Crabapple Sapling Leaf issue/ Repotting Maple, Wisteria, & Crab saplings

[Hump]

This is my first go around with saplings, and I want to give these guys the best shot possible. I'm having some yellowing on the outterside of the leaves on my crabapple sapling. I can't figure out of I'm underwatering or overwatering or maybe something else. I give them morning sun, afternoon sun, and evening shade. Sometimes I leave I'm full sun.

I'm about to repot all 3 into larger colander. I just picked up some wood to plant them on. Going to be using Akadama, Pumice, lava, and some composted pine/fir bark to lower the PH. I may toss in a little kanuma as well.

I'll take any and all suggestions on reporting, and if anyone has an experience with crabs please hit me with some wisdom on this yellowing of leaves.

Thanks,

 

[Shibui]

Yellowing of older leaves is generally not enough light or not enough nutrient. Have you been feeding them?
I doubt you could over water those in such small pots with that open mix so under watering would be much more likely.

They will all likely have a tangled mass of roots in those small pots. Planting on boards will not fix tangled roots. By all means plant them into colanders - probably should have been done months ago and you would have much better growth now - but I would bare root all these early spring and do a real root prune to set up good nebari then back into the grow colanders for next growing season.

 

[leatherback]

Your crappy just needs a handfull of shit and it will perk right up!

I think I would hold off on repotting and do this in spring. Then you can trim the roots back to virtually nothing on the crabby and re-create the nebari.

 

[Hump]

I was going to put these in the ground for winter. You think it better I bring them inside this year and plant them in the spring?

 

[Hump]

Yellowing of older leaves is generally not enough light or not enough nutrient. Have you been feeding them?
I doubt you could over water those in such small pots with that open mix so under watering would be much more likely.

They will all likely have a tangled mass of roots in those small pots. Planting on boards will not fix tangled roots. By all means plant them into colanders - probably should have been done months ago and you would have much better growth now - but I would bare root all these early spring and do a real root prune to set up good nebari then back into the grow colanders for next growing season.

Great advice, this is what I was looking for.

I actually just received them bare root from Kaden last week. So I've only had them a week and a cpl days. I felt like they were too big now to keep them in those tiny pots so I hated to wait until spring. I actually ordered 4 colanders the day I bought these, so I have them ready to go. I also have been feeding every other day with dyna gro 7.9.5, and some root concentrate, and superthrive. I'm just confused on why everyone is always saying to wait until beginning of spring. My idea was put them into colander now to get them out of those tiny pots and into some better medium than turface, and then put the colander in the ground with them over winter with some bark over top to keep them insulated. Is that a good idea?

 

[leatherback]

You have a store that ships plant bare-root in summer? tbh, I would not deal with them, too much risk in it.

Why would you want to bring them inside for winter?

The reason for doing rootwork in spring is that the plants have the whole season to respond to the rootwork, and the winterhardiness of the plants afterwards.

If you now do rootpruning & spreading and plant them, you will have to keep the plant frost-free (Besides the real risk of the tree drying out if your aftercare is not spot on).

 

[Hump]

You have a store that ships plant bare-root in summer? tbh, I would not deal with them, too much risk in it.

Why would you want to bring them inside for winter?

The reason for doing rootwork in spring is that the plants have the whole season to respond to the rootwork, and the winterhardiness of the plants afterwards.

If you now do rootpruning & spreading and plant them, you will have to keep the plant frost-free (Besides the real risk of the tree drying out if your aftercare is not spot on).

Did you mean to ask why wouldn't I bring it inside? Or why would I? Sorry can't tell from your post.. My intention is to plant them outside for the winter, unless someone has some advice of why I shouldn't (like they aren't big enough yet to survive the winter or something)

 

[leatherback]

Did you mean to ask why wouldn't I bring it inside?

Well considering you posted

You think it better I bring them inside this year and plant them in the spring

I was wondering why you would bring them inside. They are trees. As long as the species is fit for your climate, you keep them outside.

But please, did you really get sent trees bare rooted in summer?

