Crabapple 'Sugar Tyme' for Air Layering

[Solaris]

Shortly after the wife made the mistake of letting slip that the garden center had opened up at the Meijer she works at, I came toddling out with this fellow in hand. I plan on air layering it into several trees to make a sort of forest planting. It's in the running for my Not a Contest entry, especially if the varmints keep eating the maple's bark. I apologize for the picture's backdrop, but there is probably no better location for photography in my apartment. It's not apparent from the picture, but the leaves are just beginning to break bud.
Don't tell the wife; I caught her sniffing around the apple seedlings, and apparently she's taken the notion into her noggin that that's something she wants to do.


I haven't uncovered the root flare yet, because that's going to be a project and I suspect I want to leave the roots entirely undisturbed while I'm chopping the top of the plant off in sections. It's grafted, of course, but it has a hint of a taper that I might be able to work with... maybe. I think what's more likely is this will, assuming it survives having its top air-layered off of it, become a mother tree that I get more cuttings and layers off of in the future.

I'd appreciate some suggestions on where you'd do the layers. I already have some ideas and have been playing around with it on GIMP, but I'd like to hear what people who've actually done this before have to say.

 

[Soldano666]

especially if the varmints keep eating the maple's bark. .

Bad news.... They like Malus just as much if not more than maples...

 

[leatherback]

Many apples & crapapple are grafted. So check that before you start layering low.

 

[Solaris]

Bad news.... They like Malus just as much if not more than maples...

Not if they know what's good for them, they don't. They start taking chomps out of my Malus twigs, I'mma go Caddyshack on them varmints.
The little bastards have already gnawed their way halfway around the maple. I've been entirely too lax on putting up de fenses.

Many apples & crapapple are grafted. So check that before you start layering low.

Checked it when I bought it. It's grafted. The line between scion and shoot is immediately apparent, but if the bark corks up like it should - and they're similar enough - it may not remain so in a couple-few years' time.
How useful its base is also depends on how high up the stem it was grafted; I dug down a couple inches and didn't hit root flare.

 

[Stan Kengai]

As Leatherback said, being a nursery tree, it is likely grafted. That said, this variety can be propagated via cuttings (from personal experience), and would likely layer easily.

 

[Solaris]

That bodes well. I'm terrible with cuttings, but the peach and pear air layers I did over at my step-sister's did well enough.

If I read BNut's article correctly, I should wait until after the leaves have emerged and hardened off before I get to work. However, I've read that buds produce more auxins than mature leaves do, and it's the auxins that will be convincing the plant to do what I want. Which ought I go with?

This image is basically what I'm looking at doing. All of the cuts are being made just below internodes, with branches near the top of the layer to support it and provide a new leader to work with.
#1 will probably be a workable tree the soonest. If the branches lower down survive the layer, I'm going to use them as sacrifice branches. There are three branches at the top, all coming out more or less at the same point. I'll need to get rid of one or two of those. Hopefully, its lack of decent taper will be forgivable when planted in a forest setting and surrounded by other trees. This one provides more immediate gratification, but I don't see a whole lot of potential to develop it much beyond what it is right now. Unless the sacrifice branches work out really, really well, I'll be mainly focusing on developing the roots and then getting ramification out of the branching.
#2 will be a relatively small tree to start off with, which works with the idea for the forest planting. I'm going to use the branch coming off of it as a new leader. It has more development and, as-is, more potential for development than #1.
#3 is like #2, but I have to decide whether I want to be longer or shorter (hence the question mark to your left). On the one hand, a longer trunk provides it more resources to work with. On the other hand, I'm probably going to wind up chopping a lot of that off, anyways, and have no guarantees that it will backbud if I take off the branches.
#4 is another smaller one, but it has two branches coming out more or less at the same point on your right. There's a question mark pointing to them. One of the branches looks like it's a water sprout (growing straight up from the other branch), so that will probably be the one to go. Like #3, I have the option of making it much longer but I'm not sure if that will be advantageous.
Nothing south of #4 looks like it's worth much of anything right now. If it pops new branches during the layering process, then it'll have something I can work with. Hopefully it does; four trees does not a forest make. I do have some other apple seedlings going, but I'd be better off trying to layer one of the excess branches to make a fifth than go that route.

