Canada/cold winter tips please

[RonVachyier]

Hello,

I am new to the world of bonsai and have been doing quite a bit of reading and looking around. I haven't found much information however on how people interested in bonsai deal with cold climates as everyone seems to agree that trees need to live outside.

I live in Quebec where the climate will range from 95F in the summer to -4F in the winter. Leaving a tree outdoors in winter is therefore impossible for any of the species that interest me, and the summer here where temperatures do not get too chilly at night is from around the end of June to mid september at the latest.

I have a particular interest in Olive trees, my family in Europe having grown them for sustinance, and I would greatly enjoy finding a way to grow a healthy one in my area. Any tips as to how I can deal with this climate would be greatly appreciated.

 

[rockm]

Your winters aren't that bad for hardy bonsai. Olives will require indoor lighting set-ups for overwintering and will still be hard to keep.

For the basics of overwintering temperate zone species:

http://www.evergreengardenworks.com/overwint.htm

 

[RonVachyier]

Your winters aren't that bad for hardy bonsai. Olives will require indoor lighting set-ups for overwintering and will still be hard to keep.

For the basics of overwintering temperate zone species:

http://www.evergreengardenworks.com/overwint.htm

I was expecting difficulty. I have a cool place for winter, and I have indoor lighting for the spring and fall, however for my winter location I will have to look into that. Hoping I don't have to give up my fondness for olive short of moving towards the south!

 

[sfhellwig]

It is unfortunate but this is the trade off in all forms of horticulture. I used to love bananas but there are few that are cold hardy and still require a great deal of winter prep. I love palm trees and have managed to find one that is zone 6 capable but still has a hard time. I really want to grow large timber bamboo but the ones that will live in my zone are not very large and the good size ones won't do well in my zone. It is frustrating when you have your heart set on something and it just isn't going to work in your environment. I have no experience with olive but imagine you could overwinter similar to a tropical. Luckily there is a lot of info about doing that. It will require lights and humidity but at least making a warm place during the winter is doable. There are many places further south where people cannot grow Japanese Maple because it is just too hot and they burn up. No way to tone down the summer that much so at least you have a chance at accomplishing your goal.

 

[rockm]

"I have a cool place for winter, and I have indoor lighting for the spring and fall, however for my winter location I will have to look into that. "

I don't understand. There are no differing indoor lighting requirements for spring fall and winter for tropical and many subtropical trees kept inside. Most of those tropical species can be kept under the same lighting set-ups all winter.

The biggest issue for you is going to be that olive isn't a tropical tree. It is a subtropical to temperate species that may require some rest and cooler conditions in the wintertime. That means you may have to find a place that doesn't freeze, but is a lot cooler than inside your house--a cold greenhouse where temps don't fall below 40 degrees F or so for a couple of months (or more).

 

[tombeur]

Where, exactly, in Quebec?

Cheers.

Steve

 

[RonVachyier]

I don't understand. There are no differing indoor lighting requirements for spring fall and winter for tropical and many subtropical trees kept inside. Most of those tropical species can be kept under the same lighting set-ups all winter.

.

what I meant was that I have a location I can emulate spring and fall conditions that has artificial lighting, however my cool winter location currently doesn't have light. I am going to have to find an alternate one before I proceed.

I am near Montreal, tombeur.

 

[HotAction]

Go visit the Montreal botanical garden. See the bonsai. Join the club. Take a trip to Europe. See some nice olive trees. Go home and grow larch for Bonsai.

Dave

 

[RonVachyier]

Go visit the Montreal botanical garden. See the bonsai. Join the club. Take a trip to Europe. See some nice olive trees. Go home and grow larch for Bonsai.

Dave

I have been to botanical, and I just got back from Provence, where my father still has a dozen olive trees. I am giving up for now my hope to grow olive until I have a cold room I can set up with my lights. I am going to look at other species now. Larch? Any others I can consider?

