BioChar For Real.

[sorce]

I ran around trying to gather some folks for this conversation, I hope you found yourself here with an open heart and mind.

In order to Truly put the BioChar BS to rest, I ask that you report findings and opinions, ONLY if coupled with the other pertinent information. Your Fertilizer and Regimen. If you are certain your BioChar was properly and remains inoculated. Your "cides" and Regimen.

Brush up on these 3 threads to continue those conversations.

has anyone used biochar?

Hi I'm new to the forum, I've been collecting yamadori and styling for just over a year now and I'm wanting to start producing my own medium, as part of my work I make artist charcoal and the seconds of them I crush down ready to be mixed wiþ some organic matter...I'm think worm casts might be a...

www.bonsainut.com

Japanese Maple Biochar Trial

I like the deep black of Biochar as a substrate, but it has some drawbacks from a chemical standpoint. 1. Crazy high CEC 2. It emits ethylene if un-aged. 3. High pH But do these drawbacks matter when it comes to Japanese maples? I planted four sapling Japanese Maples I acquired from a nursery...

www.bonsainut.com

Biochar - time to test or give it a rest? Trials

For the past four years I’ve been sporadically researching Biochar as a beneficial media amendment and searching for a product that would be usual le as a bonsai media amendment. There are a plethora of scientific studies researching the effectiveness of Biochar as a soil amendment. At the...

www.bonsainut.com

This is a rather long series but worth the information. They speak about how BioChar manufacturing facilities can't really be profitable without being local. This means corners are being cut on shipped product.

This Feller, Steve Irwin meets Val Kilmer, shows some good innoculations.

Reckon this Feller works at the facility from the first series. This stuff is basically free.

Anyway I have a sneaking suspicion that the Bag of stuff from Wakefield is dead unless it has airholes.
Reckon @bonhe finds success due to wholly organic other methods, where some folks may not due to things killing microbes.

Simply, this "technology" is so old we've completely forgotten and rediscovered it. Though I believe those ancient civilizations were way smarter than us, well no, Because those ancient civilizations we're so much smarter than us, they didn't need to create Earth Destroying chemicals in the first place.

That said.....

It isn't possible to find success with it if we don't believe "miracle grow" isn't poison. Let alone all the other stuff damaging our growing medium.

Fake works, but it causes so many problems it is unsustainable. We should give a shit about the generations who will continue to care for our trees. Or do we not believe they are good enough?

Saw a clip in this one video about how a farmer was trying to change soil pH every year with some tons of lime.
It was balanced permanently with Compost.

I believe it was Dr. Elaine Ingram I heard speaking of how a proper compost allows for the fluctuation of pH as pertains to the required pH of the things required by the plant at that time.
I didn't know it at the time I was talking shit about how pH doesn't matter. Seems it only matters when you're being consumed by the monster which is the out of balance system chemicals create.

The pH then, of a properly innoculated BioChar, should fluctuate between this proper balance because it is full of life.

But is yours full of life?

I like the "cascade" use of the product.

Mine is kinda going....
Rain barrel intake, Chicken Bedding, Compost, Soil for growing.

Trying to find better ways to use more heat off this kiln too. Firing BioChar with my chimney heat.
I was thinking about tumbling it to good particle rounds, but shit, that olive stone is a good Idea.

Char the Chickpeas. Done.

Perhaps this is a product I should get on the Website.

Sorce

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

Good luck on this

cheers
DSD sends

 

[Maiden69]

Posted this in another thread, as it seems there is a confusion that biochar and charcoal is the same.

Biochar is not the same as charcoal. Charcoal is created by roasting wood at around 400 C, while Biochar is done at over 600 C. Has higher porosity than charcoal and a lower pH. It is meant to be a supplement/amendment to your substrate, NOT a substrate.

Biochar vs Charcoal: 6 Key Differences You Should Know About

Discover six important differences between biochar vs charcoal and if you can use charcoal instead of biochar for gardening.

plantwillow.com

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

My trial are posted as referenced above.

Wondering what makes folks think Biochar is a living substance, rather then an carbon rich additive activated by a small amount of compost, or alternately, the constant rain of living organisms in the air?

cheers
DSD sends

 

[sorce]

Wondering what makes folks think Biochar is a living substance, rather then an carbon rich additive activated by a small amount of compost

Lotta nuance there IMO.

Dude says rule number one is to make good BioChar, which is pure Carbon.

I reckon "science" doesn't quite know what the effect of remaining volatiles is in impure char, but I reckon leaving it "pure" is the only way to dodge that uncertainty. Not that it matters, I just been contemplating that. Certainly, leaving wood and oxidized carbon, ash, will have more effect on the pH, which should go on to be regulated by proper life inside if pure.