 

[kmaho]

If you want to keep this as a mother tree, I wouldn't do #4. From my understanding you need the branches below your layer to keep the mother trees roots alive. I'd also do some research if you haven't already on if you could take these at once or if you need to do one at a time. I'd be hesitant personally do more than one of these per season because haven't looked into doing multiple grafts at once so I'm not sure such a small tree could handle it.

 

[leatherback]

To be honest, I think you are overly optimistic. Wait for leaves to form and I think you will realize you are thinking way too small trees for the leaves. But me, I like mu trunks big.

 

[Nybonsai12]

To be honest, I think you are overly optimistic. Wait for leaves to form and I think you will realize you are thinking way too small trees for the leaves. But me, I like mu trunks big.

Crabapples won't really make a convincing forest either. They are best known for flowers and fruit, two things which typically aren't present in forest bonsai. Giga had a thread where he chopped one of these garden center crabs down and made a little something out of nothing.

 

[Solaris]

If you want to keep this as a mother tree, I wouldn't do #4. From my understanding you need the branches below your layer to keep the mother trees roots alive. I'd also do some research if you haven't already on if you could take these at once or if you need to do one at a time. I'd be hesitant personally do more than one of these per season because haven't looked into doing multiple grafts at once so I'm not sure such a small tree could handle it.

I'm thinking I like the idea of not doing #4. It also solves the problem of an even number of trees.
I figured that leaving it without branches would work rather like doing an uncommonly stressful trunk chop. I see a sucker coming up from the roots, though, which will hurt the chances of the top surviving.

From my reading, simultaneous multiple layers like this can be successful if there are terminal buds on the segments - and each of the segments I'd picked out has a branch. I haven't found a whole lot in the lay literature I've been perusing on the topic. Unless someone can turn up a definite yea or nay, I'd much rather find out the hard way that it doesn't work using a cheap, mass-produced tree than on something special.

To be honest, I think you are overly optimistic. Wait for leaves to form and I think you will realize you are thinking way too small trees for the leaves. But me, I like mu trunks big.

Yes, very overly optimistic. I went out and re-measured the tree. It's nowhere near thick enough to do anything with. It's around half an inch or so across (that's about two centimeters) at the top portion of it. Learn me to eyeball things rather than use a proper ruler; I thought it was twice that. That pretty thoroughly torpedoes my plans for it, at least until it gets a lot bigger. Ah, well. At least it can still pollinate my apple trees.
I hadn't thought of it, but you're right; I do need to check the leaf size before I get too far into anything. If it's like my domestic apple cultivars, it'll need serious reduction to be credible as a bonsai smaller than me. I've read that crabs don't like to develop much ramification, either, which - if I'm not mistaken - is where most of the leaf reduction comes from.

Crabapples won't really make a convincing forest either. They are best known for flowers and fruit, two things which typically aren't present in forest bonsai.

That would explain why I haven't been able to turn up a picture of a crabapple forest. Why aren't flowers or fruit typically present in forest bonsai? I've been pondering that since you posted it, and all I've really come up with is that it can look over-gaudy. They flower for all of a couple of weeks, though, so...

Giga had a thread where he chopped one of these garden center crabs down and made a little something out of nothing.

You're talking about the $.63 thread? That's a pretty neat little tree. I particularly liked what he did with the chopped part; trees with hollows appeal to me.

 

[Nybonsai12]

Why aren't flowers or fruit typically present in forest bonsai? I've been pondering that since you posted it, and all I've really come up with is that it can look over-gaudy.

You're talking about the $.63 thread? That's a pretty neat little tree. I particularly liked what he did with the chopped part; trees with hollows appeal to me.

One of the reasons is the size of the Fruit and flowers. They just won’t be the right scale when trying to convey the image of an old forest. Crabs are also harder to ramifiy so getting that twiggy look out of leaf is also harder. And yes that was the giga thread I was referring to. Mach5 had a wonderful little crab also with some neat carving in it as well, not sure if the thread is still around. Fruits looked like maraschino cherries!

Edit:found it
https://bonsainut.com/threads/shohin-crabapple-with-fruit.9245/

 

[leatherback]

Unless someone can turn up a definite yea or nay,

Layering works on segments above eachother as long as there is plenty of grown o eag segment.. I have done it on maples.

