Cork elm for ya :)

[Bonsai Nut]

Wing elm for ya

Well I couldn't leave this board empty any longer, so I thought I'd share a decent Ulmus ulata with you - aka Wing Elm or Winged Elm. This individual looks very different from a cork elm I have, and I really like the character of the bark. As you can tell in the photo, I will be replanting it soon into a large bonsai pot (50% of the way to its final pot) and I will be tilting the trunk so the base is 100% vertical. I will probably have some nebari work to do - hence the large bonsai pot while I work on the base a bit.

Though I consider this pre-bonsai, whoever was trimming it did a pretty good job. Some of the branches are too thick and it needs a lot of attention, but the branch distribution was good and ramification was not too bad. I have high hopes for this tree once I de-emphasize the right side and let the left side develop.

 

[Nigel Black]

Hope this won't be taken the wrong way...

The cork elm would be Ulmus parviflora 'corticosa'

and the winged elm would be U. alata if not mistaken.

Although I am stumped by the fact that your elm doesn't show the
kind of wings found on the over abundant winged elm that is all over my area.

I'm wondering if I've been misled somewhere....

Nigel

 

[Bonsai Nut]

You're probably right Nigel. I got my info from Wikipedia - and we know how reliable THAT can be. I have another "cork elm" which looks very different from this one, so it would make sense to me that they are different species.

 

[Nigel Black]

The thing that trips me up is the foliage. It certainly doesn't have the foliage of Ulmus parvifolia.
The foliage has the look and color of U. alata which is almost a 'weed' species around where I live.
But it lacks the 'wings of that species.

Do the branches show any wings?

Nigel

 

[Bonsai Nut]

No wings - at least not yet. To be honest, I had never seen anything like it so I bought it. It says "Wing Elm" on the nursery pot. If elms look like this where you live, and they are all "weeds", please send some to me!

 

[grog]

I've been peeking back at this guy fairly regularly as I really dig the bark. Anything new in this one's life?

 

[Bonsai Nut]

I repotted him last year into a nice bonsai pot. Kinda boring right now after fall pruning - I thinned him out pretty well and removed a lot of bad branches. As soon as spring buds start to pop I'll post a new photo.

 

[Martin Sweeney]

BonsaiNut,

In my experience, winged Elm develop corky wings when experiencing rapid, uncontrolled growth on those branches that are growing rapidly. As the growth slows down or is controlled, they form less cork and less pronounced wings, if any at all. Pot culture and Bonsai culture tend to allow less "winging" than one sees in the landscape.

I am unsure how long the corky wings last or if they are shed over time. I would be interested to know if anyone has observed how long the winged growth persists, or have had different experiences than mine with the development of the winged growth.

Regards,
Martin

 

[Bonsai Nut]

It's fun to see how trees progress over the years. This one needs a lot of branch and ramification work, but I wanted to make sure I got it out of the nursery pot and into a bonsai pot before starting the detail work. This is not a final pot, but not bad for an intermediate.

BTW - this is Fall for southern cal We don't get nice fall colors, we just scorch the leaves off the trees

 

[Smoke]

I think there may be something more going on with this tree than just scorching. I have one of those trees also and mine do not scorch like that and we have higher temps than what you get in SoCal for lots longer periods.

Have you checked for nematodes...something is eating your feeder roots.

 

[Bonsai Nut]

I think there may be something more going on with this tree than just scorching. I have one of those trees also and mine do not scorch like that and we have higher temps than what you get in SoCal for lots longer periods.

Have you checked for nematodes...something is eating your feeder roots.

Hi Al;

I've had this tree for three years and it does this every fall. Probably due to a combination of heat, sun and temp. My Japanese maples do the same, more or less. The tips brown and dry while the inside of the leaf stays green. Eventually as the temps drop and it gets cooler, the leaves dry out more and more and then eventually fall off. Aside from that the tree(s) are robust and healthy. You can see in the original photo (from two years ago) what the tree looks like in November - just a few leaves still hanging on but they exhibit the same browning.

My liquidambers don't brown out, nor do my chinese elms or cork oaks. Just maples (including trident) and this particular type of elm (as well as some other deciduous that I have that aren't bonsai). BTW I have a Japanese Maple in the ground in a shady part of the yard and it behaves similarly.

