2010 BonsaiNut Trident Project

[garywood]

At Telperion we use several methods for growing Trident depending on what we want to achieve. I'll try to do one at a time over an extended time. We do a few things differently than most people but that's what makes the world go around Chris and I have been having an ongoing discussion about all of the information, facts and fiction that's available in an instant. That's good but it's also bad because infomation without context is just that, information. Hopefully, in the course of these projects we can convert a lot of information into KNOWLEDGE, using technique in context to arrive at the given goal.
This first project is cuttings placed through a hole in a tile. These are single cuttings but we also do multiple cuttings also(another posdt) They were struck in the Spring of 08 and were potted in the fall of 09. They will be grown in RootMaker pots 3gal. for two years and then have another round of rootwork and either be put in Anderson flats, raised beds or grow bags depending on what size and style.
Please bear with me on this for i'm a complete idiot with electronics

 

[garywood]

These are not the previous trees but some started earlier, just show a progression. Individual trees that I post may not stay at the nursery for an entire progression.
This tree was started the same as the previous post and grown in 3gal RootMaker pot for 2years plus 1year in Anderson flat. The goal is to grow a shohin size or grow more for chuhin, trying to keep the classical\traditional proportions ie wide symetrical nebari and taper. It was grown in a fine grained soil in the RootMaker pot to develope lots of fine roots and switched to a coarser soil in the Anderson flat to promote longer larger roots.

Help me out here AL

 

[Yamadori]

Here ya go Gary

 

[garywood]

Thank you ? Yama\Mama

 

[Smoke]

Gary, are you using the rootmaker pots during taking the cuttings or are you using the fabric system or pot liners on larger more established material for root growth?

Thanks, Al

Edit: I see you use a 3gal RootMaker pot. What does this look like? I have never seen one. Only the liner pots with mesh.

 

[garywood]

Al, i'll have to get back to you on this. The pics are too large to post and Im lost Might be a day or two. Wood

 

[jquast]

Al, i'll have to get back to you on this. The pics are too large to post and Im lost Might be a day or two. Wood

Here is a link to the RootMaker pots.

http://www.rootmaker.com/retail_products.php?Pageload=2#top

jeff

 

[Smoke]

Here is a link to the RootMaker pots.

http://www.rootmaker.com/retail_products.php?Pageload=2#top

jeff

Thanks, I did not see those there. I will look into them. I have used the mesh, and then have used my own which is really cheap.

 

[garywood]

Hi Al, Chris at Telperion and I approach growing trees in holistic manner, it's a total system not just one or two parts but the whole system. There is a hormonal\nutritional system in the tree, there is root\ particle size system to use to best advantage, there is roots to container configuration system to take advantage of and then the water to soil to roots and retention system. So when we go about a certain project we think about the economics\quality of the project and talk about designing the best system for it. We have a good handle on a lot of things and still working on others, thats what I love about this SH_T it's like doing "bonsai" there is always something new to ponder and learn.
Sorry for the blaaather Now, here is a shot in the greenhouse that shows the containers.
Anderson flats are the all purpose workhorse. We take cuttings and stick them in anderson flats with a mix of 75% pumice\25% peat and placed under mist. some of flats contain cuttings placed through tiles with holes drilled in them. cuttings are usually pencil thick and long. They root below the tile and grow, they expand, fill the hole, swell at the base and layer themselve on top of the tile with almost always perfect nebari beginings. You can see this in the first post. As they are in the flat, after the bottom roots are reduced and being planted in the RootMaker pot.
Wood

 

[garywood]

Another followup, the shots in the first post were single cuttings through tiles. these are multiple cuttings through tiles. The purpose is to grow shohin size with large base and taper, just alittle different look than the single trunk. The progression shot is not the same trees but the next stage..
Wood

 

[R_F]

Good stuff Gary.

I look forward to all the updates.

 

[pjkatich]

Gary,

Great information Gary, thanks for sharing.

One question for you, what material do you use for the tiles you plant the tridents through?

