...feel so stupid...

[Ryan820]

I have a Chinese elm that I got last December. It's nothing special but I liked it so I got it. The branches started shedding a lot of leaves a few weeks ago. I know better... Having not trimmed much of its roots when repotting it and trimming the top in accordance so the tree didn't stress as much. However, those leaves kept dropping. I wasn't listening to the tree. I figured it would get better when I moved it outside (been growing it under t5 lamps high output). I noticed today it still wobbled in its pot when moved. It's been since December when I repotted it, so I would have thought the roots would have rebounded by now. I pulled it out of the pot and it had very very few new roots. The soil became compact. Did I over pot? Probably. I added perlite to lighten the soil even more and know it isn't perfect but it should at least keep it from getting worse until I can manage to get the components for a better soil.

I feel so stupid... I know better than to ignore or not pick up on signs this trees was not doing well. If it were doing well it'd be a bush by now!

I have no pics...didn't take any in my moment of shame... But I think I need a smaller pot for this guy and probably just a black nursery pot for now so that I can move it outside when the cold passes and let it grow in the garden.

Any suggestions on what I should do to perhaps ease this plant back to a vigorous growth? Is it safe to assume no fertilizer? How about kelp or seaweed extract known to stimulate roots? Bottom heat?

I have several other trees in my care and while Colorado has tried defoliating them several times already so far they all seem ok but my confidence is shaken. I'm wondering if I need to re-do all of them with a much more freely draining soil. The soil drains fast now but I was shocked how compact it all got. I'm guessing this plant also got a little overwatered regardless of the soil.

 

[Eric Group]

It is probably not good for the tree to keep messing with it's roots especially if it isn't growing well and was just repotted four months ago... What kind of soil mix was it in that became so "compacted"?

 

[edprocoat]

Ryan, overpotting is not an issue. The bigger the pot the more room it has to grow, the more room it has to grow in the more it grows ...

Its a Chinese Elm so it will probably come back. I would leave it in the pot and stabilize the tree in the pot with wire so the new roots will not be hurt when its moved. Do not water it till its dry on the surface. Let it be so it can recover and regain vigor.

ed

 

[Ryan820]

I put it back in the training pot I had it in before but with more perlite mixed in to keep the air up in the soil.

The soil before was similar to what I use for cacti...pretty free draining... The problem is, it had a lot of dust.... The dust just seemed to fill in all the cracks.

I've already wired it up to keep it in place so for now I'll just leave it be.

 

[Eric Group]

I put it back in the training pot I had it in before but with more perlite mixed in to keep the air up in the soil.

The soil before was similar to what I use for cacti...pretty free draining... The problem is, it had a lot of dust.... The dust just seemed to fill in all the cracks.

I've already wired it up to keep it in place so for now I'll just leave it be.

Yes, the dust will always fill in the cracks, choke out the air, compact the soil... You gotta sift out those fines. The perlite might help open up your soil a bit, but next item you repot (please wait a couple years unless it is an absolute necessity..) use a more open, airy mix with less organics and sift your dirt first using a small screen. Get some air in your dirt, that will stimulate root growth.

Please, don't ask what materials to use specifically, we really don't need to start that whole thing up again! LOL

 

[bonsaibp]

Sometimes over potting can be problematic, if the tree can not use all the water in the soil root rot is a strong possibility especially if it is not a completely free draining soil.

 

[edprocoat]

Sometimes over potting can be problematic, if the tree can not use all the water in the soil root rot is a strong possibility especially if it is not a completely free draining soil.

Yes, that will happen in a small pot too given the same circumstances.

ed

 

[Ryan820]

The soil is pretty airy now.... I didn't water the tree right away as the mixture had some moisture. I also lined the bottom with a large substrate ... Give the water a quick exit on the bottom of the pot. I don't know if the pot is too big or not. Guess we will find out.

Does anyone recommend kelp in the interim?

 

[Neli]

Have a look here: It might help.
http://www.sabonsai.co.za/forum/index.php?showtopic=2632

 

[Ryan820]

Have a look here: It might help.
http://www.sabonsai.co.za/forum/index.php?showtopic=2632

That's wild! However, I can say that the leaves of my tree aren't shriveled or drying, it seems it's just losing the older ones but it is growing new leads and growth.

Maybe I freaked out... It's happened before.... Either way the soil was not good so I hope I did right by the tree.

 

[Neli]

You missed the point. He does that with trees that have problems with the root system.

 

[Ryan820]

You missed the point. He does that with trees that have problems with the root system.

No, I understand.

 

[Ryan820]

Happy update!

Adding an update to this tree...the thing survived despite me It is growing loads of. New growths now and I'm letting it grow free for a while to build up it's vigor. I ended up repotting this thing in very free draining soil and securing it with wire and then being very careful on the watering it received. What water it did get was laced with kelp at every turn and it seems to have worked. A quick check revealed many new roots coming from the trunk near the surface of the pot and even some peaking out of the drain wholes so I suspect this new flush of growth is just the beginning for this tree bouncing back! It's been moved outside so it can have better tree conditions, even though it had to endure a lot of rain for the past two days, which is very unusual for Colorado!

Thanks all for the advice and help!

 

[jk_lewis]

Dot NOT disturb the tree for a FULL year. No peeking at the roots, no wriggling of the tree, no pruning, no NOTHING -- except water and fertilizer.

People with only one tree often love it to death. No fiddling!

Hint: Get a nursery plant and start something from scratch so you can get your mind off this one.

 

[Ryan820]

Dot NOT disturb the tree for a FULL year. No peeking at the roots, no wriggling of the tree, no pruning, no NOTHING -- except water and fertilizer.

People with only one tree often love it to death. No fiddling!

Hint: Get a nursery plant and start something from scratch so you can get your mind off this one.

So I didn't "fiddle" with the tree. The roots I've seen were visible without me doing anything to see them. It won't move even if I wanted it to as I wired it really well. Also I have twenty trees with plenty of wrong assumptions available, apparently. Thanks.