Any lime sulfur updates or alternatives.

october

Masterpiece
Messages
3,444
Reaction score
304
Location
Massachusetts
I just finished brwosing a thread in the maples section and it made reference to lime sulfur becoming unavailable. I just purchased some at the bonsai nursery the other day. Them seemed to have a few left.

I was wondering if there has been a recent, official on the status of this. Also, has any one used an alterantive and how did it work out. Actually, from information I read a long time ago.. Lime sulfur is not necessarilly a preservant, it is more of, a bleaching agent. If this does become unavailable, would a good, possibly diluted, wood hardner serve as a substitue... Also, if one desired the whitening effect, could a little white paint be mixed into the wood hardner. More importantly, would this be safe from a chemical point of view...I am anxious to hear people's thought ..

Rob
 

rockm

Imperial Masterpiece
Messages
9,683
Reaction score
12,464
Location
Fairfax Va.
USDA Zone
7
There is no real "wood preserver" that will completely protect wood on bonsai from rotting. Wood hardener will not "preserve" wood. It only stabilizes soft punky wood so it can be worked. It will not stop rot behind it where it was applied. It might also not stop rot in the treated wood itself. It's not reliable in that respect. If you think it will preserve wood, you might be in for a surprise when the area you treat with it caves in after a few years, as the wood 1/4" or so behind it rots away from underneath. Wood hardener is not interchangeable in application with lime sulphur. It does not kill anything. It soaks plastic polymers into wood fibers to support them

Lime sulphur is not a really preservative either--although it can prolong deadwood's "life" by killing nasty stuff. It is indeed a bleaching agent meant to kill, or greatly reduce, the bacteria and fungi that attack wood when it is painted on. It is primarily a "dormant spray" meant to kill and supress fungal attacks and insects during fall and winter dormancy.

White paint is too stark an additive for both, and I wouldn't recommend adding it to wood hardener as that stuff can make wood look like plastic when applied heavily.

Adding color to lime sulphur, or simply a water based wash of color to enhance deadwood's effect is done pretty routinely. Darker colors, dark grey, grey acrylic paint and black (India ink) are often added to lime sulphur to soften the starkness. A paint "wash" is basically diluted paint--almost like water--that runs into the darker recess on a finish, which can give the surface a bit of depth.
 

Eric Schrader

Chumono
Messages
533
Reaction score
842
Location
San Francisco, CA
USDA Zone
10
There are wood bleaches available such as oxalic acid which would lighten wood. I've always found that the sun does a good job though.....but perhaps in different parts of the country the sun can't compete with the rain and moss.

Are you sure it will no longer be available? I just checked google shopping and it's all over the place. Beside, it's really completely benign compared with things like Malathion, Orthonex or Merit/Bayer tree care.
 
Messages
200
Reaction score
3
Location
columbus, ohio
USDA Zone
6a
Even if it eventually becomes permanently banned and unavailable, you can make it at home. Just Google it for recipes.
 

Tachigi

Omono
Messages
1,201
Reaction score
35
Location
PA.
USDA Zone
6b
you can make it at home. Just Google it for recipes.

Yes you can and if you have neighbors that live even remotely close they'll be calling in a hazmat team and any other first responder in the area. Making your own is not difficult to do...the stench is overwhelming though...perhaps if you could put a top hat on it and pump the fumes away...nope that won't work either.
 

Bill S

Masterpiece
Messages
2,494
Reaction score
21
Location
Western Massachusetts
USDA Zone
5a
Bump on this, I just got an email from Colin Lewis stating that 46 states have a complete ban, the other four are heading for complete ban to must have a special license to use, start looking for those last few bottles, and alternates.
 

Brian Van Fleet

Pretty Fly for a Bonsai Guy
Messages
12,426
Reaction score
35,744
Location
B’ham, AL
USDA Zone
8A
Bump on this, I just got an email from Colin Lewis stating that 46 states have a complete ban, the other four are heading for complete ban to must have a special license to use, start looking for those last few bottles, and alternates.

I've heard that too, but it's been a LONG time. I just bought a brand new bottle of it this month at my local nursery, so it's either not current, or I'm in one of those fortunate 4 states.
 

BoneSci

Sapling
Messages
43
Reaction score
1
Location
North Eastern PA
USDA Zone
6
Looking for some clarification - is there a difference between the lime sulfur sold as "orchard spray" and that sold for bonsai purposes? I thought there was. The orchard spray has always been available ata our local farm bureau. Just wondering if it is the same stuff - in case it does get banned maybe I can get some easily. Thanks!!

