Deciduous vs evergreen oaks from seed

[It's Kev]

I’ve imported some acorns because oaks aren’t native here and seems like they don’t appeal much to Chinese culture either.

I’m experimenting with 2 very different oaks that I’ve come across. On the right I’m guessing it’s some sort of English or European oak from a tree in Milan (it was nighttime, tree was too poorly lit for a pic and winter, so no leaves to use as a guide for ID) and on the right is a Holm oak ( I saw it in the daytime in Verona, it was sunny so it was easy to see them holly pointy leaves)

So then I planted them in early Feb, Holm oak started to show first signs of growth 2 weeks later


After said rainstorm I put some leaf litter in my pots to protect from soil getting washed away and also to protect from potential dry winds since I’m on a balcony.
So, fast forward another week, Holm oak grew this much and then stopped. No leaves and no change in more than 7 days after this...


However, as for the other, it sprouted 3 days ago, it gets taller every day and showed evidence of leaves since it popped out the ground

Does the evergreen grow slower because it gets to have leaves all year round? I know the overall growth rate of deciduous trees are faster but didn’t think it would be from the point of germination, or am I being stupid?

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

Holm oaks are a bit slower at the start. Half of mine germinated and never got beyond that point due to mice and birds digging them up. The ones that did make it are exactly where I expected them to be after a year: 5-8 sets of leafs, a couple of inches tall.
They should grow faster this year.

 

[Potawatomi13]

First acorn looks like sprout damaged. Wait and maybe can grow branch from sprout. No Idea why one type grows faster except maybe temperature.

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

Your 'evergreen oak' with holly like pointed leaves could be cork oak. Quercus suber. The cork oak has the elongated acorns, much like the acorns in your photo. The bark develops relatively young, it is a good one for bonsai.

 

[It's Kev]

That’s reassuring @Wires_Guy_wires , let’s hope for the best @Potawatomi13
And @Leo in N E Illinois I’ll be over the moon with that to have a cork bark anything because cork bark variety of trees are hard to find here

 

[It's Kev]

Ok, here we go, this amount of days later

unidentified deciduous oak got thrown into a bigger pot, just chucked the acorns that didn’t germinate in there as well, maybe they grow, maybe earthworms will process them
I see the leaves are gigantic but at this point I don’t give a toss, an oak tree is what I want so an oak tree I shall have


as for the Holm oak, @Potawatomi13 was right, it got damaged somehow, but it’s back and growing. I’ll leave it for a couple of weeks until I throw this into another big pot

its recovered fine and well, but for a while it’s gonna look like I did a trunk chop on a day old sapling

 

[It's Kev]

2 of these sprouted, I don’t need or have space for 2. Can I tie them together after the end of the 1st year? Will they fuse?

 

[BrianBay9]

2 of these sprouted, I don’t need or have space for 2. Can I tie them together after the end of the 1st year? Will they fuse?

I'm trying that experiment with tan oak and coast live oak. I guess we'll find out together.

 

[Gustavo Martins]

2 of these sprouted, I don’t need or have space for 2. Can I tie them together after the end of the 1st year? Will they fuse?
View attachment 306306

These look a lot like my Holm oak. They grow quite fast here sending three flushes of growth per year

 

[It's Kev]

@Gustavo Martins as it grows up I was actually hoping it’s cork. Would be nice to have a cork bark variety of something

@BrianBay9 I reckon we should scrape the stems where the 2 side would touch before tying them together, almost like grafting them together I think.
Just bear in mind that all my experience with oaks are all on this post, however, I can’t imagine them enveloping things the way a focus or trident maple would. But again, the guys who live in oaks native habitat should correct me on this

 

[BrianBay9]

@Gustavo Martins as it grows up I was actually hoping it’s cork. Would be nice to have a cork bark variety of something

@BrianBay9 I reckon we should scrape the stems where the 2 side would touch before tying them together, almost like grafting them together I think.
Just bear in mind that all my experience with oaks are all on this post, however, I can’t imagine them enveloping things the way a focus or trident maple would. But again, the guys who live in oaks native habitat should correct me on this

I have seen coast live oak (Q agrifolia) with fused trunks in the forest near me. Not common but it happens.

 

[Gustavo Martins]

@Gustavo Martins as it grows up I was actually hoping it’s cork. Would be nice to have a cork bark variety of something

@BrianBay9 I reckon we should scrape the stems where the 2 side would touch before tying them together, almost like grafting them together I think.
Just bear in mind that all my experience with oaks are all on this post, however, I can’t imagine them enveloping things the way a focus or trident maple would. But again, the guys who live in oaks native habitat should correct me on this

They don’t Cork as Q. suber, but still have a really nice bark. At least when they are old. Mine is still 3yr old from acorn. Just plain smooth bark so far.

 

[oddirt]

Does the evergreen grow slower because it gets to have leaves all year round? I know the overall growth rate of deciduous trees are faster but didn’t think it would be from the point of germination, or am I being stupid?

Around my area, we have deciduous and evergreen oaks (eg, Q lobata, Q garryana and Q kelloggii versus Q agrifolia, Q berberidifolia, Q durata and Q douglasii). I’m with an organization that does conservation and restoration work—we even have a project called “Save the Oaks.”

The deciduous oaks grow in areas with water more readily accessible to them (high water table or substrate that holds water bettee). The evergreens grow in areas where they’ve got to spend a lot more energy putting down a deep root system. They evolved in this summer-dry climate where they go half the year without rain, so they dry out if they don’t get their taproot deep enough. Once they get their taproot down, they add a lot more top growth and catch up to the deciduous oaks.

Not sure if that’s what’s at play with your seedlings, but just thought I’d share that.

 

[BrianBay9]

I'm trying that experiment with tan oak and coast live oak. I guess we'll find out together.

OK, I've been growing these clumps for two years now, and today I had a look at them. I did three clumps of Q agrifolia (coast live oak) seedlings, and one clump of tan oak (Notholithocarpus). For each I used zip ties to hold the base of the trunks together, and just let them grow. First, the agrifolia:

Two out of three held together when the zip ties were removed. The ties left marks in the trunks, but I think they'll grow out in time. I don't think the trunks fused, but the roots might have. Alternately, the roots are just growing tightly entwined. One example below....

 

[BrianBay9]

Now the tan oak. Same result, but also got some roots starting above the zip ties similar to a ground layer. Still the trunks don't seem to be fused, but the roots are tight.

 

[BrianBay9]

Here are the four clumps now. I'll see how they develop

 

[BrianBay9]

By the way, I've been told that tan oak aren't worth messing with, but I haven't gotten enough specifics. Anyone else work with tan oak?