Bald Cypress root encouragement?

[Trempie4]

Hey, happy holidays / merry Christmas to all.

A quick BC question. Had a chance to grab a few BC’s from a local southern VA spot while visiting mom over the holidays.

I was able to grab one super taper stud and another 2” or so straight that needs to thicken for another year or so in my koi pond. Both are currently lopped off at 3.5 feet until I sort things out.

Both of these came from a sandy wavy beach area so the root ball is not great to put it mildly. Roots were long and thick to keep them positioned w very few small roots.

How can I encourage root growth? I have a large tub I can put these in for the next few months in the basement, always cool but not freezing and I could drop a fish tank aqauarium heater in there as well to keep them mildly motivated. There is window light available.

What medium should I put them in? Potting soil? Wet potting soil? Potting soil / sand mix?

We’re here for a few more days and they’re currently in a tub of soil/sand mix to keep the few smallish roots alive. No photos today but will add in the next few days.

Thanks in advance!

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

Keep them in a bucket of water or the sand soil mix, until you get home. Then pot them up in the mix you want to use for growth. Take the time to get a decent mix, once you pot them up, you want to leave the roots alone for a couple years. Many use a mix with a lot of bark. Some use bark, peat & pro-mix. Some use akadama & pumice. Bald cypress are not fussy.

You need no chemicals to get them to root. Just pot them up, keep the pots wet. And leave them alone. Morning sun only until you see vigorous growth.

 

[Trempie4]

Keep them in a bucket of water or the sand soil mix, until you get home. Then pot them up in the mix you want to use for growth. Take the time to get a decent mix, once you pot them up, you want to leave the roots alone for a couple years. Many use a mix with a lot of bark. Some use bark, peat & pro-mix. Some use akadama & pumice. Bald cypress are not fussy.

You need no chemicals to get them to root. Just pot them up, keep the pots wet. And leave them alone. Morning sun only until you see vigorous growth.

Thanks Leo, I appreciate the input. I potted them up in a large bin in a sand, soil, pine bark mix. I’ll be moving them around once in the spring to better locations in individual pots but for now, there they are. I’m hopeful it’s as easy as you indicate. I rarely come across them but was able to pick up 4 over the weekend while doing a fossil adventure. I planted about 100 seeds while walking the beach in exchange for the 4 I heisted.

the best one in my estimation is a gnarly beast in need of quite a bit of long term work, but first some roots are required!!!

 

[Crawforde]

Nice trees.
enjoy!
I have a couple of small BCs I collected last year. mine haven’t dropped their leaves yet.
one of mine was an air layer off of one by my pond. It still has its leaves, but the mother tree has dropped them. They are maybe 30 yards apart. BC are tough, but their “baldness” sometimes seems a bit unpredictable down here in south Florida.
hopefully yours will remain dormant until the weather changes.

 

[Trempie4]

Nice trees.
enjoy!
I have a couple of small BCs I collected last year. mine haven’t dropped their leaves yet.
one of mine was an air layer off of one by my pond. It still has its leaves, but the mother tree has dropped them. They are maybe 30 yards apart. BC are tough, but their “baldness” sometimes seems a bit unpredictable down here in south Florida.
hopefully yours will remain dormant until the weather changes.

Thanks Crawford, BC are so not anything I would have with associated w Bonsai so to see them in a new light (as the prey rather than the backdrop) now that my hobby interests have shifted makes it that much sweeter.... the ones I collected were the offspring of these guys....

 

[Trempie4]

Oops on the repeated

Message

 

[Crawforde]

Nice inspirational shots. I rarely see them like that. Most of the ones I see are at work and are in domes, or occasionally as individuals in a mixed swamp, or near a pond.
when I first moved to Florida I worked on Lake istokpoga for a bit. The cypress along and in that lake were beautiful. I need a return visit now that I think of it.

