Cascade juniper, need suggestions!

october

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Thank you Judy. I appreciate the compliment.

Hi Miss vic.. Actually, all soda is bad for you..lol.. I think I will stick to the diet Snapple iced tea. The peach and the rasberry are great.
 

edprocoat

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October, wow, man you have some nice trees! The pine and the juniper are just ancient looking. The one with the diet coke can is sharp but I cannot think what it is, this sounds ignorant but I can not tell if its a ficus or a boxwood, I am going by the leaves, but the trunk makes me think ficus. The first picture is a mystery to me too, I was thinking maybe a yew? pretty tree whatever it is though.

ed
 
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edprocoat

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Ang3flr3 and Victrinia, I did not mean anything by bolding your names I just wanted to be sure you seen I apologized to you both. You gals have sure had much more experience studying under various people. My only experience with Bonsai study was when I started.

My dad was a contractor subbing painting structural steel used in the space program in Fl. We were staying in an old motel in Cocoa Beach Fl., looked like an old Holiday Inn which they now rented by weekly or monthly rates which was right on the beach. There was an old asian man living there who also worked with the space program, he had rented the room to the left of the staircase and had about 25 or so Bonsai of various sizes sitting where the sun would hit them on a bench he had built. I was warned by the owner not to cross the little gate he had made closing his upstairs garden off from the rest of the motel guests.

The stairs went up halfway away from the building then turned left and went up the other halfway to the floor we lived on, my family at the other end from his garden. I would take my basketball and throw it up the top and it would bounce back down the stairs and usually make the bounce off the wall and come down all the way. One afternoon it bounced wrong and went over his fence and bounced down to the end and knocked over an ancient azalea in bloom, this tree was beautiful, trunk bigger than my arm and loaded with small pink flowers and was at the very end of his space.
I jumped over his fence to get my ball and seen the tree was knocked over and the soil spilled everywhere and the pot was broke! He had an old bucket sitting under the air conditioner he used to catch water he used on his trees so I took the plant and stuck the roots in the water thinking it might keep it from drying out as my grannie would do this with her Iris in ohio when moving bulbs.

He came home each night about 6:00 pm , this man looked like a real ass, always a frown on his face. I waited for him and when he stepped out of his car I introduced myself and told him what I done, at first I thought he was going to smack me and he sprinted up to check out the tree. He was actually thrilled I put it in the water and he went to work removing the flowers and the one branch that had broken. I told him I would help but he said shoo and waived me away. I watched him look at the pot and it seemed as if he was going to cry. The next morning after being smacked by both mom and dad and punished for life from my basketball and the beach I was awoken at 4:30 to apologize and offer to pay for his pot.

The old man, he may have been 40, but to a 10 year old he looked ancient, he told me that pot was bought by him as a child for his grandpa and was not replaceable. I felt like shit, that evening I offered to help him with finding a new pot and handed him my $24.00 dollars I had made mowing lawns. He refused the money and said I could help him clean up his work area, so for the next few days he would remove a few pots and I would clean the wood and paint it with a stinking brown stuff that I still do not what it was, seemed like a smelly stain though.

He turned out to be a great guy, he just never really smiled, a few weeks went by and he brought the once beautiful azalea out and it was a skeleton, tiny little leaves growing where beautiful flowers once flourished ! I again apologized and he said, I thought just to ease my guilt, that I actually saved the tree by placing it out of the sun and in the water. I told him of my granny and her prize winning Iris and my plants I grew back home. He then allowed me to help him with little things with his Bonsai, telling me why he done it and working on a small little azalea, which was actually the branch that broke off the tree I knocked over.

One day I was looking at the azalea that was getting more filled out with green growth and he pointed out a scar on the trunk and said " you know what happened there " and then explained that a very " naughty little boy " had knocked this plant over and broke the branch off his granfathers azalea! he then told me his father was that boy and that tree had been in his family for many years and I was the second " scoundrel " that had knocked it over and broke a branch and that now I would be part of that tree, and his family's history, that was when I noticed that he smiled in his eyes.

