Azalea preferences

[Fi5ch]

I always see post regarding Satsuki azaleas but rarely 'regular' azaleas, and I wonder why bonsai practitioners seem to prefer the former. Isn't a Satsuki just a later blooming variety with no real differences to growing conditions, growth rate, internodes etc.?

 

[Gabler]

I always see post regarding Satsuki azaleas but rarely 'regular' azaleas, and I wonder why bonsai practitioners seem to prefer the former. Isn't a Satsuki just a later blooming variety with no real differences to growing conditions, growth rate, internodes etc.?

What do you mean by “regular” azaleas? Do you mean species not from Asia/Japan?

 

[Srt8madness]

I always see post regarding Satsuki azaleas but rarely 'regular' azaleas, and I wonder why bonsai practitioners seem to prefer the former. Isn't a Satsuki just a later blooming variety with no real differences to growing conditions, growth rate, internodes etc.?

Satsuki azaleas tend to have smaller leaves, a plus for bonsai. They've been hybridized for that. Other azaleas can work, like Fashion, or coral bells.

 

[Fi5ch]

What do you mean by “regular” azaleas? Do you mean species not from Asia/Japan?

Yes, non-Japanese evergreen azaleas commonly grown in landscapes.

 

[FreshAirSunshine]

There’s a fair bit on different forms of azalea in the forums here. It sounds like you’re referencing evergreen varietals outside Asia like the Girards azaleas? Or are you including deciduous and swamp azaleas? There’s a few posts specific to deciduous azaleas - to can search for thread titles and they’ll pop up. I think there may be less about evergreen non-Asian types but I could be wrong. The vast majority of people use the Japanese kurume/satsuki due to the multitude of single blooms, short internodes, and small, densely packed leafs.

 

[FreshAirSunshine]

I should add - historic usage in bonsai comes into play there as well. It’s a well-established subject.

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

Gosh, This is a real sticky wicket! Hold those horses…!

Tracing back, most, if not all, of the original evergreen azaleas came from Japan/China. Then these were hybridized… mutated whatever.. and marketed. @Glaucus has expounded on this point a number of times.

North American is the home of deciduous azaleas…. not Evergreen azaleas!

And many Evergreen azaleas have come from Japan by way of hybridization in other countries, such as the Netherlands .

To make things much more complicated in the early 1900 collectors/gardeners like Domoto and Wilson brought in Evergreen azaleas, mainly Kurumes at that time, from Japan. These azaleas were often renamed to fit “American sensibilities”

(@Srt8madness) As a prime example the Kurume Evergreen azalea “Kirin” was grown in Japan for 2-300 years before it was renamed as Coral Bells when imported by the Domoto brothers nursery.

Then Kirin was again renamed by Wilson as “Daybreak” and labeled as one of his “original Wilson’s 50”…. trying to steal a march from the Domotos! In a rare case the Domoto name Coral Bells stuck and the Japanese name Kirin was mostly lost in the US.

Hope this helps….

Cheers
DSD sends

(… a bit funny as I’m writing this message from Asia (Tiawan) today!)

 

[Glaucus]

It is because in Japan people started growing satsuki azalea in pots independent of the bonsai hobby.
This hobby existed especially as satsuki azalea have cultivars that show a variety of different flowers on the same plant, as well as unusually shaped flower cultivars.
Only later, this hobby of growing satuski azaleas in pots crossed over into the bonsai hobby, where satsuki enthusiasts started to train their azaleas more as bonsai rather than just for their flowers. Or, they would grow them for both.
On the other side, a few bonsai people also started to azaleas as among their other species.
As a result, even those people that grew satsuki azaleas for their display of flowers started to use techniques developed by the bonsai tradition to train their flower display azaleas to be more neat in shape.

Besides training satsuki azaleas in pots to various degrees of bonsai or semi-bonsai, there are also different types of evergreen azaleas that are styled in different ways as landscape plants.
Here, the kurume are often pruned into very smooth domes. Southern Indica/Hirado/Ryuku azaleas are often trained in hedges.
And more R.kaempferi/yamatsutsui are trained in their natural form as more open sparse bushes with branches reaching out towards the sky, sometimes even forming roofs or tunnels over the pathways in the gardens.

It is a little bit because of this tradition that each variety of azalea is styled in the way they are 'supposed' to be styled.
Because of this, it is very rare to see a sporting satsuki as a landscape plant in Japan. Similarly, a kurume as a potted (semi)bonsai is also quite rare.

Even with all my knowledge, I am not sure if it would be impossible, yes or no, to train a kurume variety to the same quality of the fattest trunked satsuki bonsai.
I have never seen an example, neither have I heard that it wouldn't be possible. Let alone have I hard a convincing reason why with kurume a high-end bonsai wouldn't be possible.
But the lack of examples may mean someone. There must be old kurume bushes in Japan that just scream to be trained as bonsai.
It might be though that no top tier bonsai was ever a landscape shrub in the entirety of their life because if a plant has been a landscape shrub, it can never achieve the same quality.
And that people in the past just always started out training satsuki exclusively.

