Acer Palmatum #1

eplov90

Sapling
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After looking at the bonsai world from afar for a while, last summer I finally started acquiring some trees to work on.

In September, I picked up this pre-bonsai Acer Palmatum:
IMG_4005.PNG
I have mostly let it sit as-is until now but want to get started with the development of the tree as the buds are swelling. Right now it looks like this:
IMG_3999.jpgIMG_4001.jpgIMG_4002.jpgIMG_4003.jpgIMG_4004.jpg

My current thinking is that I should first get in better bonsai soil and do some root work right now.

Afterwards, I should decide where/if to chop it -- I have no idea where to do that right now so input appreciated.

I should be fertilizing quite heavily througout the growing season.

Am I missing anything? Can I do both the root work and replanting and the chop right now? Or should I just do root work first and then chop it next fall/winter?

Thanks!
 

Johnnyd

Shohin
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Nice maple! Yes better soil is important. The first thing you can do is dig down into the soil and look at the nebari (where the roots and trunk meet). That is how you determine thg front. If you are going to hard prune try to have the large scars face the back.
Also on your profile add your location. Many answers vary based on what hardiness zone your located. The orange lines are where I would reduce. Enjoy!
 

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eplov90

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Thanks for the input.

I haven't dug down too deep but it does seem like the trunk continues to flare out a little under the dirt. I'll post a picture once it's repotted.

Would you do the trunk chop this spring too or wait until next winter?

I'm in London, UK -- so Zone 8b from what I gather.
 

eplov90

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Great, thanks for the help to both of you @sorce and @Johnnyd! I'll share back here once I've taken care of both the trunk chop and the roots.
 

just.wing.it

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Great, thanks for the help to both of you @sorce and @Johnnyd! I'll share back here once I've taken care of both the trunk chop and the roots.
Wait until buds are swelling in spring time for root work.
Personally, I would wait for another year after that initial root work to chop out the center trunk.....and maybe one of the other 2.
 

sorce

Nonsense Rascal
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maybe one of the other 2.

I'm feeling that, but I think the size difference in those 2 remaining is too good to not attempt to use em both.

Capture+_2021-02-27-07-36-18.png

Maybe that dead straight line can be worked out with angle change and or a new branch from the right branch low node.

If that second trunk doesn't pan out....cut it!

The upper parts will always be out of proportion IMO. Or too odd an exit place on that upper branch.

I look forward to watching this one for sure.

Go slow bro!

Sorce
 

eplov90

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Based on everyone’s input, I decided to work on the roots now and then in May, I’ll figure out where to chop it.

In cleaning up the roots, I found an interesting flare below the soil line.
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Unfortunately, it’s very lopsided and there are also some coiled thick roots as well.

Would you remove the thick coiled roots? Should I plan to add some root grafts on the side without flair in the future to balance things out?
 

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BuckeyeOne

Chumono
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Yes, remove the large circling roots! You look to have plenty of fine feeder roots to kept the tree happy for now.
Grafting new roots is definitely possible. Do you have any seedlings available? Could do it all now.
Good luck!!
 

eplov90

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I'm looking at my trees now and thinking about spring plans so I wanted to post an update on this AP and get some thoughts/feedback on my future plans.

Life got in the way last spring and I didn't get actually around to chopping it until early August. I also, in hindsight, chickened out and didn't go as low as I should have so I am planning on chopping lower this year and finalizing the future of the trunkline. This is what it looked like post chop:

IMG-0662.jpg

The tree didn't skip a beat and pushed out tons of growth throughout the growing season. I am sure I made some mistakes in terms of timing of prunings and obviously the chopping but I have no reason to believe it won't come out of the gates strong in a few months. Over the last few days, I have cut back some of the last push of growth, making very minor tweaks with wire to add movement in young shoots, so it looks like this:
IMG-2470.jpgIMG-2471.jpgIMG-2473.jpgIMG-2472.jpg

I am playing with various mockups depending on which front I use and where I chop. Here are the three options I am mostly considering:

Front A - Mock 1
AP1FrontAMock1.jpeg

Front A - Mock 2
AP1FrontAMock2.jpeg
Front B - Mock 1
AP1FrontBMock.jpeg
Front B - Mock 1


I'm leaning towards Front A Mock 2 but would love to get everyone else's thoughts.
 

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SgtPilko

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Hello fellow Londoner! Did you manage to remove the problematic roots last spring? If not you can do it this repotting season in early Spring when the buds are almost ready to pop. There are quite a few good threads on JM nebari development in the forum, you could try planting on a board or similar techniques to increase flare and radial roots. Great little tree and JM seem to love our climate and lack of full sun in a typical urban garden!

From what you've shown I also prefer front A mock 2 but there could be others in there. On chopping, people tend to go quite bold and low so don't be too nervous, regrowing is pretty rapid. On choosing a front, I am also a beginner and quite like to go back to basics and follow a "Mirai-style" process - objectively going round and marking the points (you can use chalk on the pot, or ideally cocktail sticks in the soil). Mark the points with absolute best nebari, the best taper, the best trunk movement, any unique features etc and then finding a happy medium between those points gives you your answer, and often not what you thought in the beginning. The Mirai beginner videos on Youtube are worth a watch.
 

eplov90

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@SgtPilko I did remove the circling roots under the trunk last summer but for some reason, ended up leaving the circling root that is level with the nebari. I will likely remove that when repotting this spring and also look to start the growth of some new finer roots by treating that section like an airlayer.

I'm fairly convinced now that I need to chop down to that first branch and really build taper and movement into the tree that way.
 

eplov90

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Winter Update:

I ended up letting this tree grow without repotting last spring before chopping it down to the main branch as the new leader. I left a few branches around the chop and let them run wild to help heal the chop scar.

The next trunk section doesn’t have a clear a bud/shoot as a leader so I have wire an existing branch around to thread graft in place as a new leader.

It will also need to be repotted this spring and have the last remaining circling root removed. If I can find some AP seedlings I may even try soon root grafts — it was a very cheap tree and I’m using it to experiment with techniques new to me. It’s incredibly vigorous so I’m hoping to make good progress on the trunk this year and next before focusing more on ramification.
 

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eplov90

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This tree was repotted last spring and had heavy, heavy root work done to clean up the circling roots and unbalanced development. I also added a few root grafts, my first time doing it, to try and improve the radial spread of the roots. As a result of the work, it grew well but not a crazy amount like it had the previous year.

On the top, the thread graft for the new leader was successful and the donor branch can be safely cut in the spring.

I trimmed it back a little bit at the top and next growing season will be adding a thread graft to create a cascading branch on the left, before chopping the rest of that branch, and cut off the branch above the new leader once the graft shows good growth after separation. The other branches will be left to grow to speed up the healing of the big chop I did last year.
 

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