Over the next few months I watched the little branch grow and he showed my how to wire some branches on an old juniper, he showed my how to cut a piece of dried bamboo in half and smash it and spread it out to weave some of the fibers through it and make a screen to keep new soil from running out the bottom of the pot. I had a lot of fun talking to Mr. S, thats what he told me to call him as I could not pronounce his name. Then we had to move on to Texas and I had to say goodbye. He hugged me and said I was a great help and a good boy. Then he gave me the azalea we worked on. I had that plant until I got married and it disappeared as so many others I have had over the years have done. I have never tried another azalea, it just would not seem right as my memories of that plant are actually of that great old guy who never smiled, except for his eyes.

ed
 
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Randy

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October, wow, man you have some nice trees! The pine and the juniper are just ancient looking. The one with the diet coke can is sharp but I cannot think what it is, this sounds ignorant but I can not tell if its a ficus or a boxwood, I am going by the leaves, but the trunk makes me think ficus. The first picture is a mystery to me too, I was thinking maybe a yew? pretty tree whatever it is though.

ed

The one with the Coke Zero? That caught my eye as well. Azalea? Rob your trees are really something. The first pictures threw me big time.
 
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Ed... Awesome story... I totally loved reading it. It tells me a lot about you... and I appreciate that. My own story with Daniel comes much later in my life than yours, but there were moments of trepidation, fear, and wonder all wrapped up in it for me as well. I remember those first weeks with a depth of fondness that will never leave me. It changed my life in more ways than I can count. I think you know what I mean... again, thank you so much for taking the time to share it.

Oh, and all the weeks that followed those nostalgic weeks were me just working my butt off... lol

With deepest respect,

Victrinia
 
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And don't worry about thinking Ang3l was a girl...lol I did that for weeks... and then later I ended up marrying him. Gotta love the internet...lol

Yours in amusement,

Victrinia
 

october

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Hello Ed.. That is a beautiful Story. I really enjoyed it. Asian culture is absolutely beautiful. Also, It is amazing what a bonsai master and an old resilient tree can overcome...When the tree was knocked over, that event was probably no more than a blink of an eye for that tree. Considering the trunk dimensions I estimate it to be maybe 40-80 years old or more. Which tells me it knows how to survive. Also, the tree in the blue pot is an azalea. That is an older pic of it. Ironically enough, just like your falliing azalea. I accidentally had the hose on jet one time and knocked the tree off the ledge and it hit the cement. It broke the whole back of the tree off. Remarkably, the tree still flourished. In fact, the breaks opened up new and better designs. Eventually, I restyled the whole tree.. All 4 inches..lol... Actually, I needed to restyle it for horticultural reasons. The way the tree was structured, much of the interior would have died because there was not a seperate leader and the trunk actually became 2 trunks going up. I chopped the whole right side off and have been developing a whole new tree for the last year and a half.


Thank you very much Randy.. Yes, it is an azalea.

p.s. The first tree is a yew that I purchased at Home Depot as a landscape tree. I have been training it for about 3 years. Here was the yew as purchased. I think I paid around $15 for it.
yew1.jpg
 
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edprocoat

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This is what it looks like now, i don't know if you can tell from the pics but it has some new growth on it as I have not pinched it any since I posted this thread, except for the few spots where it put out buds on the bottom side of the branches. I will let it grow unless it gets to bushy for the size of it.


Juni now by edsnapshot, on Flickr

ed
 

october

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Hello Ed,
You may not want to hear this, but for the survival and future styling of this tree. This tree needs be left completely alone for 3-5 years. Junipers need their foliage to survive. Right now, this tree is surviving on probably the bare minium. Any pinching and further pruning done before a 2 plus year resting period may lead to its demise.

If you leave this tree to grow, it may flourish and put out all kinds of new growth and branches. Which will give you a bunch of new options. Basically, if you really want this tree to survive and become a bonsai, you will need to let it bush out.
 
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Ron Dennis

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Ang3flr3 and Victrinia, I did not mean anything by bolding your names I just wanted to be sure you seen I apologized to you both. You gals have sure had much more experience studying under various people. My only experience with Bonsai study was when I started.