 

[Trempie4]

Nice inspirational shots. I rarely see them like that. Most of the ones I see are at work and are in domes, or occasionally as individuals in a mixed swamp, or near a pond.
when I first moved to Florida I worked on Lake istokpoga for a bit. The cypress along and in that lake were beautiful. I need a return visit now that I think of it.

Sometimes we don’t know what we got till it’s gone (or hasn’t been seen for a few years or ten)!

 

[Trempie4]

A few questions / solicitations of input regarding this BC which I really like and am hopeful can be developed over the forthcoming years..

All questions reference the orientation of the tree in the first photo with the dimensions.

The branches on the right need to be dealt with / disappear sooner rather than later. (I left them there hoping for some growth to potentially thicken the base even futher). Will allowing them to grow up be of benefit for a year or two?
In that same photo, I hope the thin upright branch at 11 o'clock I buds some growth to branch out to the left.
If the main trunk needed to be chopped (again) where should that occur given the current structure and what's available to work with?
That 12" branch (surface root) near the bottom on the left. Recommendations?

Thanks, Happy New Year everyone?

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

Nice. If this were my tree:

Generally, the smaller branches and the "root / maybe branch" at the bottom I would just leave alone for the next year or two.

I would recut, or re-chop lower, at the red squiggle. Each segment of trunk should be shorter than the previous in order to create illusion of height, (foreshortening) The first segment is 17 inches, with good taper. The second segment should be around 11 inches or less. There is a guide, that if you are playing build a tree, it is helpful. Each subsequent segment of trunk should be about two thirds the length of the previous for slow foreshortening, or one third the length of the previous for more rapid foreshortening. The guide also suggests to avoid exactly half, as 50% increments tend to catch the eye as "obvious man made". But this is a guide. If artistic inspiration strikes, do what makes artistic sense. THe guide is only to help when inspiration fails.

I would also convert to deadwood - jin - or cut off entirely the fat branch at 17 inches. I put an ex through it. It is too thick, you won't be able to use it in a final design. I would probably strip the bark and make it a deadwood feature -jin - you can always remove the deadwood later. But you can not add deadwood very easily. Just strip the bark off, including the cambium. Strip it back to the trunk but not down on the trunk. You can carve or remove parts of the wood to make it look lighter later, in the future years. Key is to get tree popping buds on the trunk and not putting energy into this branch that will need to go. (unless of course you don't like my idea, it is your tree).

The smaller branches I would just leave alone. They are all too long for your finished design, but they will help the tree with getting a new root system established. In a year or two you will probably turn them all into deadwood or remove them entirely. I don't see any of the branches that currently are on the tree being used in the final design. But I could be wrong.

You need time with the tree. The next couple years of allowing it to build a new root system will give you that time. During that time, make different drawings of different possible designs.

I normally tend to try to style BC in the naturalistic style, like what you see in the landscape. But they are botanical sculptors clay, you can create any style you like.

 

[Zach Smith]

Cut off that above ground root. None of the side branches near the top will do you any good, cut them off completely. Chop that leader to 2-3 diameters measured where it emerges from the main part of the trunk (Leo's red line is about three times too high, sorry Leo). Seal those chops!

 

[Trempie4]

Zach / Leo, thanks for the responses. I was on a computer hiatus over the weekend and wasn't in a position to respond or deal with that tree.

Two pics attached.

Photo 1. Where she is this afternoon.

a. removed that bottom root/branch leaving a stub I plan on hollowing out somewhere down the road​

b. removed all of the remaining extraneous central branches except for two with plans for them:​

i. that thin upright one at 11 am hopping it'll bud out and allow me to swing a little something out to the left some day​

ii. that now debarked branch at 2:30 pm will be jinned out in a year or two.​

​

Photo 2. Where she could be some day - I even drew in her knees!!!

We'll see where she ends up in a few years. Now for root development n 2021!!!!!

Thanks all!

 

[Trempie4]

p.s....

• Trunk shortened to 2.5x 2" diameter above future jin branch (and I like it....!)
• All chops sealed (except for the massive future jin branch (so was it even worth it!)) ?

