Advice on Azalea chop

[Esolin]

I found this azalea (Southern Indica) a few years ago. It has amazing nebari, a good single trunk, and clearly wants to be some sort of broom style. I gave it an initial chop after purchase to start bringing energy back into the interior, but I know it needs a much harder chop to start building ramified branches and pads. I've just been hesitant to do it (wrong), because I understand Azaleas heal very slowly, if at all.

The main hangup I'm having is with the branches on the left side. Two of them are massive and throw off the visual balance of the tree when viewed from the best front. The rear branch makes up almost a quarter of the trunk. The front branch has a three-way junction that will swell over time, so I either need to remove it, or one of the smaller, more desirable branches. Anywhere I hack them off, it's going to leave a massive scars, so I want to make the best choice.

Should I take the rear one off all the way down at the base, and try to grow a new branch there? Should I leave an inch or two and grow from there? I know the pictures don't provide a lot of info. I'd have to defoliate it to really show the branch structure, and I don't want to do that before I chop it. But if better pictures are needed, I could post more during the chop process, and remove material over a few days. It's just starting to bloom, so I plan to chop it in two or three weeks when it's done.

 

[Shibui]

It is hard to fully assess a tree just from pictures but as far as I can see I agree with your assessment. That branching is typical of azaleas and that thick back branch is probably better gone. I would not leave any. There is already plenty of branches in that area so nothing further needed.
It is also likely that the thick part of that left branch could also go completely. azaleas respond well to pruning so even if it looks a bit bare initially it should soon fill in as new shoots grow in the spaces.
I have been told to seal all cuts on azalea. There is evidence that they can die back if left open to infection. I have not always followed that advice and have not seen any problems so far so will leave it to you to decide.

 

[Esolin]

It is hard to fully assess a tree just from pictures but as far as I can see I agree with your assessment. That branching is typical of azaleas and that thick back branch is probably better gone. I would not leave any. There is already plenty of branches in that area so nothing further needed.
It is also likely that the thick part of that left branch could also go completely. azaleas respond well to pruning so even if it looks a bit bare initially it should soon fill in as new shoots grow in the spaces.
I have been told to seal all cuts on azalea. There is evidence that they can die back if left open to infection. I have not always followed that advice and have not seen any problems so far so will leave it to you to decide.

Thanks, Shibui.

Yes, it is very hard to assess from pictures. I will post more pics after I've cut it back. It'll be much easier to see the branch structure then without the full canopy. And odds are I won't take enough height off anyway, and I'll need the experts here to tell me so, lol.

 

[River's Edge]

In my experience azalea heal just fine! I agree with your thoughts on harder cutback getting better results, however that depends on condition of the plant.
I would suggest a repot after flowering into an improved substrate such as Kanuma. Once the tree has recovered and is in improved health, then I would plan a more aggressive cutback and rework scars for better healing results!
Based on the pictures and container I suspect the substrate could be improved considerably and thus the plants health as well.
The tree has lots of fine potential I think it is worth the extra effort and time.

 

[Esolin]

In my experience azalea heal just fine! I agree with your thoughts on harder cutback getting better results, however that depends on condition of the plant.
I would suggest a repot after flowering into an improved substrate such as Kanuma. Once the tree has recovered and is in improved health, then I would plan a more aggressive cutback and rework scars for better healing results!

Definitely good advice. I was actually planning on doing a repot at the same time as the chop to improve the soil, because yes, it's been in that nursery pot for who knows how long, and it is getting a little anemic--partly my fault because I forgot to give it iron and soil acidifying supplements for about nine months (Thanks, 2020). It's got a little frost burn right now too.

You're right, I shouldn't rush it. It is a nice piece of material and I definitely don't want to kill it with impatience. I've already waited two years to chop it hard, I can wait another 6-12 months until it recovers from a repot.

