First pine advice

[Ripzor]

Hello all, first time poster here!

I am searching for some guidance on this young (3yr?) 10-15cm black pine I picked up last winter both qua design and development.
Looking at the trunk I am stuck between either a small bunjin style or make it a more contorted shohin composition, what do you think?

As for development I am wondering if:

• I should cut off 4 of the 6 branches in the whorl to prevent reverse taper, or is too detrimental to growth this early on?
• any of these would be suitable as a sacrifice branch?
• should I decandle early during development for as much ramification as possible, and if so would this count as vigorous enough to decandle?

Added some images for reference, any advice would be much appreciated,

 

[Wulfskaar]

Welcome! Nice tree!

Please note: I'm a newb with only 4.5 yrs under my belt, but I have recently been advised on my 3, 4, and 4.5 year old JBPs.

I was recently advised that, with the younger ones, I should let them grow. You might be good with reducing the whorl to 2 branches, but I'm not sure that's critical this year. Someone else will chime in on that.

I would expect that yours will be much more vigorous next year, with longer candle growth. You'd select a strong branch as the sacrifice branch and let the run to thicken the trunk below it. On mine, I have cut candles the last couple years to get branching where I want it, but that's taking the longer road. So, I guess, it depends on what you want to get out of the tree.

I highly recommend checking out Eric Schrader's videos on 3 year old JBP that he's making into shohin-sized bonsai.

Here are a few that really clear some things up for me:

 

[jevanlewis]

Disclaimer: I also am a ~5-year amateur

That is a cool little tree. In vigorously growing JBP, whorls can get away from you (i.e., turn into a bulge) in a single growing season. In any case, if you are going to chop below a whorl later (i.e., the whorl is up on a sacrifice branch), you don't need to worry as much. If the whorl is part of the future structure of a tree, I keep it to a max of three branches (side branch, trunk, and sacrifice) coming from a single location. In the case where I keep three branches, I watch closely for budging when both the trunk and sacrifice branch are growing vigorously. Usually, a strong sacrifice will cause weaker growth on the trunk and lower branches, and so bulging is not an issue. Here's a good article from Bonsai Tonight. Also, protect that lowest bud with your life: don't shade it out and make sure you don't cut it back to much as it grows.

Your tree looks healthy, but since it is in a small pot, there is less risk of bulging because the growth will be slower. Still, I don't like to risk it by leaving two many branches from a single location if I can help it.

 

[MrFancyPlants]

I am becoming of the opinion that it makes sense to decandle, prior to tree entering refinement phase, provided that there is suitable health which can be provided by sacrifice growth, even on smaller trees.

It is a cool tree. But unless you want to keep as a mini mame literati, I would focus on developing sacrifice growth for now and hold off on decandling until you have some surplus energy. You can prune the sacrifice down to a single strong bud, to let some light in and to grow your sacrifice out and away, if that make sense.

 

[Wulfskaar]

I am becoming of the opinion that it makes sense to decandle, prior to tree entering refinement phase, provided that there is suitable health which can be provided by sacrifice growth, even on smaller trees.

It is a cool tree. But unless you want to keep as a mini mame literati, I would focus on developing sacrifice growth for now and hold off on decandling until you have some surplus energy. You can prune the sacrifice down to a single strong bud, to let some light in and to grow your sacrifice out and away, if that make sense.

That's what I did on a bunch of mine. They are still pretty skinny, so I slowed down the overall growth quite a bit, but now I have some good branching to work with down the road. I have received quite a it of pushback on that though, as branching should be secondary to growing the trunk. I was much more strategic in my candle pruning this year, leaving most branches untouched and only decandling where I want branches.

I think one should think ahead and be strategic about when/where they cut candles in young tree and only cut candles for a specific reason.

 

[MrFancyPlants]

Welcome! Nice tree!

Please note: I'm a newb with only 4.5 yrs under my belt, but I have recently been advised on my 3, 4, and 4.5 year old JBPs.

I was recently advised that, with the younger ones, I should let them grow. You might be good with reducing the whorl to 2 branches, but I'm not sure that's critical this year. Someone else will chime in on that.

I would expect that yours will be much more vigorous next year, with longer candle growth. You'd select a strong branch as the sacrifice branch and let the run to thicken the trunk below it. On mine, I have cut candles the last couple years to get branching where I want it, but that's taking the longer road. So, I guess, it depends on what you want to get out of the tree.

I highly recommend checking out Eric Schrader's videos on 3 year old JBP that he's making into shohin-sized bonsai.

Here are a few that really clear some things up for me:

Great videos; thanks for linking. Mine don’t really slow down when I have a big sacrifice going, but maybe I should consider cutting the sacrifice back and finding a suitable replacement every couple years.
Sacrifice don’t make credible Jin, in my experience.