 

[Zach Smith]

Good job chopping the trunk back. You'll get multiple buds along that length near the chop, which will allow you to select the one that's in just the right spot. I wouldn't make my selection until there's at least a foot of growth and the new growth is starting to harden off.

 

[Trempie4]

Thanks, appreciate the input. Ultra excited to pot this guy up in the spring, drop it into a few inches of water in the koi pond, and see what that does for the future root system.

 

[Joe Dupre']

Zach's right on with his assessment. I'll add that BC love as much organic soil as you can throw at them when you're growing them out. I wouldn't even think about using standard type bonsai soil for about 3 growing seasons.

 

[johng]

Although they winter collect BC in Fla and southern La, I have had and have seen zero success winter collecting in more northern climates... I am in South Carolina. I hope these survive! If not, try again during the first half of the growing season....you'll have better success. When you cut all the foliage and roots off it is like taking a giant cutting....and they seem to do pretty well for me that way.

You might give the aquarium heater idea a shot...or pot them up and place them on a heater intended for starting seedlings early... I have slim hopes for them just sitting in your cold basement.

 

[Trempie4]

Although they winter collect BC in Fla and southern La, I have had and have seen zero success winter collecting in more northern climates... I am in South Carolina. I hope these survive! If not, try again during the first half of the growing season....you'll have better success. When you cut all the foliage and roots off it is like taking a giant cutting....and they seem to do pretty well for me that way.

You might give the aquarium heater idea a shot...or pot them up and place them on a heater intended for starting seedlings early... I have slim hopes for them just sitting in your cold basement.

This information is somewhat of an unexpected bummer. Based on what I had read my understanding was collecting in dormant season is wise, and that if immersed in a watery soil mix they would most likely survive and eventually thrive.

These guy are not being stored indoors in the basement but were being kept outside in the elements though not in direct sun. I prefer not to lose them as I am North of their range and where I collected them is a place I visit infrequently in the very Northern tip of their range and I don't see many so there is some sentimental association as well.

These are my options;

1. Leave them outside and see how they do.
2. Bring them indoors in a watery / sludgy mix of organic soil in a bright but chilly window area (60's at best). (1840's house with single pane leaded windows... )
3. Same option as #2 but throw an aquarium heater set to 70 or so in with them.

Any input would be appreciated.

Thanks in Advance

 

[johng]

This information is somewhat of an unexpected bummer. Based on what I had read my understanding was collecting in dormant season is wise, and that if immersed in a watery soil mix they would most likely survive and eventually thrive.

These guy are not being stored indoors in the basement but were being kept outside in the elements though not in direct sun. I prefer not to lose them as I am North of their range and where I collected them is a place I visit infrequently in the very Northern tip of their range and I don't see many so there is some sentimental association as well.

These are my options;

1. Leave them outside and see how they do.
2. Bring them indoors in a watery / sludgy mix of organic soil in a bright but chilly window area (60's at best). (1840's house with single pane leaded windows... )
3. Same option as #2 but throw an aquarium heater set to 70 or so in with them.

Any input would be appreciated.

Thanks in Advance

I am sorry to be a bummer, and I hope your results are different, but in my experience if they are collected and then exposed to freezing temps they are most likely toast. If I read your post correctly they've been outside for the better part of a month now....which furthers my pessimism. I stopped winter collecting BC after killing everything a couple years in a row so I really don't have any good suggestions outside of trying again during the growing season. Try option 3.

 

[Trempie4]

I am sorry to be a bummer, and I hope your results are different, but in my experience if they are collected and then exposed to freezing temps they are most likely toast. If I read your post correctly they've been outside for the better part of a month now....which furthers my pessimism. I stopped winter collecting BC after killing everything a couple years in a row so I really don't have any good suggestions outside of trying again during the growing season. Try option 3.

No sweat JohnG, reality as we can all attest, can at times be a bummer.

They're now warming their toes in their winter home. Hope they pull through!

I'll close out the thread with either twigs or late winter buds! Thanks again.