 

[Shibui]

Take a look at the roots growing out the bottom of the pot. No way that crab has only been in the pot for a week. Maybe misunderstands 'bare root'

It would certainly be a good idea to get them out of the little pots and into something larger. The reason we are saying wait to spring is that you can cut roots much more in spring without endangering the tree. The roots in those little pots will be a tangled mess. Good bonsai have good nebari - that's the surface roots we can see - to make them look more like older trees. Tangled roots looks bad so we try to get the surface roots looking good for bonsai. Best time to do that is right at the start. If you just let these grow bigger without any root work the problem of tangled roots will just get worse under the ground.
I did say you could just slip pot these into a colander now (without cutting too many roots) and they will be happier and might even grow a bit before winter but I think it would be a very good idea to unpot and do roots in spring then put them back into the colanders for real growing.

Every other day is a lot of feeding. Not sure what dyna grow is but that could be too much. It usually takes a couple of weeks to see a difference in starving plants so be patient and cut back the fert to once a week.

 

[Hump]

Well considering you posted


I was wondering why you would bring them inside. They are trees. As long as the species is fit for your climate, you keep them outside.

But please, did you really get sent trees bare rooted in summer?

LOL I agree, I always keep them outside. I'm referring to winter specifically. My evergreens stay outside in winter, but for these 3 saplings I didn't know if they'll make it outside during the winter. My first thought is to bury them in the ground like I said, but again I've never had saplings before so I'm asking if they will survive winter in the ground in zone 6b (WV) this young . If saplings don't do well in freezing climate for the first couple years I can bring them in for the winter months. I'm just thinking ahead is all, id rather not but it's something I want to know.

Yes I purchased then in summer. And I'm sorry, they were NOT bare rooted, that was my mistake. They were sent in the containers they are in in the picture.( I was thinking of the desert rose I bought from ebay that was bare rooted) It was going over my head for a minute why you were so worried about them being shipped in the summer, albeit I understand now that you were under the assumption it was bare rooted as I noticed that's what I typed previously. Makes sense now why you were saying that lol. Not bare rooted, that's my rookie mistake.

 

[Hump]

Take a look at the roots growing out the bottom of the pot. No way that crab has only been in the pot for a week. Maybe misunderstands 'bare root'

It would certainly be a good idea to get them out of the little pots and into something larger. The reason we are saying wait to spring is that you can cut roots much more in spring without endangering the tree. The roots in those little pots will be a tangled mess. Good bonsai have good nebari - that's the surface roots we can see - to make them look more like older trees. Tangled roots looks bad so we try to get the surface roots looking good for bonsai. Best time to do that is right at the start. If you just let these grow bigger without any root work the problem of tangled roots will just get worse under the ground.
I did say you could just slip pot these into a colander now (without cutting too many roots) and they will be happier and might even grow a bit before winter but I think it would be a very good idea to unpot and do roots in spring then put them back into the colanders for real growing.

Every other day is a lot of feeding. Not sure what dyna grow is but that could be too much. It usually takes a couple of weeks to see a difference in starving plants so be patient and cut back the fert to once a week.

Yes that is my mistake, they were not bare rooted they were in the 2 in pots upon arrival. Thanks for the info!

 

[Hump]

Just an update if anyone cares. I repotted these into colander. All are doing great, with new buds and leafs, except for the crab. The crab has lost all but one lonely leaf, and it looks like I'm going to lose it too. I don't know what I'm doing wrong there.

I included pics of all of my hoard, even a Crabtree I found at Walmart recently for $10 that I had them cut on site before I'd buy it lol. I had my car anyways. It's not the right time for a trunk chop on this, but for 10 bucks I figured why not see if it can make it. I'll be waiting for next spring to see if it survives.

 

[Hump]

Continued: pretty rag tag group, and a couple bougs need repotted. When I got them they came with very loose soil and were tipping over, so I put them in bigger pots and filled in some soil just to hold them down in the mean time.

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

Nice little collection. Time and growth will bring them along.

August is a bit late to do trunk chops on crabapple trees, autumn and winter are only 10 weeks or so away. But you might get away with it. We'll see what happens. In the future, heaving pruning should happen earlier in summer, like late June through July. Not much later than July though.

 

[Hump]

Thanks man. Yeah I'm hoping the Walmart crab makes it, but if not it was just 10 bucks. They had a couple of then dying in the corner on sale. The crab sapling I dunno why, but going to keep babying it. Love the info on timing. I are you talking about hard pruning June - July as in the branches or root?