Bought J. Maple seeds on ebay, how do my chances look?

Arlithrien

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Let me start by saying I did my research and I understand buying seeds online is a fools errand. I understand buying a cultivars seeds do not give the desired cultivar. And I understand that buying seeds online are almost always dry and have a much lower rate of germination.

That said I am interested in playing the genetic lottery with JMs and don't have the money for a mature tree right now. Also I live in Florida, zone 9B where they struggle and I won't be able to store a large tree in the fridge if need be.

Ok with that said some seeds came in the mail today. They're from ebay so extra sketchy. Some of them are still green/red so I'm hoping that's a good sign. Also notice the ones at the top are tiny, is that normal for some cultivars or does that mean they're not fully matured seeds and have a 0% chance to germinate? Let me know from your experience. Thanks.

267891
 

0soyoung

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Tear off the wings of the samaras, put each set of seeds inside a fold of damp paper towel, place that inside a plastic bag labelled with the source and date you put them into the frig. Take them out in 6 weeks and after a couple of days at room temp, pot up all that have germinated. If not all germinated, back to the frig for 2 or 3 weeks, them take the bags out again, etc. If not all have germinated, keep repeating until they have or you are tired of messing with them.

You can keep these in very small pots a mame, either off the top or after a year or two. Personally, I have a lot of fun seeing how small of bonsai I can make. Starting with seedlings is the obvious place to begin and might be just the cat's meow for you = easily refrigerable.

It should be interesting to see what you get from these seeds.
 

Arlithrien

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I bought three waves from three different sources and this is the first wave. I will germinate and plant this wave of seeds together blindly and will be fun to see if I can identify them as they grow or if I'll get something unique. Currently I'm soaking them in 4 parts water 1 part liquid kelp at ~100 degrees for a day or two. Then I'll pop them in the fridge for a few months like you said.

I live in an apartment now but hopefully in a year or so I'll have a bigger place that'll allow for big training pots or a yard.

Living in Central Florida, jap maples are almost unheard of here as it's just outside their hardiness range. My longterm goal, besides bonsai is to selectively breed ones that can survive here. Whether it's ones that are exceptionally heat tolerant or have less chilling requirement. I want to bring this beautiful tree to an area just outside its current range. I'm probably naive but only time will tell.
 

PABonsai

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I bought three waves from three different sources and this is the first wave. I will germinate and plant this wave of seeds together blindly and will be fun to see if I can identify them as they grow or if I'll get something unique.
You'll get Acer Palmatum. One thing to remember is if they're seed grown all you will ever get is Acer Palmatum or Acer Palmatum 'Atropurpureum' if it ends up having red leaves. And if you want to sell them that's the only names you'll be able to use. It's sort of misleading that they even bothered writing cultivar names on the seeds....
 

Arlithrien

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You'll get Acer Palmatum. One thing to remember is if they're seed grown all you will ever get is Acer Palmatum or Acer Palmatum 'Atropurpureum' if it ends up having red leaves. And if you want to sell them that's the only names you'll be able to use. It's sort of misleading that they even bothered writing cultivar names on the seeds....
I dont expect to get anything unique enough to become its own cultivar, but it's certainly possible that some of the unique traits could show.

This video a couple that collects jmaples propagated a seedling with nishiki gawa bark and pink leaves.
 

Arlithrien

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So I counted the seeds and have 110 total. After soaking them for 48 hours all but 2 sink like rocks. I filled my yeti tumbler with hot sink water, measured around 108 degrees and let them soak. It does a good job of keeping the water warm. I tried to change the water twice a day. After 24 hours there were about a dozen stubborn seeds left so I added some liquid kelp to the warm water and it got nearly all of them down just 1 floater and 1 that sinks but not completely.

I filled a refrigerator bag with a substrate of 75% potting soil from the local nursery and 25% spaghnum moss ground in a blender to a fine dust. I probably won't use so much sphagnum moss next time, but a lot more fell out of the bag than I intended. I poured a little bit of the kelp + water solution into the bag and then the slightly moist seeds in right after and shook it up. Then popped it in the refrigerator. Now to wait 4 months.