Chris
 

Brian Van Fleet

Pretty Fly for a Bonsai Guy
Messages
12,426
Reaction score
35,744
Location
B’ham, AL
USDA Zone
8A
Dunno, Lime Sulfur is commercially available as a fungicide/insecticide, and that's what I've always used on deadwood. Smells bad, works good.
 

John Ruger

Shohin
Messages
470
Reaction score
0
Looking for some clarification - is there a difference between the lime sulfur sold as "orchard spray" and that sold for bonsai purposes? I thought there was. The orchard spray has always been available ata our local farm bureau. Just wondering if it is the same stuff - in case it does get banned maybe I can get some easily. Thanks!!

Chris

I think you mean Bordeaux Mix, a mix of lime and copper sulfate. I don't think it's used too much now, in fact I don't know if may have been banned. It's what they used to kill off mildew on grape vines at vineyards.
 

Dan W.

Omono
Messages
1,489
Reaction score
663
Location
Wyoming
USDA Zone
4
Does anyone know if lime sulfer goes bad if it freezes? I would like to order some but were reaching single digit's these days and I will wait until spring if I need to.
 

rockm

Imperial Masterpiece
Messages
9,683
Reaction score
12,464
Location
Fairfax Va.
USDA Zone
7
Won't freeze. My glass bottle of the stuff stayed outide for 10 winters. No problems
 

jk_lewis

Masterpiece
Messages
3,820
Reaction score
1,115
Location
Western NC
USDA Zone
7-8
I wish someone would furnish me/us with something official about the alleged ban on lime sulfur. This has been revolving around the bonsai/garden community for years but NO ONE has pointed to an official pronouncement.

I just spent a half hour rummaging around in the USEPA's Pesticide Regulation pages, and found NOTHING that says lime sulfur (Calcium sulfide/ calcium polysulfide) is a banned, or even a restricted-use pesticide. The product data sheet for it clearly notes that environmental effects are minor.

Lime sulfur, the pesticide is still a registered product in the EPA and has been since 1961. http://iaspub.epa.gov/apex/pesticid...86271::NO:1,3,31,7,12,25:P3_XCHEMICAL_ID:2686

All information on a presumed ban on lime sulfur that I can find via a simple Google search is plain and simple hearsay, mostly in various forums such as this one.

Last I heard, all states but California are pretty much bound by the EPA's registration process.

The product is still available here in NC.

So, until someone gives me better information . . .
 

jk_lewis

Masterpiece
Messages
3,820
Reaction score
1,115
Location
Western NC
USDA Zone
7-8
I wish someone would furnish me/us with something official about the alleged ban on lime sulfur. This has been revolving around the bonsai/garden community for years but NO ONE has pointed to an official pronouncement.

I just spent a half hour rummaging around in the USEPA's Pesticide Regulation pages, and found NOTHING that says lime sulfur (Calcium sulfide/ calcium polysulfide) is a banned, or even a restricted-use pesticide. The product data sheet for it clearly notes that environmental effects are minor.

Lime sulfur, the pesticide is still a registered product in the EPA and has been since 1961. http://iaspub.epa.gov/apex/pesticid...86271::NO:1,3,31,7,12,25:P3_XCHEMICAL_ID:2686

All information on a presumed ban on lime sulfur that I can find via a simple Google search is plain and simple hearsay, mostly in various forums such as this one.

Last I heard, all states but California are pretty much bound by the EPA's registration process.

The product is still available here in NC.

So, until someone gives me better information . . .
 

Bill S

Masterpiece
Messages
2,494
Reaction score
21
Location
Western Massachusetts
USDA Zone
5a
Update, I went looking for better answers and found a site re. mfg. contacts, and sent a pm to a company in India that supplies it to the US and the rep got back to me and said he had many large orders for the US, along with the fact that there is no hazardous materials, and has heard nothing of a ban. So not sure where Colin got his info, maybe i can get some more info from him.
 

jk_lewis

Masterpiece
Messages
3,820
Reaction score
1,115
Location
Western NC
USDA Zone
7-8
These things take on a life of their own.

Before you know it, someone in the Pesticide Registration section of EPA will read one of the rumors and say: Hey! What a great idea! Let's do it."
 
Top Bottom