Cotoneaster

[maroun.c]

Picked upnthese 2 smallness yesterday. I loved the old age look of the trunknon both despite that they're small trees.
Which type of cotoneaster are these and any idea if both are healthy as one has few yellow leaves.
How do u work these ? Clip and grow or wire ?
Thanks

 

[jeremy_norbury]

No photo

 

[maroun.c]

Tree 1

Tree 2

 

[Shibui]

Even without photos we can still discuss training cotoneasters in general terms. Like most species I use both pruning and wiring for these depending what needs to be achieved. Pruning will usually enhance taper but can also have some influence on direction of new shoots. Wiring often provides the finer direction that pruning alone can't always achieve but has little effect on taper.
All the cotoneasters I have tried respond really well to trimming. Lots off new shoots and they quickly develop good ramification.
Grow fast and chop can give reasonably rapid increase in trunks early in the development phase.

Now that photos are loaded it appears these have small leaves and straight shoots so C. dammeri is a possible ID but there are loads of different Cotoneaster species and varieties..
Tree 2 has very yellow leaves. Do you think that's a variegated type or is it sick?

 

[maroun.c]

Sorry for the pictures delay, and Thanks for the explanation. They were an impulse buy honestly and only thought about the leaves as they came home.
1st tree has more yellow leaves but the green ones are really green .
2nd one has no yellow leaves but all of the leaves aren't really green as if its a faded green.
Not sure if they normally shed leaves in winter and if this is normal for them to loose.leaves beginning of winter. I do see new small leaves on the first one though.

Yes they got long straight branches which is what I don't like about them. Not surenifni should chop at trunk top and regrow.
Thanks

 

[Shibui]

The long, straight branches only occur if they are not trimmed. Pruning will make a big difference to shape and ramification after a while.

The first one does not have much going for it as far as I can see in the photos. Removing 2 of the main branches and chopping the remaining one could stimulate some useful new shoots.

The second has more appeal although current branching is pretty high there is some attractive flow in the main trunk. Probably a little too tall for the thickness for current bonsai standards but just shortening the main branches could yield an attractive enough canopy in a few years. The alternative is to chop a bit above the thicker part and grow new branches from the shoots that will emerge. That will take a few extra years but could give a nice shohin sized bonsai.

 

[Colorado]

I would aim for shohin or at least smaller size bonsai with these. Cotoneaster are relatively fast growers in my limited experience, so I would not hesitate to chop and re-grow the branching.

Nice trunk on #2!

 

[maroun.c]

Agree that trunk of the second one has more appeal. Yet 1st one has dead wood and a half decayed trunk, still hidden by a bitnof bark which looks nice. Indeed they are both too tall for current trunk size.
Will chop tree 1 and regrow and ill chopped branches of tree 2 and work with the remaining branch while slowly developing new branches that emerge so I take out the branch I left at this stage..this way I have a half decent tree to look at while the new branches develop.
I can makenthe chops now or wait till before growing season ?

 

[Colorado]

Cotoneaster are deciduous in my climate, so I prefer to prune in spring as the buds swell. Fall at leaf drop is also a good time for my climate. I do not know about your climate - I would assume spring to be a good time.

 

[Shibui]

I prune cotoneaster whenever I have a tree that needs work and the time to do it. They probably won't respond until spring but I have not had any die after winter pruning.

 

[maroun.c]

Had planed to repot those trees out of the bad soil they came in in feb/mar yet with travel and a hectic schedule couldn't do it..it got so bad that water was sitting above soil with for 30 min after watering so decided to repot even if late.
Tree 2 from above


Soil was compacted with few roots.
Hope i didn't remove too many roots
Used pumice clay balls and seramis. 1st time i use seramis and hoping it'll offer a bit more water retention as my pumice lava mix is a bit too dry and can't get acadama here so saving the little bit for conifers

I'll be pruning and wiring next season in early spring.

 

[Carol 83]

Had planed to repot those trees out of the bad soil they came in in feb/mar yet with travel and a hectic schedule couldn't do it..it got so bad that water was sitting above soil with for 30 min after watering so decided to repot even if late.
Tree 2 from above
View attachment 374306View attachment 374307View attachment 374309
View attachment 374311
Soil was compacted with few roots.
Hope i didn't remove too many roots View attachment 374312View attachment 374313
Used pumice clay balls and seramis. 1st time i use seramis and hoping it'll offer a bit more water retention as my pumice lava mix is a bit too dry and can't get acadama here so saving the little bit for conifers
View attachment 374314View attachment 374316
I'll be pruning and wiring next season in early spring.

Best of luck with it!

 

[Shibui]

The tree does not look healthy before repotting. If it does not survive it was not anything you did. Cotoneaster will survive much stronger root pruning than you have done here.
If it does start growing well you could do wiring and pruning this summer. Cotoneaster does not need a full year between work.

 

[maroun.c]

Indeed both trees weren't very green when I got them months back yet one above was a bit worse and didn't recover. I'm.hoping it was from soil and that repot will help it improve.

Tree 1 did get more green leaves
It also had a thick matt of roots below the screen weirdly
Yet soil was also compacted with little roots

Few questions please
- at which arrow would u take out this root in an initial repot

I reported the tree in same greenish pit it came in so give it a bit more space to recover and grow next couple season before moving to final pot but from below pots which one do u think is best or should I still try different colors/ shaope

And initial pot i reported it in


Also how about this for a plan for the tree, as its leaving to the left thought I'd reduce on right side and grow left side. Also to take out 2 of the three main branches on top to reduce swelling would i chose branch I chose or chop trunk and grow new not so straight branches?



Thanks for any suggestions or tips

 

[maroun.c]

Getting a bit of yellowing on the previously healthier of the 2 trees, quite sure its because of the reporting as it appeared gew days after. Any idea if I can do anything to help ? Its localised on few branches and not really sure if cotoneaster have specific roots to specific branches i might have damaged heavy in repot ?