I Have 2 more batches of seeds coming in the mail. One is from a seller on Etsy and one is from a website called Sheffield Seeds that I saw recommended either here or on reddit.
 

Arlithrien

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2nd batch arrived in the mail today. These are from Sheffield Seed Company. What's notable is that these are "green" seeds so they're presumed to be fresh, kept moist and have a high germination rate. I bought three packets which are estimated to have 7-8 seeds. After counting I have 10 Osakazuki, 10 Shin Deshojo and 15 Arakawa so I'm pleased with that. The packaging was also very professionally done. Some of the seeds appeared to be developing mold inside the sealed packet. Hope this does not cause issues during stratification. If the germination rate is accurate to their estimations then I will be using them again.
 

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cmeg1

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These germinated for me in 6 weeks!
Sprouting in fridge after a overnight kelpwater soak.
USA small seed from schumacher
$21 for 1800 seeds. Awesome!

the two small trays about 200

 

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GGB

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Well those seeds are the correct size for each cultivar they are supposed to be so that's a good start as far as legitimacy. I love sprouting seeds for some reason, I think it's fun. I can tell you from experience that sango kaku seed will usually have some of the parent color on it. A lot of times small seed = small leaves if I'm not mistaken. Someone may correct me on that one. Good luck and remember that dried seeds may sit dormant for a full growing season and emerge the next spring so dont toss them, just plant any unsprouted cells in the garden. over the summer
 

Arlithrien

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These germinated for me in 6 weeks!
Sprouting in fridge after a overnight kelpwater soak.
USA small seed from schumacher
$21 for 1800 seeds. Awesome!

the two small trays about 200

Sounds great. I'm glad the liquid kelp soaking has shown results as I wasnt sure if using it before or after cold stratification mattered. 6 weeks is crazy early as well. What substrate did you use?
 

Arlithrien

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Well those seeds are the correct size for each cultivar they are supposed to be so that's a good start as far as legitimacy. I love sprouting seeds for some reason, I think it's fun. I can tell you from experience that sango kaku seed will usually have some of the parent color on it. A lot of times small seed = small leaves if I'm not mistaken. Someone may correct me on that one. Good luck and remember that dried seeds may sit dormant for a full growing season and emerge the next spring so dont toss them, just plant any unsprouted cells in the garden. over the summer
Now that you mention it I realize the ebay shin deshojo seeds are tiny and the Sheffield shin deshojo seeds are huge. I wonder what that means.

I hope I get some Sango Kaku seeds to sprout and show the red color. It's one of my favorite cultivars.
 

GGB

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I dont know what to say about the difference in Shin deshojo seeds, only one i've ever seen had small seed. Sango kaku is wayy more common and they always have small seeds in my observations.

If you get the chance next spring/summer take some sango kaku cuttings, they root readily and then you'll have the cultivar with that awesome yellow fall color. Look up semi-hardwood cuttings if you aren't familiar with that process. should have a pretty good success rate if done correctly
 

Arlithrien

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I dont know what to say about the difference in Shin deshojo seeds, only one i've ever seen had small seed. Sango kaku is wayy more common and they always have small seeds in my observations.

If you get the chance next spring/summer take some sango kaku cuttings, they root readily and then you'll have the cultivar with that awesome yellow fall color. Look up semi-hardwood cuttings if you aren't familiar with that process. should have a pretty good success rate if done correctly
I dont have access to any sadly. But I do have an Acer circinatum pacific fire that I would like to cross breed with jmaples one day in hopes of getting a hybrid with similar traits or maybe something more.
 
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brentwood

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Bring you light right down to the to of your plants,+-an inch.. they'll need all the light you can provide without cooking them. If your light puts of heat, maybe a fan? Look for info on starting vegetables inside, might help you not lose any at three inches.
Brent
 

brentwood

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Bring you light right down to the to of your plants,+-an inch.. they'll need all the light you can provide without cooking them. If your light puts of heat, maybe a fan? Look for info on starting vegetables inside, might help you not lose any at three inches.
Brent
Derp. Looking at your lights, ignore me. Looks like you got it covered. 😉
B
 
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