I think it is best to know what it IS, but that promptly leads to the more important, "what it is doing"

Which is why I believe we should view it as a "living organism", because the difference between it containing life and not containing life, is the very thing that, seemingly ONLY makes it, either very good, or very bad.

If there is a valid concern about this "alive or not" when applied to fields of earth, this can only be magnified in a bonsai pot.
Further magnified if we regularly kill, or even unbalance the soil life with salts and pesticides.

Doing so would allow all the surface area of that dead carbon to continue to draw all the nutrients away from the tree.

This is why this is such a great concern of mine.
It hits the extremes hard, which means there is bound to be a shitload of middle ground unnecessary headaches. The BS.

I'm off to find a video of some microscope work with alive and dead char. It has to exist. I'm totally buying a microscope!

Sorce

 

[HorseloverFat]

This Feller, Steve Irwin meets Val Kilmer,

Bahahahahaha!!!!!!!

"Croikey! I'm Jim Morrison!"



This is interesting.

Pure Carbon is useful...I use charcoal in my garden beds... Some glassy... but mostly chalky. I mix it with fruit/vegetable waste and coffee grounds.

I'm diggin it, and I don't claim to know too much...

I DO remember using pure carbon to filter final excess plant/organic color out of salts made from 2 of a certain plant's 50-some alkaloids..The chinese have a specific name for the substance at THIS stage of the process. THAT'S not important, though.

What IS is I'm very interested and essentially ignorant when it comes to bio-char. I will be watching.. this seems enlightening.

 

[Kullas]

This interests me. I'm replying so I will get updated on this thread.
I have been making charcoal in a drum in a drum setup for several years. Never added it to soil. Now the ash that making charcoal creates I add to the garden to be tilled in.

 

[HorseloverFat]

This interests me. I'm replying so I will get updated on this thread.
I have been making charcoal in a drum in a drum setup for several years. Never added it to soil. Now the ash that making charcoal creates I add to the garden to be tilled in.

Hehe!! I use that stuff too!! (Ashes)

 

[sorce]

My Rabbit Hole started with a "eff it can't hurt" application of some burnt wood with some ashes on purpose. Then I got to reading more....

I reckon my compost is probably overly N'd due to the chicken poo, but I still put extra turds on all the exposed char I could find in these beds just in case.

I have a better made pile currently fermenting with pee and chicken poo. Bout to keep an eye on it and maybe add flour.

Did some reading on Azomite, "rock dust", seems it's from a specific quarry in Utah. Looking into using other pottery materials instead. This Cornwall Stone, maybe Neph Sy, Feldspars.

Already put some whiting in the garden, wollastonite too.

Read the only reason we can see fungal strands is because they're coating themselves with Calcium.

Trying to make sure I'm not the only one with a spaghetti sauce jar full of urine in the house.

Sorce

 

[Kullas]

I use rabbit poop which collects all there urine while its under the cages. Tomato plants planted at the edge of the cages grows like no bodies business.

What is the water retention on biochar? I'm needing more retention.

 

[HorseloverFat]

My Rabbit Hole started with a "eff it can't hurt" application of some burnt wood with some ashes on purpose. Then I got to reading more....

I reckon my compost is probably overly N'd due to the chicken poo, but I still put extra turds on all the exposed char I could find in these beds just in case.

I have a better made pile currently fermenting with pee and chicken poo. Bout to keep an eye on it and maybe add flour.

Did some reading on Azomite, "rock dust", seems it's from a specific quarry in Utah. Looking into using other pottery materials instead. This Cornwall Stone, maybe Neph Sy, Feldspars.

Already put some whiting in the garden, wollastonite too.

Read the only reason we can see fungal strands is because they're coating themselves with Calcium.

Trying to make sure I'm not the only one with a spaghetti sauce jar full of urine in the house.

Sorce

Azomite is GREAT.. ..ALL my soils/substrates get it.

Needs more flux to properly melt at cone 6 in glaze form... I know that...(It only HALF melted, it looked cool, though)

It's found it's way into clay bodies I've made.. but those were low-fire and wasn't really able to note difference.

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

Ok folks, it looks like many of the respondents and originator of this post might want to get down to some scientific brass tacks before moving further,

In an effort to move this discussion onto a more informed plane, I searched for a readable and recent scientific review on Biochar.

(Note there are also other creditable references posted on my thread on testing Biochar @sorce referenced I pot 1 above)

I believe this chapter, part of an open access peer reviewed Biochar book, reviewing scientific Biochar studies to be brief (yay!), informative, and easy to understand for folks.

https://www.intechopen.com/chapters/65070

imho It ain’t new and it ain’t BS.

So perhaps we can get off of YouTube references and into a real science based discussion on the merits of this product? Or not…?

best to all!
DSD sends

 

[Carol 83]

Trying to make sure I'm not the only one with a spaghetti sauce jar full of urine in the house.

