Christmas Choppy Chop

[Mapleminx]

So now that winter dormancy is in full swing, someone needs a makeover. Don’t look at me I didn’t shape the trunk into that unnatural twist, not guilty on that offense. Ignore the rather chunky top layer of akadama, it is finer beneath.

Open to some tidy up suggestions but I am not looking to reduce height.

 

[Shibui]

Your tree has plenty of branches which is a good thing but there's way more than you ultimately need in a tree this size. This still has lots of opposite shoots. Remove extras to leave only one branch at each level. Best option is to remove shoots from inside bends in favour of branches on the outside of bends where possible.
Try to leave branches that alternate around the trunk - sides, back and occasionally some toward the front closer to the top.
Where there is a cluster of branches or shoots on outside of bends thin out so there's only one left. Obviously choose to leave the best looking/ best angle/ short internode branch is there's a choice in the clusters.
Remove a couple of the stronger branches at the apex in favour of some thinner branches.

Thinning and reducing the number of shoots at this stage is very important. If left, clusters and opposite shoots will quickly cause local thickening and really spoil the flow of the trunk.

Consider removing the lowest branch altogether. It looks just a little low for the height and thickness of this trunk.

 

[james]

This is great material. Whoever started this tree did a very nice job.

The movement and taper in the lower 3/5th of the tree are excellent for the making of a small tree.
I see the finished tree with a height just a bit less than it is now.

To add aesthetic value to this tree, one might consider maintaining the trunk taper. The last 1/4 of the main trunk has little/no taper, and several strong top shoots which may lead to reverse taper if kept.

If it were mine, I would look critically at where to make a trunk chop (where the taper stops) leaving a smaller branch that can be used as your next trunk segment. The choice of this branch/new trunk segment should be based on the direction desired, to reinforce the wonderful moment in the lower trunk. This will help to define the overall direction of the trunk. Simplification of the branches will then follow accordingly.

 

[james]

As I favor a smaller tree, I would keep the lowest branch. It is in perfect position, at the outside of the first turn. I would favor removing several of the multiple shoots at this location that go straight up.

 

[Mapleminx]

This is great material. Whoever started this tree did a very nice job.

The movement and taper in the lower 3/5th of the tree are excellent for the making of a small tree.
I see the finished tree with a height just a bit less than it is now.

To add aesthetic value to this tree, one might consider maintaining the trunk taper. The last 1/4 of the main trunk has little/no taper, and several strong top shoots which may lead to reverse taper if kept.

If it were mine, I would look critically at where to make a trunk chop (where the taper stops) leaving a smaller branch that can be used as your next trunk segment. The choice of this branch/new trunk segment should be based on the direction desired, to reinforce the wonderful moment in the lower trunk. This will help to define the overall direction of the trunk. Simplification of the branches will then follow accordingly.

Hmm I agree with you that it lacks good taper at the top, it definitely needs some improvement up there before things turn awry. Initially I wasn’t a great fan of what looks like someone doing an “elm twist” on a maple but I love the tree as a whole. It’s my only deshojo and I can’t wait to see it in leaf again.
I’ve been toying with virts of various trims and chops but can’t seem to settle in a good place

 

[Mapleminx]

Your tree has plenty of branches which is a good thing but there's way more than you ultimately need in a tree this size. This still has lots of opposite shoots. Remove extras to leave only one branch at each level. Best option is to remove shoots from inside bends in favour of branches on the outside of bends where possible.
Try to leave branches that alternate around the trunk - sides, back and occasionally some toward the front closer to the top.
Where there is a cluster of branches or shoots on outside of bends thin out so there's only one left. Obviously choose to leave the best looking/ best angle/ short internode branch is there's a choice in the clusters.
Remove a couple of the stronger branches at the apex in favour of some thinner branches.

Thinning and reducing the number of shoots at this stage is very important. If left, clusters and opposite shoots will quickly cause local thickening and really spoil the flow of the trunk.

Consider removing the lowest branch altogether. It looks just a little low for the height and thickness of this trunk.

Way too many branches that’s for darned sure! It’s just such a tangle

 

[MHBonsai]

Great material. I would chop it at the black line and build something like this. Great taper in that low trunk.

