for a time outlawed ownership of bonsai except by the royal class. As for ownership and money--Japan is far far FAR ahead of egotism and $$ when it comes to bonsai. There is no on in the U.S. paying $2 mill for a tree or $500,000 for a pot...Yes, there is ego and $ in bonsai in the U.S., but there's also both in just about any hobby--take a look at custom automobiles...ect. Bonsai $ is nowhere near car $ here.In Japan Bonsai was started through trading for medicine and is about family.
In the USA Bonsai was started for the ego and is about ownership and money..
Hai Much different.
someone as dense as me.
I’m calling Bull Shit on your entire comment!!!
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If you read rockm post it pretty much tells it as it is and was. Do a little reading and research and I think you will be surprised. If not surprise you will at least find whom is ignorant.That is because of your ignorance. Hai
HaiIf you read rockm post it pretty much tells it as it is and was. Do a little reading and research and I think you will be surprised. If not surprise you will at least find whom is ignorant.
If you only have bitching to contribute, then save your self some grief and just ignore this threadWow. Someone should post on the Announcements thread when you guys are done with your pissing contest. Then the rest of us can come back when there's less risk of getting wet in the overspray.
And yet, you chose to participate...??Wow. Someone should post on the Announcements thread when you guys are done with your pissing contest. Then the rest of us can come back when there's less risk of getting wet in the overspray.
Back to the original post
Bonsai is good enough for me. No need to add any qualifiers.
This debate is almost as old as the formation of the first bonsai clubs in the USA. I remember this topic being brought up in articles from the late 1960's and early 1970's. Dan Robbins used to argue about ''American Bonsai'' too, back in the day. I will be interested in the upcoming ABS article.
My understanding is the ''Japanese Bonsai'' approach was to create an image that evokes an emotional response, usually as one would have to a scene from nature. Key is the emotional response is the goal. It is not literal, ''miniature railroading'' creating scale models. In Japan, the Japanese culture has a number of cultural references that one would not experience if you were not raised, or extremely familiar with Japanese culture. Myself being USA born and raised do not have the emotional reaction to Ume that a Japanese citizen might have. And similarly I react to a Ponderosa pine or an American Larch differently than someone from Japan. Different cultural context.
But the goal of Bonsai is to create an image with emotional impact. Which is exactly the type of image @Mark created with his excellent display.
But the USA is such a large and varied country that I would likely have a different set of cultural references than someone from the east coast or west coast. And certainly different than someone from the arid mountain states.
So while my comments seems to endorse a new name, I really am against a new name. Bonsai is good enough.
This does bring up the issue of who should judge major North American shows? But the results this September from the National Show seem to demonstrate that at least so far, the Japanese professionals chosen by Bill Valvanis are quite competent at judging bonsai produced in America. Japan is a country with diverse landscapes, from the tropical island of Okinawa to the very cold, almost Wyoming like mountains of the island of Hokkaido. I am certain that Japanese bonsai judges are not strangers to the idea that artists will have different cultural references in their bonsai.
As to Marcel Duchamp's "Fountain" , I thought the whole point was that it is art if the artist says it is art. Full stop.