 

[shinmai]

If it were me, I would not be in a hurry to do an aggressive chop. I’ve cut azaleas back to stumps, but nothing with the base potential you have here. Before you make any major structural moves, I would advise a serious thinning first. You have one big diagonal crosser visible in the photos, and numerous interior upright and diagonal branchlets that should be pruned out. Not only is this good for the tree near term, it will also remove a lot of visual clutter that will make the major decisions more apparent.
Personally, I think you have a great tree-like form that could be preserved, and the nebari looks fantastic in the photos. When you do go ahead and reduce it, I would suggest using convex cutters. They will give you a cut that is flush to the parent branch, which will heal much more quickly than if you use a regular concave cutter. The bright orange Japanese cut paste in a tube is a must—for whatever reason that I cannot discern in Japanese, it prevents fungal and bacterial infection and seems to stimulate overgrowth by the surrounding bark.

 

[queenofsheba52]

Hi Esolin!

What a nice azalea!

Azaleas are my favorite projects but I live in Michigan, a far different climate than yours. However, I have learned a few things about azaleas from my own experience. As they say, "Your mileage may differ."

Be aware that azalea bark is very thin. Be careful of the bark while doing other procedures.

I have found that, when chopped, many azaleas die back farther from the chop than you might expect.

I have the best luck sealing my cuts. I had plumbers putty on hand two years ago and that worked well, but the Japanese stuff is a better bet for such a nice piece of material.

Azaleas have lots of roots near the soil surface so I'm always very cautious when repotting. Mine like a wider pot than you might use for a similar sized plant of another type.

You probably already know these little tips but better safe than sorry. Good luck!
--Helene

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

Well, I can’t tell from the photos how the sap draw is for both those branches. So its hard to give any advice but to do the safest azalea prune, which is to cut each of those chunky brances in stages. That’s because most azalea cultivars don’t take kindly to big branch cuts all at once and are know to die back to the roots if they really resent a big cut.

The way to do this is to make a “V” shaped cut about 1/2 way on the top of each of the two offending branches about 2” up from the point where you will eventually want to cut back to. Then seal with putty.

This will keep the sap flow going at a reduced rate while allowing the other foliage in the area to shuttle the rest of the flow their way. Once this is complete and the cuts start to callus over, say this fall or next Feb, take the branches off the rest of the way. Cut near flush and carefully shave the wound flush with a sharp tool and putty cut paste again.

Given you do this correctly the wounds should heal fine over time.

cheers
DSD sends

 

[Esolin]

Thanks everyone for the great info! I'm gonna hold off on a heavy chop for now, and repot instead in a few weeks. I won't reduce the roots much--mostly it's to freshen up the soil and get a better look at the nebari. I will post an update when this is complete.

When it comes time to chop, I do have both types of Japanese cut paste--the putty and the kiyonai goop. I've experimented with both on other material, and am a bit torn. I like how well the kiyonai seals, but that stuff doesn't ever seem to come off. Even after a couple years on the trunk of a Grewia, it was like glue, and I had to damage the callous to scrape it off. The putty doesn't have this problem. Quite the opposite--I've found it cracks within a few months when placed on large broadleaf evergreen wounds, like pyracantha. Maybe I don't apply a thick enough wad? I'm still trying to figure out best methods....

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

Your call your azalea.

This is the best time of year to start a big cut. If you choose either the entire cut or a partial cut as I suggested, putty would be best for azaleas. I don’t know a lot about cut paste on other types of trees besides azaleas and maples. Especially on an azalea the putty allows the sap to push against the putty and keeps the sap from flowing out, also a callus forms quicker. You will have to reform the putty over time as the callus forms. That’s why it cracks. The other liquid type of cut paste is for smaller cuts on azaleas.

As far as a partial repot for azaleas goes, if you are changing media, the guideline is either keep the media exactly the same, change it all and flush everything out, or not at all. I prefer either a kanuma mix of either 80:20 kanumaumice same sized, or kanuma:chopped NZ sphagnum. In So. Cal, I’d go for the latter due to your temps. Also beware of hot winds they have done many a So Cal bonsai azalea in!