 

[Bonsai Nut]

Here's where we are today with this tree. Spring growth just starting. Very sparse, but a lot of small back buds that don't show in this picture. Going to work on developing ramification now.

 

[TimD]

Thanks for updating us BNut.
She's looking nice. Have you done a vert for it yet?
I have one from George Muranaka looks almost like this in leaves and bark texture. Your bark is a more dark grey than mine. Mine was labeled Cork Elm.
I looked back to see if it was mentioned but it doesn't seem to be. How tall is this tree?

 

[FourMileMarc]

I really love the recessive co-dominant stem on the right. Always a great addition to any tree. This is a trait of an old tree in nature. Like an old twin trunk that broke off many decades ago. You see this allot on Oaks.

Very nice.

 

[Bonsai Nut]

Thanks for updating us BNut.
She's looking nice. Have you done a vert for it yet?
I have one from George Muranaka looks almost like this in leaves and bark texture. Your bark is a more dark grey than mine. Mine was labeled Cork Elm.
I looked back to see if it was mentioned but it doesn't seem to be. How tall is this tree?

The tree is 21" from the soil line right now. It will get about 2" - 3" taller as I develop the ramification. It is 24" tall from the bottom of the pot.

I bought this tree as a "cork elm" which caused me some initial confusion (and which is why this thread is misnamed). It is definitely a wing elm. I have plenty of cork elms which look nothing like this tree in bark or foliage. It is starting to develop wings on the branches now, as well, which is a dead give-away.

Here's a quick virtual, showing very little extension on the right side of the tree, and a lot more development on the left side.

I really love the recessive co-dominant stem on the right. Always a great addition to any tree. This is a trait of an old tree in nature. Like an old twin trunk that broke off many decades ago. You see this allot on Oaks.

Very nice.

Thanks Marc; the "trunk" on the right is still a little too powerful for me, but I will keep it trimmed back a little more as I develop the left side of the tree and I hope it will balance out. It doesn't show up in the pictures, but the right trunk leans slightly to the rear, while the main trunk leans slightly forward, so it does not look like a sling shot so much in real life. I need to build out the ramification about 6" on the left side of the tree. Additionally, I removed almost all back branches last fall (because they were all in the wrong spots) and I am getting some nice buds popping on the back that will help give this tree much more depth (in the photo it appears flat to me).

 

[TimD]

I love your verts BNut. I really gotta work on that particular skill.
Thanks

 

[Marc S]

The tree is 21" from the soil line right now. It will get about 2" - 3" taller as I develop the ramification. It is 24" tall from the bottom of the pot.

I bought this tree as a "cork elm" which caused me some initial confusion (and which is why this thread is misnamed). It is definitely a wing elm. I have plenty of cork elms which look nothing like this tree in bark or foliage. It is starting to develop wings on the branches now, as well, which is a dead give-away.

Here's a quick virtual, showing very little extension on the right side of the tree, and a lot more development on the left side.

Thanks Marc; the "trunk" on the right is still a little too powerful for me, but I will keep it trimmed back a little more as I develop the left side of the tree and I hope it will balance out. It doesn't show up in the pictures, but the right trunk leans slightly to the rear, while the main trunk leans slightly forward, so it does not look like a sling shot so much in real life. I need to build out the ramification about 6" on the left side of the tree. Additionally, I removed almost all back branches last fall (because they were all in the wrong spots) and I am getting some nice buds popping on the back that will help give this tree much more depth (in the photo it appears flat to me).

Oh oh, some nasty reverse taper building up. They seem to have a patent on it. I wonder if something could be done about it.

 

[Marc S]

Oh oh, some nasty reverse taper building up. They seem to have a patent on it. I wonder if something could be done about it.

Since I have a little Cork Elm shohin with the same tendency, I asked around some and someone gave the following advice.

Let some twigs grow out, make cuttings of them, let them grow for a year or two, and graft them on the lower trunk to ticken it.

This will take some time, but I think it's a good solution.

 

[noissee]

Could you just as well do an approach graft?

 

[Marc S]

Could you just as well do an approach graft?

Yes, sorry, that's the right word for it.