My dad was a contractor subbing painting structural steel used in the space program in Fl. We were staying in an old motel in Cocoa Beach Fl., looked like an old Holiday Inn which they now rented by weekly or monthly rates which was right on the beach. There was an old asian man living there who also worked with the space program, he had rented the room to the left of the staircase and had about 25 or so Bonsai of various sizes sitting where the sun would hit them on a bench he had built. I was warned by the owner not to cross the little gate he had made closing his upstairs garden off from the rest of the motel guests.

The stairs went up halfway away from the building then turned left and went up the other halfway to the floor we lived on, my family at the other end from his garden. I would take my basketball and throw it up the top and it would bounce back down the stairs and usually make the bounce off the wall and come down all the way. One afternoon it bounced wrong and went over his fence and bounced down to the end and knocked over an ancient azalea in bloom, this tree was beautiful, trunk bigger than my arm and loaded with small pink flowers and was at the very end of his space.
I jumped over his fence to get my ball and seen the tree was knocked over and the soil spilled everywhere and the pot was broke! He had an old bucket sitting under the air conditioner he used to catch water he used on his trees so I took the plant and stuck the roots in the water thinking it might keep it from drying out as my grannie would do this with her Iris in ohio when moving bulbs.

He came home each night about 6:00 pm , this man looked like a real ass, always a frown on his face. I waited for him and when he stepped out of his car I introduced myself and told him what I done, at first I thought he was going to smack me and he sprinted up to check out the tree. He was actually thrilled I put it in the water and he went to work removing the flowers and the one branch that had broken. I told him I would help but he said shoo and waived me away. I watched him look at the pot and it seemed as if he was going to cry. The next morning after being smacked by both mom and dad and punished for life from my basketball and the beach I was awoken at 4:30 to apologize and offer to pay for his pot.

The old man, he may have been 40, but to a 10 year old he looked ancient, he told me that pot was bought by him as a child for his grandpa and was not replaceable. I felt like shit, that evening I offered to help him with finding a new pot and handed him my $24.00 dollars I had made mowing lawns. He refused the money and said I could help him clean up his work area, so for the next few days he would remove a few pots and I would clean the wood and paint it with a stinking brown stuff that I still do not what it was, seemed like a smelly stain though.

He turned out to be a great guy, he just never really smiled, a few weeks went by and he brought the once beautiful azalea out and it was a skeleton, tiny little leaves growing where beautiful flowers once flourished ! I again apologized and he said, I thought just to ease my guilt, that I actually saved the tree by placing it out of the sun and in the water. I told him of my granny and her prize winning Iris and my plants I grew back home. He then allowed me to help him with little things with his Bonsai, telling me why he done it and working on a small little azalea, which was actually the branch that broke off the tree I knocked over.

One day I was looking at the azalea that was getting more filled out with green growth and he pointed out a scar on the trunk and said " you know what happened there " and then explained that a very " naughty little boy " had knocked this plant over and broke the branch off his granfathers azalea! he then told me his father was that boy and that tree had been in his family for many years and I was the second " scoundrel " that had knocked it over and broke a branch and that now I would be part of that tree, and his family's history, that was when I noticed that he smiled in his eyes.

Over the next few months I watched the little branch grow and he showed my how to wire some branches on an old juniper, he showed my how to cut a piece of dried bamboo in half and smash it and spread it out to weave some of the fibers through it and make a screen to keep new soil from running out the bottom of the pot. I had a lot of fun talking to Mr. S, thats what he told me to call him as I could not pronounce his name. Then we had to move on to Texas and I had to say goodbye. He hugged me and said I was a great help and a good boy. Then he gave me the azalea we worked on. I had that plant until I got married and it disappeared as so many others I have had over the years have done. I have never tried another azalea, it just would not seem right as my memories of that plant are actually of that great old guy who never smiled, except for his eyes.

ed

Thanks to October's posting today I re-read this thread. Ed, your story has made my day which had not been that great. What a beautiful story and what a beautiful tribute to a man that obviously touched your life in a very meaningful way.