If You take the azalea out of the pot, avoid any digging work directly underneath the tree. Damaging those roots will often cause your apex area to die back. A simple straight cut across the entire bottom is ok.

Also azaleas do not do their best in plastic. That’s because roots like heat, yet not a lot of heat. So you might get a ceramic or clay pot to keep the roots cool. One trick to help in any event (sounds hokey, but it works) is to get aluminum foil and wrap the pot in it. Shiny, yet effective.

Others in your area may have suggestions too.

Best of luck and let’s hear from you down the line.

cheers
DSD sends

 

[Esolin]

Your call your azalea.

This is the best time of year to start a big cut. If you choose either the entire cut or a partial cut as I suggested, putty would be best for azaleas. I don’t know a lot about cut paste on other types of trees besides azaleas and maples. Especially on an azalea the putty allows the sap to push against the putty and keeps the sap from flowing out, also a callus forms quicker. You will have to reform the putty over time as the callus forms. That’s why it cracks. The other liquid type of cut paste is for smaller cuts on azaleas.

As far as a partial repot for azaleas goes, if you are changing media, the guideline is either keep the media exactly the same, change it all and flush everything out, or not at all. I prefer either a kanuma mix of either 80:20 kanumaumice same sized, or kanuma:chopped NZ sphagnum. In So. Cal, I’d go for the latter due to your temps. Also beware of hot winds they have done many a So Cal bonsai azalea in!

If You take the azalea out of the pot, avoid any digging work directly underneath the tree. Damaging those roots will often cause your apex area to die back. A simple straight cut across the entire bottom is ok.

Wonderful info, thanks!! I like your idea of the partial cut, and may still do that in late Spring or Summer if it doesn't sulk after repotting. It's been pointed out that the azalea's been in that 3 gallon pot for (if I had to guess) ten years at least. The top is a solid mass of fine roots, so I know the whole nursery pot must be like that, probably with very little growing medium left that isn't powder. So it probably does need a repot more than anything else right now to improve aeration and water flow.

I will be careful of it drying out after the repot. I keep it in a very wind-sheltered location between the house and a fence and it only gets filtered mid-day sun through a large wisteria canopy. But I might also put a humidity tray under it when the temps warm and let it soak up water from underneath each morning.

 

[Forsoothe!]

I beg to differ. I'd remove the small branches and keep the big ones. Just because the proportions aren't book-perfect doesn't mean that it won't be a very nice tree. I'd keep the smaller scars which will heal a coon's age before you regrow to the proportions you are seeking, not to speak of healing giant scars. How long are you willing to wait for a nice tree to these artificial standards? For me, normally 5 or max 10 years. Anything beyond that I start thinking about history and the fact that bonsai are often lost to the several hazards of living and while I have had lots of trees for more than ten years, I have lost too many to have goals beyond that. Ten years or screw it.

 

[Esolin]

I beg to differ. I'd remove the small branches and keep the big ones. Just because the proportions aren't book-perfect doesn't mean that it won't be a very nice tree. I'd keep the smaller scars which will heal a coon's age before you regrow to the proportions you are seeking, not to speak of healing giant scars. How long are you willing to wait for a nice tree to these artificial standards? For me, normally 5 or max 10 years. Anything beyond that I start thinking about history and the fact that bonsai are often lost to the several hazards of living and while I have had lots of trees for more than ten years, I have lost too many to have goals beyond that. Ten years or screw it.

I mean, I hear ya. I ain't gonna live forever, and I really don't want big scars, but I also don't like the branch balance as it is right now. But if there's anything I've learned in 3 years of being a bonsai newb, it's don't cut until you're sure. So I'll wait and continue to study the tree until a clearer vision comes. Maybe I'll see a way to incorporate the larger branches into a design I like.

In the meantime, I'll just enjoy the flowers.

