Composted Pine Bark Mulch?

[AboveBeyond]

How do I tell if pine bark mulch is composted? I've looked at these two brands and they appear to be the right particle size but both do not say "composted". Are all garden mulch composted? Thanks.

http://www.agway.com/catalog/home_and_garden/mulches/pine/10202313_agway_pine_bark_mulch_3_cuft.html

http://www.lowes.com/OrderItemDisplay?storeId=10151&langId=-1&catalogId=10051

 

[jkd2572]

No all pine bark mulch is not composted. The one I buy for bonsai soil says its composted on the bag. I use non composted bark to cover all of my garden beds. The only place I have found composted pine bark is at specialty nurseries. Never found it at big box stores.

 

[Poink88]

I've bought some composted bark (early last year) but can't recall if it was from Lowe's or Home Depot. They are basically black instead of the reddish brown color and says composted bark. I would assume they are fresh if not claimed as decomposed.

I haven't found them again since.

 

[markyscott]

Generally, when the bag says "composted pine bark", what you're getting is dyed lumber waste mixed with some semi-decomposed bark. I've never seen 100% decomposed bark for sale anywhere. Before I gave up organics entirely about five years ago, I used to make it myself - it's not hard, but it takes a few years. See Colin Lewis' site for a discussion of the merits of different organic components.

Scott

 

[Anthony]

AboveBeyond,

I want to thank you so very much for this question.
You have given me the last part of the puzzle.

Folk on your side frequently claim that they are using inorganic mixes and somehow pine or fir bark comes up as a component.

According to work done by Carl Rosner, the uncomposted bark chips, composts in the bonsai pot and becomes mush in a few months of use.Additionally there are also high or constant use of fertilisers, high in Nitrogen.
Essentially becoming compost.

Even if you are using Akadama at 100%, adding on the composted oil meal balls, will add back a % of compost to the mix, as seen in photos of Japanese folk repotting every 3 to 5 to 10 years.

Anyhow, if you simply put the pine chips in a bottomless container with weeds or some old composted material in less than a year [ sometimes 3 to 6 months], you should have composted pine bark.
I can compost in a small 5 gallon bucket if need be, you just need an activator, something to feed the organisms.

Well, once again thank you, very much.
Good Morning.
Anthony

 

[AboveBeyond]

How important that it be composted?

 

[Poink88]

Folk on your side frequently claim that they are using inorganic mixes and somehow pine or fir bark comes up as a component.

Anthony,

There are some here who use 100% inorganic substrate but others still add organics (like me).

As the saying goes, ask 10 bonsai enthusiasts about soil mix and you will very likely get 10 (or more) different answers.

 

[Poink88]

How important that it be composted?

Composting uses nitrogen. The fear is that the process may deplete the tree of the N it needs (for leaf production). I use a high N fertilizer to compensate but not sure if it is sufficient.

 

[markyscott]

Yeesh - few things can get normally mild mannered bonsai people riled up faster than soil discussions.

Trees will grow in inorganic mixtures - trees will grow if you add some organics. Your personal results will depend on the care you give your trees because they will have different needs with the different soils.

If you choose to use an organic component, there are a number of possibilities - the selection offered by the OP are uncomposted decorative dyed bark. I can't recommend them because they are not composted and I don't know what the dyes will do in the soil when they are released as the chips break down. I just know that it can't be good and it may be bad. If you wish to experiment, feel free to do so, but experiment on trees you don't care about very much before trying it on trees you do care about.

If you choose to seek another selection, be aware that, in my experience, the commercially available products that are marketed as "composted bark mulch" are simply dyed lumber waste with some partially decomposed bark thrown in. So when I've experimented with pine bark in the past, I've had to compost it myself - it took a couple of years in Seattle. The climate in Massachusetts is closer to that of Seattle than to that of Trinidad, so it may take longer than "less than a year" to fully compost pine bark. I've never tried it in Houston, but everything seems to break down quicker under semi-tropical conditions. So I have no doubt that I would be able to compost bark more quickly here (if I wanted to). There are possibilities other than composted pine bark that can be obtained in your area - I refer you again to Colin's web site for a review of a large number of possible organic components, how to obtain them, and how to use them.

Scott

 

[AboveBeyond]

Thanks MarkyScott, I'm reading Colin's article about soil:

http://www.colinlewisbonsai.com/Reading/soils1.html

 

[Anthony]

Dario,

my only concern with the truly 100% inorganic is that you will be in the field of Hydroponics and observations have shown that tomatoes grown hydroponically, normally collapse under their own weight.

So I would wonder if the wood was being developed as it should, or would be softer and easier to decay, the plant also being more prone to ailments.

Scott, there was a great deal of research done in the 50's and 60's in the U.K where it never really warms up, as parts of the U.S. can, and composting was speeded up by what they called - activators.

I think if pine bark, in a say 5 gallon bucket with holes, and an activator, with 2 months warmish weather, one should get compost. Then you just use several 5 gallon buckets.
With all the trees I care for, a half 55 gallon barrel, filled with compost is normally only used up to the 1/2 level.

Plus you guys can actually purchase compost. We can't.
Not feather fluffed in any way, by the way. Just wished folk would use the word - compost - when it is supposed to be used.

AboveBeyond,

normally to counter for the decay of the pine bark in bonsai pots, most of the older heads, use more frequent doses of a weak higher nitrogen fertiliser or stronger fertiliser say once weekly.

The decomposing pine bark is suppose to dump all of the excess nitrogen rapidly, which is supposed to burn roots.
I have no concrete proof for you to read about this happening.
Good Morning.
Anthony

* I believe the humidity of an area --- if it is high for long periods - controls the soil mix, along with placement in full sun.
High humidity and full sun, might need an inorganic mix, that drains well ------- retaining water in the inorganic material ????

 

[Poink88]

High humidity and full sun, might need an inorganic mix, that drains well ------- retaining water in the inorganic material ????

I cannot comment on the first part of your response to me. That is why it is highly debatable. This section however is what I believe. Whether I am right or wrong is the question.

The decomposing pine bark is suppose to dump all of the excess nitrogen rapidly, which is supposed to burn roots.

IIRC, to compost carbon, you need nitrogen, the chemical reaction between the two generates heat. There are even reports of compost piles literally combusting due to it. Nitrogen is used up in the process and there is nothing to "dump" after...unless there is excess to begin with.

Root burn due to excess nitrogen is another issue.