It is true that there are many satsuki azalea varieties that have nice features for bonsai, regardless of development of the trunk needed to be a top tier bonsai.
However, some top tier satsuki bonsai have leaves and flowers larger than many kurume varieties.
It could be that the more bushy and many-branched nature combined with the basal dominance and ease of backbudding on old wood play a role here.

Despite the very complex hybridization nature, this is not why satsuki are preferred as bonsai subjects. Because many of the best varieties of satsuki for bonsai are likely cultivated forms of the R.indicum species.
And thus not the result of a intricate breeding program. The multicoloured flowers though are.

 

[Underdog]

I only have one little Satsuki from Carol. Thanks The rest can handle my cold no problem. I have about a Dozen "regular" Azalea.

 

[Carol 83]

I only have one little Satsuki from Carol. Thanks The rest can handle my cold no problem. I have about a Dozen "regular" Azalea.

Love the pink ones.

 

[Carol 83]

I have some Satsuki's and I love them. But I also bought a cheapo pot of azaleas from Wal-mart for Valentines Day that had 4 plants in a pot, that I separated. I don't have the slightest idea what kind of azaleas they are but it's fun to have one blooming for Christmas.

 

[Chuah]

Gosh, This is a real sticky wicket! Hold those horses…!

Tracing back, most, if not all, of the original evergreen azaleas came from Japan/China. Then these were hybridized… mutated whatever.. and marketed. @Glaucus has expounded on this point a number of times.

North American is the home of deciduous azaleas…. not Evergreen azaleas!

And many Evergreen azaleas have come from Japan by way of hybridization in other countries, such as the Netherlands .

To make things much more complicated in the early 1900 collectors/gardeners like Domoto and Wilson brought in Evergreen azaleas, mainly Kurumes at that time, from Japan. These azaleas were often renamed to fit “American sensibilities”

(@Srt8madness) As a prime example the Kurume Evergreen azalea “Kirin” was grown in Japan for 2-300 years before it was renamed as Coral Bells when imported by the Domoto brothers nursery.

Then Kirin was again renamed by Wilson as “Daybreak” and labeled as one of his “original Wilson’s 50”…. trying to steal a march from the Domotos! In a rare case the Domoto name Coral Bells stuck and the Japanese name Kirin was mostly lost in the US.

Hope this helps….

Cheers
DSD sends

(… a bit funny as I’m writing this message from Asia (Tiawan) today!)

Are you on a diving trip?

 

[jszg]

Gosh, This is a real sticky wicket! Hold those horses…!

Tracing back, most, if not all, of the original evergreen azaleas came from Japan/China. Then these were hybridized… mutated whatever.. and marketed. @Glaucus has expounded on this point a number of times.

North American is the home of deciduous azaleas…. not Evergreen azaleas!

And many Evergreen azaleas have come from Japan by way of hybridization in other countries, such as the Netherlands .

To make things much more complicated in the early 1900 collectors/gardeners like Domoto and Wilson brought in Evergreen azaleas, mainly Kurumes at that time, from Japan. These azaleas were often renamed to fit “American sensibilities”

(@Srt8madness) As a prime example the Kurume Evergreen azalea “Kirin” was grown in Japan for 2-300 years before it was renamed as Coral Bells when imported by the Domoto brothers nursery.

Then Kirin was again renamed by Wilson as “Daybreak” and labeled as one of his “original Wilson’s 50”…. trying to steal a march from the Domotos! In a rare case the Domoto name Coral Bells stuck and the Japanese name Kirin was mostly lost in the US.

Hope this helps….

Cheers
DSD sends

(… a bit funny as I’m writing this message from Asia (Tiawan) today!)

I miss TW so much. The food, the weather, the scenery.... Mostly the weather right now though
I took my profile picture at 淡水
--------

That would also explain why kurume type azaleas are just so common as landscape plants in older properties here. It frustrates me a little bit as they just aren't sold too often. Thankfully they strike from cuttings easily

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

Are you on a diving trip?

Yes, we were diving off a dive boat traveling around Leyte and the Visayas in the SE Philippines. Just returned tonight via Taiwan. Hope to post some photos soon.

cheers
DSD sends

 

[Glaucus]

@DeepSeaDiver maybe you can even go hiking in the mountains of Taiwan and try to find some wild evergreen azaleas.
Though that may be impossible if you didn't plan for it. And it might require a local guide to find them, though there are maps that show where they kinda grow.
Also, it is kinda winter so maybe there is snow above 1 km where the azaleas generally grow.

 

[Underdog]

Love the pink ones.

These are called Rose Bud. I'll get cuttings this spring. I have lots. Quite a different looking flower.

Karens Kurume