Chunky Blue Atlas

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Just picked up this blue atlas cedar for $50 from the please get this out of here pile. Thinking of doing a big Jin with the top of the center trunk then a cascadey apex with the top starting on the thick branch sticking to the right. It is about 5 and a half foot tall now, so it would end up tall. I figured for $50 I couldn't do wrong with some practice.
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sorce

Nonsense Rascal
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I figured for $50 I couldn't do wrong with some practice.

You mighta figured wrong.

Sometimes that "cheap" price doesn't warrant practice.

Sometimes you gotta work hard and slow to add a zero onto that $50 every couple few years.

If you found a legit Bentley for $1000, would you figure it was time for a crash derby?

Sorce
 
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You mighta figured wrong.

Sometimes that "cheap" price doesn't warrant practice.

Sometimes you gotta work hard and slow to add a zero onto that $50 every couple few years.

If you found a legit Bentley for $1000, would you figure it was time for a crash derby?

Sorce
I love cedrus though and I've made peace with the fact that some of my trees will take time and patience. Couldn't you say the same of someone starting a JBP? I'm not really using "fast results" as my benchmark. I have a couple ficus and maples to scratch the "watch it grow now" itch. I understand your analogy but unless you mean this is too good of material to practice on it falls apart. Because I would surely buy the Bentley. I just might keep shopping for my derby car.
 

Adair M

Pinus Envy
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Wait...

Isn’t there already a cool Jin apex?

If this were my tree, I’d pretty much keep it the height it is now, and just refine the branches. Yeah, I know it’s tall. But, that’s ok!
 
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Wait...

Isn’t there already a cool Jin apex?

If this were my tree, I’d pretty much keep it the height it is now, and just refine the branches. Yeah, I know it’s tall. But, that’s ok!
I like where you are going. I've been looking at it more and considered that. I just wondered if I was crossing into garden tree territory. I do like the big bonsai though, I have a bald cypress I'll be doing tall Redwood style because I was born in California and its nostalgic.
 

mwar15

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What is your plan for the second large branch? It looks like it’s to high up to be a mother daughter. I would cut that off and go more informal upright.
Watch the longer branches higher up. They might shade out those lower smaller branches.
 
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What is your plan for the second large branch? It looks like it’s to high up to be a mother daughter. I would cut that off and go more informal upright.
Watch the longer branches higher up. They might shade out those lower smaller branches.
I'm not 100% sure, I subscribed to Mirai live to do some learning and I was watching the Mirai video on nursery stock choice. He grabbed a near identical shaped trunk and big branch cryptomeria and pointed out that really old trees will sometimes have a big old branch, and it doesn't seem wildly out of proportion to the trunk to me. I've considered Jin or further exploring the Mirai suggestion and shooting for "flat top old cedar with Jin sticking out the top".
 
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Really nice fat bushy atlas. Lots of potential. I would have scooped it up in an instant.
Yeah there was no tag on it at all sitting next to a bunch of trees marked $50 and a guy on fork lift was cruising by and stopped to see if I needed anything and I was like "is this 50 too?" he took a look at the dead top and said "ummmm sure I'll load it up for you". Score!
 

canoeguide

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If this were my tree, I’d pretty much keep it the height it is now, and just refine the branches. Yeah, I know it’s tall. But, that’s ok!

I came here to say basically this. I'm not sure if it's typical of the species, but there's an attractive taper that can make this work as a tall relatively-slender tree. I'd spend $50 on this all day long.
 

Adair M

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That heavy branch can’t be used. The ones you want are the thin ones.

On a tree with a relatively thin trunk, you want either really, really short horizontal branches, or you can have long cascading branches, but in either case, the foliage should be close to the trunk.
 
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That heavy branch can’t be used. The ones you want are the thin ones.

On a tree with a relatively thin trunk, you want either really, really short horizontal branches, or you can have long cascading branches, but in either case, the foliage should be close to the trunk.
Would you say it's worth keeping around as a chunk of Jin that "broke off from heavy snow" or something? Or cut that thing off as soon as safe?
 

Adair M

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Would you say it's worth keeping around as a chunk of Jin that "broke off from heavy snow" or something? Or cut that thing off as soon as safe?
I would remove it. Or if you leave a Jin, carve it down so that it’s pretty thin.

You see, your largest branches should be lower on the tree. A heavy branch up high is just all out of proportion, and it destroys the image. Having relatively thin branches coming off the trunk makes the trunk look larger. Heavy branches (and jins) coming off the trunk makes the trunk look small.

It a matter of perspective, and how our brains interprets what it sees. We “expect” to see heavy branches down low, and thin branches up top. But when we don’t, then it draws our attention because our brain perceives “something’s not right”. And then it stops to try to figure out what’s wrong.

That’s not what you want the viewer to subconsciously do.

And don’t think you have to make a “flat top old cedar” just because this is a cedar! Bonsai is art! Not a replication of nature in miniature. Your tree has a cool Jin apex. It has naturally cascading hanging branches. Make use of these attributes! It would make a great “fir”or “spruce” style tree.
 

Mapleminx

Omono
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Look forward to some updates when you start working on it. As a newbie I always enjoy watching something transform, it’s inspiring.
 

BobbyLane

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I'm not 100% sure, I subscribed to Mirai live to do some learning and I was watching the Mirai video on nursery stock choice. He grabbed a near identical shaped trunk and big branch cryptomeria and pointed out that really old trees will sometimes have a big old branch, and it doesn't seem wildly out of proportion to the trunk to me. I've considered Jin or further exploring the Mirai suggestion and shooting for "flat top old cedar with Jin sticking out the top".

looks a decent bit of Cedar material.
check out the stream on the mirai atlas cedar, thats a good watch.
 
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I would remove it. Or if you leave a Jin, carve it down so that it’s pretty thin.

You see, your largest branches should be lower on the tree. A heavy branch up high is just all out of proportion, and it destroys the image. Having relatively thin branches coming off the trunk makes the trunk look larger. Heavy branches (and jins) coming off the trunk makes the trunk look small.

It a matter of perspective, and how our brains interprets what it sees. We “expect” to see heavy branches down low, and thin branches up top. But when we don’t, then it draws our attention because our brain perceives “something’s not right”. And then it stops to try to figure out what’s wrong.

That’s not what you want the viewer to subconsciously do.

And don’t think you have to make a “flat top old cedar” just because this is a cedar! Bonsai is art! Not a replication of nature in miniature. Your tree has a cool Jin apex. It has naturally cascading hanging branches. Make use of these attributes! It would make a great “fir”or “spruce” style tree.
I'll check this out for sure. I was definitely limiting myself to "native" styles. I'll have to take a look at some options there.
 
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looks a decent bit of Cedar material.
check out the stream on the mirai atlas cedar, thats a good watch.
I watched the one where he was refining a huge atlas, I'll have to see if he has any styling and progression. It seems like even they don't do much cedrus. I believe that makes the ones you see that much more spectacular. I watched his beginner videos on YouTube and immediately decided it was worth $20 a month to have someone actually explain. I'm feeling way better about the 10+ nursery repots I get to do in the spring/early summer. I was starting to think I was more addicted to buying trees than I was ready to deal with.
 
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