Branch death on Cryptomeria - best way forward

Paulpash

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Hi guys. A key branch has died on a tree i was developing in the ground. What is the best way forward for this tree .. it has some potential (or had) and seems a shame to give up on it. The offending branch is on the right in the pic - pretty obvious gap :(

Is there any chance of the tree back budding (remote) ?

Attempt to graft by growing out a shoot to use as an approach graft.

Bin the tree and move on?

Advice welcomed :)
 

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JudyB

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It's a lovely trunk, would be sad to just give up on it. Looks rather natural, trees in nature don't know about the left right left rule.... Could you do away with the bottom left branch? Just a thought. Would seem a shame not to try something.
 
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If you are talking about this one... I didn't even notice it, I re-read you post cause you said one of your "key" branches on the right had died... I couldn't figure out where you were talking about.\
So, if this is the one you are talking of, remove the foilage, jin it and move on...
Doesn't really effect the look of the tree... nice tree !!!
 

jk_lewis

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It is very hard to make out the tree's outline with that busy background (which I know you cannot avoid) but it appears to me that if you made a short jin out of the dead branch, and removed the lower left hand branch, you would still have the making of a nice, rugged formal upright.

Now, if you were planning to create something like the typical ultra-formal Japanese version of a Cryptomeria bonsai, you do have a problem; otherwise, you still have the makings of a very nice tree.
 

grouper52

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Hi Marie1uk,

IMO, any branch a developing tree decides to lose only adds to the design if looked at with the right eyes and understanding. Trees in nature, yamadori, gain their highly-prized beauty by just such events, which lie beyond the beauty our human minds may try to impose on them. Having worked with yamadori for a few years now, and with an entire collection that half-died when I moved to a very harsh climate for a few years, I just take such things in stride now, and see them as challenges to make the most of.

Cryptos are some of my favorites for a certain kind of project. They grow very well here, and there are little mom-and-pop nurseries where the owners grow them from seeds or cuttings and never tend them. Growing wild like that, they WILL backbud down low, and thereby make great bonsai material - BUT, they will NOT backbud through the usual machinations that work for other bonsai species. Some other conifers have the same habit. I think it has to do more with the high volume flow of nutrients and sap up and down at the base when a tree is growing rapidly, which somehow stimulates the back budding, whereas trying to force it by cutting growth at the top only defeats the purpose in these species.

Your tree is in the ground "developing," yet clearly not being allowed to grow freely to develop the base, which is the usual purpose for that stage of a tree's development. It already has a nice base if I am correct. It seems it may be better served in a grow pot at this phase. There may be, however, some possibility of inducing back budding down low if it is allowed to grow grow freely again for a number of years, but that may be a long term project, and not on e with guaranteed success.

For inspiration, since I think your tree has potential along these lines, you may enjoy the images below of three cryptos I developed from nursery trees here, trees of the sort I was talking about above. The first one I gave away to my neighbors for their 25th anniversary; the second - the least attractive of the lot - I gave to another practitioner at this early stage in its develoment; and the third is a photo from two years ago of the one I have left - looks even better now after two years of neglect, but I haven't got around to taking a picture. These show a style reminiscent of the redwoods and sequoia here in the US, for which cryptomeria are very naturally suited. A jin or break in the foliage - such as your tree now presents - fits in very well with this very natural style of tree.
 

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mc4mc44

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Well, since the hurricane is coming and i cant do anything else i decided to make a virt for you. There the first ones i ever made and i think they came out alright. There both pretty much the same except i left more foliage on the first branch on the first pic. I think there both good options but i think in real life the tree would seem more balanced with the second design. Because theres so much on the top i dont know how the jin would really look, so i just made a small stub. I think you get the idea. What do you think?
 

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jk_lewis

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Good job, Grouper, especially with trees 2 and 3.

Nice virtuals Mc. She has a lot of options with this tree.
 

Paulpash

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Thanks -- I appreciate the virts and encouragement to continue with the tree. No-one mentioned grafting - can you graft this species ? Just wanna keep all options open
 

Paulpash

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Just for the record here's the outline of the tree with the busy back ground removed
 

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edprocoat

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Thats a good looking tree, it looks as if it were growing natural, which is what I try to do. I would love to see a view of the right side as the front. It seems to me that it would be beautiful that way, with the branches now on the left and the little curve at the top right being the apex. I would definetly keep it.

It could like like this natural tree.


or this one,


I find that trees beaten by the weather inspire Bonsai styles for me.

ed
 

fore

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Beautiful Crypto's Grouper! I too like the third one best, but the first was really well done too! did you ground grow those to that trunk size?
 

discusmike

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I thini your tree will do fine without that branch,jinned like some others have said,looks natural for this species.
 

grouper52

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Beautiful Crypto's Grouper! I too like the third one best, but the first was really well done too! did you ground grow those to that trunk size?

No, I got them from a little road side nursery here where the owner doesn't brush off the lower foliage to pretty them up. If your climate will support them, you could probably grow them in the ground as well.
 

sorce

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2011 threw me for a second!

Nice!

?aviary-image-1493467940364.jpeg

Like this as is...

But you say they layer well!

I kinda like this as 2!

Sorce
 

Paulpash

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2011 threw me for a second!

Nice!

?View attachment 143241

Like this as is...

But you say they layer well!

I kinda like this as 2!

Sorce

I have considered this point as the next chop further down the line - hence the slight upward rise of the branch at the very top of the picture. We'll see if I can get better taper with what I have before we get to that. The plan for the next 3 years is to let everything above the 1st 3 branches extend while containing the lower branches As for air layers - probably not. I have 3 other cryptomeria in the ground growing out and have precious little space left on the benches.
 

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