Defra's Black Pine Contest Entry

River's Edge

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In our climate, Frank, we need to use smaller containers, if we want to water (and fertilise) twice a day. I'm going to repot next spring into Tokoname trainingspots, size 3.5 or 4. Two of them are already in these, and they seem to like it. Pond basket's are out for me to big and stays wet far to long.
Is that because of particle size or substrate composition? I work with a very dry inorganic bonsai substrate. Perhaps that is the difference. Or because you are working with trees that are further along in development and the restricted pot size is part of the development stage? Just trying to understand? I only use pond baskets in very specific situations for basically correcting root development or promoting very strong growth in certain species. But i do tend to give ample size for developing trees, why is that different due to your climate? Or did i misunderstand something!
 

DirkvanDreven

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Is that because of particle size or substrate composition? I work with a very dry inorganic bonsai substrate. Perhaps that is the difference. Or because you are working with trees that are further along in development and the restricted pot size is part of the development stage? Just trying to understand? I only use pond baskets in very specific situations for basically correcting root development or promoting very strong growth in certain species. But i do tend to give ample size for developing trees, why is that different due to your climate? Or did i misunderstand something!
Sorry Dennis, hope you don't mind.
Pond basket's 8x8 inch. Substrate APL 4 mm. I saw seedlings over 4 or 5 years doing progressively worse. Substrate stayed wet almost all the time. Invented a new sort pine: Japanese Yellow Pine.
So I stop using them. Seeing the results of Haroyosi on FB with his (small) trees Tokoname trainingspots makes me jealous.
 

River's Edge

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Sorry Dennis, hope you don't mind.
Pond basket's 8x8 inch. Substrate APL 4 mm. I saw seedlings over 4 or 5 years doing progressively worse. Substrate stayed wet almost all the time. Invented a new sort pine: Japanese Yellow Pine.
So I stop using them. Seeing the results of Haroyosi on FB with his (small) trees Tokoname trainingspots makes me jealous.
Understand if seedlings were put in pond baskets, thanks for the clarification. Seedlings typically have far too few of roots to use that space or moisture. Would be far more effective at three or four years of age!
 

defra

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Sorry Dennis, hope you don't mind.
Pond basket's 8x8 inch. Substrate APL 4 mm. I saw seedlings over 4 or 5 years doing progressively worse. Substrate stayed wet almost all the time. Invented a new sort pine: Japanese Yellow Pine.
So I stop using them. Seeing the results of Haroyosi on FB with his (small) trees Tokoname trainingspots makes me jealous.

Nope I don't mind, interesting discussion!
There are smaller pond baskets out there tough.
 

River's Edge

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That is also correct.
I am all for variety in approach, the difficulty becomes understanding how the various containers require our adaptation of care routines in order to be effective.
For example, one of the difficulties with colandars is the speed with which they dry out, another is there stability. However they can be used effectively in certain circumstances and climates. Same with pond baskets. The best use for me has been to transfer nursery stock into the pond basket until a more desireable repotting time. The pond basket ensures the compacted root ball in nursery soil stays a bit drier and aerated until it can be properly sorted out and placed in more desireable substrate.
Then every container, substrate and root ball requires a thoughtful approach to get the correct moisture and air conditions.
So in the end it is easier to have some uniformity of approach in container selection, thus simpler more straight forward watering routines.
 

DirkvanDreven

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I am all for variety in approach, the difficulty becomes understanding how the various containers require our adaptation of care routines in order to be effective.
For example, one of the difficulties with colandars is the speed with which they dry out, another is there stability. However they can be used effectively in certain circumstances and climates. Same with pond baskets. The best use for me has been to transfer nursery stock into the pond basket until a more desireable repotting time. The pond basket ensures the compacted root ball in nursery soil stays a bit drier and aerated until it can be properly sorted out and placed in more desireable substrate.
Then every container, substrate and root ball requires a thoughtful approach to get the correct moisture and air conditions.
So in the end it is easier to have some uniformity of approach in container selection, thus simpler more straight forward watering routines.
This is all very true and makes sense! Goal is to get the tree in a substrate / pot combination that matches our watering and feeding pattern and ensures maximum growth and health.
 

River's Edge

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Lots of nice growth right down at the bottom where it should be for future use.
Thanks, You will note that needles have been removed in certain areas to preserve and encourage the health of lower growth. Other Balancing techniques that distribute energy to lower growth are also at play.
 
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