October, your trees are magnificent.
 

edprocoat

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Hello Ed,
You may not want to hear this, but for the survival and future styling of this tree. This tree needs be left completely alone for 3-5 years. Junipers need their foliage to survive. Right now, this tree is surviving on probably the bare minium. Any pinching and further pruning done before a 2 plus year resting period may lead to its demise.

If you leave this tree to grow, it may flourish and put out all kinds of new growth and branches. Which will give you a bunch of new options. Basically, if you really want this tree to survive and become a bonsai, you will need to let it bush out.

Thanks for the advice October. I really do not want it to grow any more branches at all, that is the main reason I have it in this small pot. I would like the pads to thicken a bit more, but I want to keep it small. I am not worrying about it dying as it was almost totally dead when I bought it and it has proven to be a very resilient little plant. I plan on keeping it that size forever if possible. I pinch new growth that pops on the bottom of the branches, it sets out in the Florida sun every day, and will soon be back in the Ohio sun in a month or so. I have decided to keep the upright part, which was all this thread was about in the first place.

ed
 

edprocoat

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Just an update, or maybe you could call it a progression series of this hardy little juniper.

original post Sept 25/11

Juniper Bonsai by edsnapshot, on Flickr

Last post Feb 17/12

Juni now by edsnapshot, on Flickr

As of today Mar 24/12

juni update by edsnapshot, on Flickr

Its coming along nice as far as I am concerned, I now know I will keep the top part as its different and I like it.

ed
 

edprocoat

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I took the wire off today, after I took this picture! I did trim it up a tad before this shot though.


MameJuniper by edsnapshot, on Flickr

ed
 
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edprocoat

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Well here it is almost 7 weeks later and I have had to trim it again as it was getting a unibrow look to it. I opened up the front pinching some foliage to see the branches better.




cascadenow by EdsBonsai, on Flickr

ed
 

Danilo

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Why do you have all the growth to the back of the branches? it looks really empty and unbalanced.
 

edprocoat

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Why do you have all the growth to the back of the branches? it looks really empty and unbalanced.

Well as its less than four inches tall I wanted to show off the branches, that and I was going for an empty and unbalanced look.

ed
 

HotAction

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Ed,

I'm at a loss for words. I thought you had accepted my challenge. This is not a cascade. Dig deep and find the tree within. An old dog can learn new tricks. You can do this. The truth is out there. You spend enough time here, I'm sure you can find it.

Dave
 

edprocoat

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Ed,

I'm at a loss for words. I thought you had accepted my challenge. This is not a cascade. Dig deep and find the tree within. An old dog can learn new tricks. You can do this. The truth is out there. You spend enough time here, I'm sure you can find it.

Dave

HotAction, I too am at a loss for words! First let me state I never seen your "challenge" as a matter of fact you have never posted in this thread before this post quoted here. Secondly, how is this not a cascade, it is fully an inch below the bottom of the pot, not the lip or rim but the bottom of the pot legs. If you are speaking of the upright part I like it, and in my mind that is all that counts. This little tree has been the object of derision by all here, I have been told it would die, that the homemade pot was no good , funny thing though, the pot was blown off my stand in a 80 mile an hour straight line wind and all I did was set it back up, I did have to replace 3 Bonsai pots though on other trees. I have been told that I must leave it alone without trimming or pinching for 3 years or it would die, I have had to trim it 3 times this summer as it has grown so prolifically that it became one solid canopy from below the pot to the top upright branch looking like a unibrow. I posted back a page or maybe two pages that i had decided to keep the upright part and that was all this thread was about in the first place. I assume you must be thinking of another thread where you challenged somebody to do something, but Dave you never challenged me at all bud unless you have been sniffing the SuperThrive and got confused. I can not understand what your challenge was nor have I ever seen it. This is a link that can explain to you the Kengai, or cascade style http://www.bonsaiempire.com/train/bonsai-styles Here is another http://www.your-healthy-gardens.com/bonsai-styles-3.html I hope these sites clear up your misconceptions of Cascade style Bonsai.

ed
 
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