 

[james]

MHBonsai is on the general idea I presented earlier. One further consideration, which will help determine the ideal chop location is the ultimate flow, or direction of the finished tree. With the diagram given above, the flow/direction is declared to the right, and reinforces the need for the bottom right branch. An alternate, is to chop above the next whirl where I see a small branch emerging from the front, up and to the left. This would give you a slightly taller tree, which could be styled with the flow to the left. Both good options.

This would be a good time to select your new leader, and in either option presented, removing the top whirl would be a good idea before you encourage reverse taper on the top of your trunk. Keep us posted, cool tree.

 

[Mapleminx]

I have tidied her up a little bit today but still haven’t tackled the “grand chop”. Partly because my hands can’t exert that level of force/grip right now (stupid muscle condition flare up) and also becaus as I was tidying her up I noticed……she’s now starting to push growth! The temperatures have been a bit up and down daily in wild swings this winter and clearly its confused the tree. January is usually our coldest month so I’m wondering if I should hang back on the big chop and see if dormancy slips back in .

I am surprised a few of you like the tree, I was expecting a lot of hate over this one . I have no idea who put all the early work into it and admittedly the tree has grown on me over time. When I acquired it it was the best deshojo available to me at the time and while it wasn’t perfect I felt it had character. The only thing I know of it’s history is that it was originally imported in from South Korea.

I should also add that it does have some okayish nebari action under there going on too which will be improved later.

 

[leatherback]

With the current front, this would make a good continuation to me. Tight internodes, positioned on the front of the current trunk (The cut would then be in the back of the tree). But no substitute for seeing the tree in 3D

 

[Mapleminx]

With the current front, this would make a good continuation to me. Tight internodes, positioned on the front of the current trunk (The cut would then be in the back of the tree). But no substitute for seeing the tree in 3D
View attachment 414001

Would that be you asking for more pictures? I’ll get it from all sides and above shortly

 

[leatherback]

Would that be you asking for more pictures?

Not really. It is just hard to judge a tree from pictures alone, and having it on a table in front of you gives you a much better feel for the structure.

 

[Potawatomi13]

Another + vote for tree with many excess branches. Better too many than too few any day. Trunk not bad at all. For once agree with leatherback on post 10. Personal preference is bigger grow container, trunk bigger by 100-200%, taller by about 50%. Pick best branches outside bends to keep unless not available in which case could use closest branch in straighter area and pointing right way. Personally see no real need for the latter this tree.

Don’t look at me

Why not? Minx might be Babe. Happy New Year.

 

[Mapleminx]

Not really. It is just hard to judge a tree from pictures alone, and having it on a table in front of you gives you a much better feel for the structure.

I like your idea actually, I’m all in favor of going bigger over time. I tried to get some more pictures, I know it’s no substitute for having the tree in front of you.

 

[james]

Additional pictures very helpful.
Regardless of the overall height of your finished tree, there is inverse taper at the present trunk top.
Should it be mine, I would cut off heavy top before buds push for spring. Looking at second picture, I would do this immediately below the two strongest shoots, where there is a Y. This leaves you with a smaller shoot directed to the left as new apex. Let new apex grow next year in direction that suits over trunk movement.

Discussion regarding finished size of tree ... consider the trunk, and its flow/movement. There are many beautiful tight turns at the lower/mid trunk. In general, trunk flow is best when turns get smaller towards the top. For this reason, I think there are a limited number of turns left before you arrive at the final apex. Maintain the taper and flow, and the tree height will declare itself.

 

[MHBonsai]

I think that is your chop. Everything above it has no taper and is not consistent with the rest of the tree. If it was mine, I’d also throw it in a much larger pot this spring. You need to put some root growth to heal your chops and grow and primary branches.

 

[leatherback]

Open to some tidy up suggestions

It’s my only deshojo

Consider airlayer?

 

[Mapleminx]

View attachment 414154

I think that is your chop. Everything above it has no taper and is not consistent with the rest of the tree. If it was mine, I’d also throw it in a much larger pot this spring. You need to put some root growth to heal your chops and grow and primary branches.

Tops gone !

 

[leatherback]

View attachment 414470
Tops gone !

Such a shame. Would have made a good clump starter

 

[Mapleminx]

Such a shame. Would have made a good clump starter

Yeah maybe but then…I need to keep myself away from the temptation of “more” trees .