An apology to JudyB

coh

Imperial Masterpiece
Messages
5,781
Reaction score
6,822
Location
Rochester, NY
USDA Zone
6
Just wire...to see creativity in an object and bring it to life...(weeping form style) no...to cutting or root pruning. I am so new I would worry I cut off a very vital branch to a design I yet to see. But I am a very visual person...(so glad my juniper has several years to grow out...so I can develop a style I may wish to bring out in it...before I ruin it attempting something I have no clue what I am about) but I was thinking...weeping is just bending branches to a weeping form. Not as difficult as attempting to create say...the more complex bonsai structures. Am I incorrect in my way of thinking then?
I haven't worked on any weeping style trees, but I don't think it's as simple as just wiring branches down. There was a discussion recently about a weeping willow bonsai, unfortunately I can't remember if it was on this forum or somewhere else. But it discussed the difficulty of producing the same effect (of a massive weeping willow) in a small tree. You don't just wire branches down, you have to produce the correct larger scale "infrastructure" (for lack of a better term), the basic trunk and branch structure from which the branches weep. At least, that's how I interpreted what I read. Similar, I think, to producing a good windswept style - there's more to it than just wiring all the branches in one direction.

If you're "itching to wire", I'll repeat my suggestion from an earlier thread to practice wiring parts of a tree or shrub in your yard. Another option is to pick up some cheap end of year plant material (juniper, perhaps) and just practice on that.

Chris
 

coh

Imperial Masterpiece
Messages
5,781
Reaction score
6,822
Location
Rochester, NY
USDA Zone
6
Dan,

thanks for the information. Brother-in -law is also a painter, who also had sculpture training.

What I image for him, and what is there in reality, is so totally different, that it is useless to try and show anything, save to say, look I did something.

Presently the guys who are local on the forums, are coming over and saying, wow, that is different, doesn't look anything like the image on the computer screens.

I gave up a long time ago trying to send images that are true representations of his work.
Same happens with Traditional oil painting, so most painters just talk about composition and beginning sketches.

As an example, years ago he showed me in the National Gallery, London, what happens to Caravaggio's Supper at Emmaus, in quality photos.
Caravaggio looks weird.

However as the camera becomes more common in the 19th Century, paintings take on a photographic look and are easier to image.
Most folk today, growing up with cameras, tvs, periodicals, now have flat image eyes and can't really see, as they used to before the one eyed monster.
[ Chris, I am not including you in any of this, just passing on what I have seen and had explained to me.]

Good Day
Anthony

It's an interesting topic. In addition to the intrinsic difference between the original object (painting, bonsai) and the digital representation, you've got all kinds of variables to consider. Quality of camera lens, sensor quality, lighting, skill of the photographer, and of course the variability that comes with all the different monitors that the image might be viewed on.

It's funny, I've seen photos of bonsai (and paintings) that make the original tree (painting) look better than it did in person, and photos that make trees look worse. It's always interesting to go through the National Exhibition book after the exhibition because of that. Sometimes a tree I remembered as being really spectacular just looks so-so, and other times I say to myself "I don't remember seeing that beautiful tree."

So for me, using photography is just a tool than can help one evaluate an object...but it is risky to rely on it as the sole source of information.

Chris
 

GrimLore

Bonsai Nut alumnus... we miss you
Messages
8,502
Reaction score
7,452
Location
South East PA
USDA Zone
6b
I haven't worked on any weeping style trees, but I don't think it's as simple as just wiring branches down.

Chris

I am certain that post was correct in MANY ways. I have root chopped some decent size(4-7 inch trunk base) Willows, Corkscrews, and Wisteria to collect early Spring. In my humble opinion you NEED a hell of a good "base" more then wire or anything else. If the plant in question "weeps" it is simply a matter of time and effort to make the base work and produce a very nice weeping specimen. It is a first for me but going in I think it is the most logical approach. I am not saying that some wire might be needed but looking at the mature trees tells me something different. I was telling my wife after 3-5 years I feel that we will have "nice" specimens with a minimal amount of work other then upkeep/trimming and I am pretty certain of it.

Grimmy
 

Cadillactaste

Neagari Gal
Messages
16,262
Reaction score
20,886
Location
NE Ohio: zone 4 (USA) lake microclimate
USDA Zone
5b
Because I know that 3D is the best way to learn and because there is no club within 1 hour drive of me, I had a dilemma. That didn't stop me. I decided to start my own club! I got in touch with 3 or 4 interested folks, we had a pre-meeting show through which we generated interest. I have a contact list of over 15. Our first show is this Monday.

While I know there are no masters in the bunch, with dues and as a team, we can learn more and accomplish more than flying solo behind a computer. While that is how I have primarily learned thus far, I'm excited to move on to the next step: demonstrations, workshops, etc. This is something a club can offer that and individual will find much more difficult to accomplish.

I will let you know how it goes.

Always learning,
Dan

Dan,
I would be interested in accomplishing something similar. How did you go about locating ones with similar interest in bonsai? If you could contact the group an hour from you see if they would visit and share their knowledge on seperate months. You all could gain knowledge.
 

Cadillactaste

Neagari Gal
Messages
16,262
Reaction score
20,886
Location
NE Ohio: zone 4 (USA) lake microclimate
USDA Zone
5b
I am certain that post was correct in MANY ways. I have root chopped some decent size(4-7 inch trunk base) Willows, Corkscrews, and Wisteria to collect early Spring. In my humble opinion you NEED a hell of a good "base" more then wire or anything else. If the plant in question "weeps" it is simply a matter of time and effort to make the base work and produce a very nice weeping specimen. It is a first for me but going in I think it is the most logical approach. I am not saying that some wire might be needed but looking at the mature trees tells me something different. I was telling my wife after 3-5 years I feel that we will have "nice" specimens with a minimal amount of work other then upkeep/trimming and I am pretty certain of it.

Grimmy
Grimmy...I have a list of weeping conifers (thanks to that post that asked about weeping bonsai and the info given)...I have a list of conifers that are weeping that I like..."I actually had a list of weeping conifer back started in July and did some research on a garden website for my own yard." Never realizing one could turn them into bonsai...seems wise after I get the juniper through one winter to look further into that area that I need to narrow down to one come spring when I get my juniper through winter. They are really cool looking...there was one...due to Juglone that I could not plant. I am strongly leaning in that direction for bonsai. Because it would be in a pot...not in the contaminated soil of the walnut tree.

The "weeping" bottlebrush in a natural weeping state...is beautiful...I have googled imagines and seen broom styles in need of pruning and the ends at the bottom sort of weep. Which makes the broom pretty if one can keep it sort of shaggy for that variety of tree. It looks more natural to me...I guess I am not into more formal shaped trees...oh I admire them...and what it took to get them to that stage. But...it's not what I want at this time.
 

Attachments

  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    86.7 KB · Views: 8
  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    183.9 KB · Views: 8
Top Bottom