 

[Mellow Mullet]

This is how I handle nursery azaleas:

Another Nursery Azalea Gets a Chop

I found this one at a nursery a few weeks back, today I decided to cut it back. What do you think? Here is what I stated with: Nice fat trunk: After a few minutes with the shears: After removing the pot, I found the roots and soil were very dry, even though I have been watering it for a...

www.bonsainut.com

They can take a lot of abuse, don't be afraid to cut off what is not needed. Just be careful when removing large branches, leave a stub for a few months before completely removing the branch, this will ensure that the roots below the branches stay healthy.

 

[Lazylightningny]

I have done drastic reductions on several azaleas with good luck. I bare root and chop in the spring, then leave foliage alone for the rest of the year so the tree can recover its energy. The following late winter (ie early March) I prune branches back to 2 or 3 leaves, let it grow out throughout the spring, then cut back the shoots again once the new foliage hardens off. Depending on your USDA

 

[Lazylightningny]

I have done drastic reductions on several azaleas over the last few years with good luck, using John Geanangel's method. I bare root and chop in the spring, then leave foliage alone for the rest of the year so the tree can recover its energy. Plant it in kanuma. Fertilize it well. Not being concerned about flowers just yet, the following late winter (ie early March) before buds swell I prune branches back to 2 or 3 leaves. Then let it grow out throughout the spring, and cut back the shoots again once the new foliage hardens off. You can even lightly wire the new shoots at this time. Depending on your USDA zone, you may even get in another pruning cycle. Be careful when you chop to leave a longer stub than needed, as you may not get new growth where you want it. Make your big cuts with a small-toothed bonsai saw, not concave cutters. I always seal my cuts.

See this thread https://www.bonsainut.com/threads/lazylightningnys-azalea-contest-2020-2025-entry.43627/

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

I would second the advice by @shinmai - keep the large outer branches. Work with what you have. I would not "chop" this azalea. Instead just prune out the clutter.

Work with what you have. Major chops will take multiple decades to heal over enough to look natural.

 

[Lazylightningny]

Also, I should have put it in a deeper pot. It's already pot bound and I had to insert an awl into the root ball core the other day to aid in percolation. That will be rectified this spring.

 

[Esolin]

While I've been waiting for this azalea to finish its bloom to repot it into a grow box, I noticed it's thrown two sports this year. They're on spindly growth, so I don't know if I can keep these branches, or if the trait will even persist permanently, but if it did develop a bi-colored look similar to some satsukis, that'd be cool.

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

That’s really good observing! Most people would just look at it and say,”Oh, that’s pretty!”

The sector one is a variation sector sport. One that could possibly become an entirely different cultivar one day if it breeds to true and no one else noticed it. The red one is likely a reversion sport. In other words, a flower that reverted back to the original type before breeding.

Here’s my thoughts. If it were me, I’d mark the specific area the “variation” sport is, then, once blooming is complete, take cuttings of the new branches emanating from this area once these get about 3” or more long with multiple leaves and put into water out of the sun. Leave two new branches horizontally located, if possible. (You can cut these back to two leaves if needed to keep the outline) Doing this, if the cuttings fail, you still should have the variation on your azalea to try again later.

Use a mixture of 1/2 peat and 1/2 perlite, well moistened, in a plastic nursery pot, poke a hole in the soil for each. Sharp cut the ends of each cutting straight across. Leaving about 2- 3 leaves on each cutting, stick (strike) each in one of the holes and gently pat to ensure soil contact at the base. Take a clear plastic bag (I use multiple types, even used gallon zip lock bags.) blow it up, seal and put in an area of indirect sunlight. Increase to part sun in a week.

In about 6 to 8 weeks if the lil guys have taken off, consider up potting separately, same mix. Shield from direct light for a couple weeks. I keep my cuttings in domed greenhouse flats until they look robust to me, then I ease these out of the domes and in the open under light, but out of the wind. If outside go for part shade all day or use 50% screen all day. (I use screening from the hardware store they sell by the foot, doubled up to start with)

As for the reversion sport, mark this area. Then you can leave it on (not advisable as they are known to take over the tree) cut off that branch, or take all the sub up branches for cuttings and cut off the remaining branch back to the nearest true to type flower area.

cheers
DSD sends