 

[TheSteve]

I think you may be over complicating this (I can't believe I said that about a tree that will spent large chunks of time indoors). You don't have to emulate every season. Once temps rise and stay steadily above the tree's minimum temps get it outside and leave it until they threaten to fall fall below it's threshold. Then pop it back into winter storage (the greenhouse idea was a good one). This will save you from having to make occasional thunder sounds when watering it so that it doesn't miss out on thunderstorms (DO NOT EMULATE LIGHTENING).

 

[RonVachyier]

I think you may be over complicating this (I can't believe I said that about a tree that will spent large chunks of time indoors). You don't have to emulate every season. Once temps rise and stay steadily above the tree's minimum temps get it outside and leave it until they threaten to fall fall below it's threshold. Then pop it back into winter storage (the greenhouse idea was a good one). This will save you from having to make occasional thunder sounds when watering it so that it doesn't miss out on thunderstorms (DO NOT EMULATE LIGHTENING).

haha no I won't be emulating lightning

I am going to choose a tropical tree that can be kept indoors during the winter time. Finding an olive tree in Quebec will likely prove difficult anyway as all that seems to be findable (on order only) is what they call the "Oliver de bohème", aka russian olive, which doesn't seem too good as a bonsai according to what I read in threads here.

Regardless, I am re-focusing on something else, a beginner's tree like a Fukien Tea or ficus of some sort. Looking for a nursery to go and find an interesting project locally.

 

[JudyB]

Sounds like a good plan.... except for the fukien tea part!!! They are very picky indoors or out, sulk and die if you look at them sideways. Ficus is a good place to start, however there are lots of trees that you could do year round outside with a bit of protection. And olive are not that difficult to keep overwinter inside, I have a EU olive that is inside my house in the winter with good results. But it would be a good idea to start with an EASY tree, and work up to the harder stuff. Try to make your objective be to have a healthy plant first and foremost, and learn about the art of creating bonsai by reading and working with it.

Nice to have you here at the forum.

 

[RonVachyier]

Sounds like a good plan.... except for the fukien tea part!!!

...

Nice to have you here at the forum.

thank you for having me and not flaming the n00b I deal on other forums another type of crowd and ignorance is quickly tarred and feathered.

I am still researching of course, looking for a tree that ideally has a defined trunk (the ginseng look of some ficus is not interesting to me...), that can be happy and healthy indoors during the winter, that I can put in either direct sunlight or shade in the summertime on my patio within the temps I posted earlier, that can be pruned to remain within a reasonable size, and that at some point develops interesting bark. I have a fondness for olive but I will delay that until I either move to a warmer climate or move to a house with a cold room I have a location that is 12-15 celcius during winter, but has no light so that limits my non-tropical choices from what I am reading.

suggestions of tree species would be great since I am a computer nerd, not a botanist And yes, my main goal is to have a tree that is healthy, I don't care if it doesn't qualify as a bonsai or win any praise from whomever other than myself.

 

[JudyB]

Hey Ron, I'm pasting an email sent to me from Teddi one of the folks at New England Bonsai in refrence to my questions about overwintering olives. Thought it might give you a bit of information for the future. I've also sent a PM with a couple links....

Hi Judy,

We had an insight into olives last year. ( haha after growing them for 25 plus years, it's always interesting to learn something new and not only new but what seems obvious!)
We wintered a few in a much colder house- just above freezing basically, and they did really well.
So, if acclimated we know these to be quite hardy and indeed to prefer a cool winter. (There was plenty of light and the day temps got to 60 or so.)
However the ones we kept at 55 and above also did well.
So it's not as much of a true indoor tree, like a tropical ficus but they can do well indoors- lots of sun is good and a little cooler for the winter is better. Think Mediterranean.

New England Bonsai Gardens

 

[tombeur]

Have you checked out the Societe de Bonsai et de Penjing de Montreal ? (do you speak French?)

Also try Bonsai Gros-bec I think it is 2 hours north of Montreal.

Cheers,

Steve