 

[Solaris]

One of the reasons is the size of the Fruit and flowers. They just won’t be the right scale when trying to convey the image of an old forest. Crabs are also harder to ramifiy so getting that twiggy look out of leaf is also harder. And yes that was the giga thread I was referring to. Mach5 had a wonderful little crab also with some neat carving in it as well, not sure if the thread is still around. Fruits looked like maraschino cherries!

Edit:found it
https://bonsainut.com/threads/shohin-crabapple-with-fruit.9245/

I see what you mean about the ramification. Crabs really, really want to have chunky twigs.
What I'm thinking about doing now is layering it off above the bottom branches (to keep the bottom part alive), and then sticking the top part into a grow box to thicken up some more. It's going to have to happen, what with the lowest branch being some eighteen inches off of the ground. I'd do it the other way around, but 1) I'd rather do something with one of my trees this year rather than just watch them photosynthesize and 2) I think that starting training the roots sooner rather than later would be a good thing. I'll wait until after it's pushed its leaves all the way out and the danger of frost has mostly passed before I start in on the layering. If I'm not mistaken, mature leaves take insults like that better.

Mach5's tree might be a Sugar Tyme (or seedling thereof); they have really bright red fruit like that. It's part of what attracted me to the cultivar.

Layering works on segments above eachother as long as there is plenty of grown o eag segment.. I have done it on maples.

Cool! Thank you.

 

[MACH5]

Here it is in flower and in fruit. These are old photos. The tree is now being completely remade.

 

[erb.75]

Crabapples won't really make a convincing forest either. They are best known for flowers and fruit, two things which typically aren't present in forest bonsai. Giga had a thread where he chopped one of these garden center crabs down and made a little something out of nothing.

disagree on forest comment

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

disagree on forest comment

In that case, you’re making an orchard.?

 

[Silentrunning]

Last week I bought a flowering Crab Apple at the local Food Lion store. It was just starting to bud and looked very healthy. The rootball was tightly encased in a heavy plastic and felt very solid. The instructions said to remove the plastic but leave the burlap intact around the rootball. Unfortunately when I removed the plastic everything around the roots fell apart. The burlap was nonexistent and the soil was little more than wood chips. Instead of potting it and doing any work on it, I dug a hole, ammended it with compost and planted the tree. The roots were completely bare so I staked and tied off the tree to prevent any movement. I am hoping it will live and I may just leave it in the ground rather than work on it. I will be a little more careful in the future where I buy my stock.

 

[_#1_]

The roots were completely bare

I think this is what you would want when buying stock in the spring. Half the work already done (bare rooting) when buds about to pop. Your crab should be very happy and grow well for you.

I bought 3 red flower crabs last fall at clearance for $6.50 ea. And had to bare root them for repot in grow box last week. Took off like 90% roots while the leaf where forming so now my fingers crossed for them to pull through. Them leaves are getting bigger and extending so that's good news. But I think your tree is perfectly fine.

The crabapple leaf extending...

 

[Solaris]

Last week I bought a flowering Crab Apple at the local Food Lion store. It was just starting to bud and looked very healthy. The rootball was tightly encased in a heavy plastic and felt very solid. The instructions said to remove the plastic but leave the burlap intact around the rootball. Unfortunately when I removed the plastic everything around the roots fell apart. The burlap was nonexistent and the soil was little more than wood chips. Instead of potting it and doing any work on it, I dug a hole, ammended it with compost and planted the tree. The roots were completely bare so I staked and tied off the tree to prevent any movement. I am hoping it will live and I may just leave it in the ground rather than work on it. I will be a little more careful in the future where I buy my stock.

Was the tree still dormant?
It probably doesn't matter. I've pulled up some of my apple trees - leaves out, not at all dormant, mind you - hacked off most of their roots, and put them into a pond basket. They're still alive, and it isn't because of my horticultural skill. Hell, one of them put on over eighteen inches of growth that same season. They're doing better than trees I've actually taken good care of. Once they get over the "I'm a seedling, watch me die just because I can!" phase (which I suspect is due to their extreme heterozygosity and accounts for how widespread they've become, as natural selection ensures that only those suitable to an environment survive and the wide spread of traits ensures that one of them will be suited to the environment), these things are really, really hard to kill.