Pretty sure you are.

 

[HorseloverFat]

Whoah! Sorry!

I was HONESTLY interested.. and explaining my real life experiences with carbon, as well as mulch.'

I'll stay the hell out of it, I guess.

Good luck, folks.

 

[Maiden69]

What is the water retention on biochar? I'm needing more retention.

What are you using as your substrate? And what tree are you needing more water for? The key to faster growth is good exchange of water/oxygen with the right supplements. So a material that holds water for longer will nullify this exchange. Setting up an automated system to water several times a day would be more beneficial than using a substrate that holds water for too long. For my deciduous that love a lot of moisture in development I am using Bonsai Jack Monto Clay and Bonsai Block. Right now I am watering twice a day, once at 8am and the second around 3pm as that is the hottest past of the day where I live. During summer I may go 3 a day, and I run my system for 3 minutes each time. The top 1/4"-1/2" of the soil is dry by the time the 2nd watering starts. Pines have a 2:1:1 Monto Clay/Pumice/Lava, once the trees go into refinement (none at this time) I will replace the Monto Clay/Bonsai Block with Akadama.

The biochar is used as an additive to the soil in order to increase the CEC in the soil.

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

Whoah! Sorry!

I was HONESTLY interested.. and explaining my real life experiences with carbon, as well as mulch.'

I'll stay the hell out of it, I guess.

Good luck, folks.

Not to worry. Certainly not my intent to drive anyone off a discussion. Just trying to interject a solid factual basis into this discussion.

Thinking back, I remember getting a bit woozy sometimes trying to separate fact from fiction in my first years lurking this site before taking the leap and signing up. Unwinding the reality from the claims of the lastest blinking’ miracle additive, chemical to save all, technique that really works - which doesn’t .…. from the really solid good advice. Mind blowing.

Not sayin’ fun ain’t part of a good discussion and I do appreciate folks efforts, especially yours to do so.

Cheers
DSD sends

 

[sorce]

water retention

I been contemplating a double ringed basket, https://www.bonsainut.com/threads/those-pot-materials.18202/
Leaving a half inch or so fillable space for compost/char.

Don't think this is very conclusive, except for where it is.

Sorce

 

[Kullas]

What are you using as your substrate? And what tree are you needing more water for? The key to faster growth is good exchange of water/oxygen with the right supplements. So a material that holds water for longer will nullify this exchange. Setting up an automated system to water several times a day would be more beneficial than using a substrate that holds water for too long. For my deciduous that love a lot of moisture in development I am using Bonsai Jack Monto Clay and Bonsai Block. Right now I am watering twice a day, once at 8am and the second around 3pm as that is the hottest past of the day where I live. During summer I may go 3 a day, and I run my system for 3 minutes each time. The top 1/4"-1/2" of the soil is dry by the time the 2nd watering starts. Pines have a 2:1:1 Monto Clay/Pumice/Lava, once the trees go into refinement (none at this time) I will replace the Monto Clay/Bonsai Block with Akadama.

The biochar is used as an additive to the soil in order to increase the CEC in the soil.

In the trees thats doing good the soil is 3.3.3.3 8822, turface, saf t sorb, pine bark mulch. I wanted to try and go more inorganic. I went 3.3.3.1. Those need water 2 times a day.. I'm still a noob and my trees are nurshery stock and seedlings and a couple trident 3 or 4 years old. I'm still trying to find that combination.
I have been looking at some threads with auto water this is something I am probably going to do.
As for conifers, we don't really get along yet. I have some cheap nurshery stock thats setting there some wired some not.

 

[Kullas]

I been contemplating a double ringed basket, https://www.bonsainut.com/threads/those-pot-materials.18202/
Leaving a half inch or so fillable space for compost/char.

Don't think this is very conclusive, except for where it is.

Sorce

According to that test it retains water well. Plus maybe do some good for my plants. I have 3 bags full I made, using for charcoal. I may try a test pot with some. I got hundreds of maple seedlings in the woods behind the house.

 

[Maiden69]

In the trees thats doing good the soil is 3.3.3.3 8822, turface, saf t sorb, pine bark mulch. I wanted to try and go more inorganic. I went 3.3.3.1. Those need water 2 times a day.. I'm still a noob and my trees are nurshery stock and seedlings and a couple trident 3 or 4 years old. I'm still trying to find that combination.
I have been looking at some threads with auto water this is something I am probably going to do.
As for conifers, we don't really get along yet. I have some cheap nurshery stock thats setting there some wired some not.

pine bark mulch is not good unless it is composted. Everything that you have in your mix absorbs water in one form or another... I would say add a top dressing in order to prevent water from evaporating from the surface.