Thanks,
Paul

 

[garywood]

Hi Paul, we use regular ceramic tile that are not glaze fired. Most ceramic suppliers sell them by the box. i buy their seconds at substantial discount.
Thanks Ryan, this is fun. I have mostly lurked on all the forums for years and years, been through them all. But, I thought this could be such a good learning experience for everyone that I thought it worth participating. I don't have the computer skills necessary so I thought I might kill two birds with one stone I think we all should expand this at some point to include Pines, Junipers, Azalieas and anything or everything else. This could be a very good learning tool.
Wood

 

[Smoke]

Hi Paul, we use regular ceramic tile that are not glaze fired. Most ceramic suppliers sell them by the box. i buy their seconds at substantial discount.
Thanks Ryan, this is fun. I have mostly lurked on all the forums for years and years, been through them all. But, I thought this could be such a good learning experience for everyone that I thought it worth participating. I don't have the computer skills necessary so I thought I might kill two birds with one stone I think we all should expand this at some point to include Pines, Junipers, Azalieas and anything or everything else. This could be a very good learning tool.
Wood

I second that.

I am still trying to find a good web site with pictures of juniper whips wired for the yamadori style trees. Even in a Jim Gremel workshop he never bends one for "You." I guess part of the unsaid process is that you get the verbal instruction and "I" need to learn and do my own thing. I just want to see how he does it.

I'm gonna corner him at Kazari and bring some whips and when he wins again and while he is admireing his check I will thrust the whips in his hands. Maybe in the euphoria he will bend some for me. Woohoo.

 

[garywood]

Hi Al,at Telperion we have an intern program where people come and work at the trade alongside the crew. Three times a year, spring, summer and fall. maybe you could make it sometime.
Wood

 

[garywood]

One more method we use is to take large cuttings of trident from 1"-2" dia. and root them at an angle, about 45degree. I don't have many shots of this but you shoud be able to get the idea. This is a slower process but with a look that's different from most techniques. After the cutting has rooted and potted they almot always produce vertical shoots that will give a place to cut back to after it has gained appropriate girth. After this it's just striaght forward trident pruning. This tree is to be a larger tree simillar to the one I posted in Al's trident thread. Wood

 

[pwk5017]

Great post, but i have a question. At first, i thought you were describing the standard practice of allowing the SINGULAR plant to layer itself above the tile. However, after some investigation of your site, i see im wrong! So, how far apart do you space the holes to allow your cuttings to fuse properly and quickly? Any particular pattern of holes you like or just random? Thanks!

 

[garywood]

Thank you pwk ?
The tile projects are done several ways, single holes as in the early post and multiple holes in the latter post. The spacing on multiholes depends on what size tree you want to grow. The typical hole pattern for a small tree is 5 holes in a pattern like a #5 on a die(ce) with a diameter of about 2"-3". Usually one growing season will give enough roots to shorten the bottom roots and then the top roots will really take off. Growing roots is a function shoot growth so it is all depending on your growing conditions. Hope this helps, do you have a name

Wood

 

[garywood]

In post #16 the tree will be a larger tree. I mentioned that it will be similar to the one I posted in Al's thread. to keep from jumping around I thought I would just post it here for convenience.
Wood

 

[pwk5017]

hahaha sorry forgot to sign the post. Name is Patrick. The sn is my login at the university, and after 4 years of constantly typing it, you almost feel as if its your name. I'm only 21, so i don't have a ton of hands on experience, but i have a thirst for research, so i've read just about every book/article there is to read(thanks interlibrary loan!). I am particularly interested in this fusing technique. I only have about 40 1 year old trident seedlings, but i planted around 3,000-4,000 seeds in the fall, so im hoping for a big crop come spring. Anyhow, doug's fused maple sort of inspired me to get on the trident band wagon. I am an architecture student, so i have a array of techie tools at my disposal. I was originally going to model a better version of doug's frame, but i think i like this growing method better. I might shoot for 15 or so holes in the tile and use my 1 year old seedlings. The species grows incredibly fast, but i remember reading doug's article on fusing the seedlings, and he projected around 5-7 years for the things to completely fuse? Your goal of growing them close together on the tile is to achieve a fused base for awesome taper and nebari, right?

Patrick