Fused trunk trident trials

[Adair M]

I have seen this done. They started with a wooden cone, and attached the seedlings onto the wooden cone with small nails. The nails got covered over as the trunks fused. They also didn’t run all the trunks all the way up. Since the base was bigger around than the top, they let some of the apexes of the seedlings grow out horizontal to become limbs. It still had problems. Since the cone was there, the taper was very uniform. Some seedlings grew faster than others, so there were vertical bulges all around the trunk. Not all the seedlings fused together at the same rate, so it was still very apparent what was happening: artificial looking. And worst of all, trident seedlings are all different genetically, so the leaves coming from each one varied a little from the others. Different sizes, shapes, colors, etc. It looked very much like a “Frankentree”.

So, to have better success at the style I saw, I think it’s good to have an underlying frame, just not a perfect cone. Use rooted cuttings from a donor tree so that the grow rate and leave quality will be consistent. Nailing the trunks to the frame is ok, but some method of binding would help, too. But, the binding needs to be removed and replaced fairly often to prevent scarring. Bending out some apexes to be branches is a good idea, just need to not bind them.

All that said, it’s STILL probably better to do the traditional ”let grow and cut back” method. You’ll get better taper and a more natural looking trunk.

Good luck with your projects.

 

[bwaynef]

What about Japanese Maples?

I have one that I think is fairly well executed. (It was given to me.) I don't recommend it as a technique though. Its currently way taller than I am. It has good fusion but lots of places where the seedlings are easily distinguished. Hopefully a couple more years I'll have the trunk finished. It gives a weird aesthetic for a japanese maple, which are usually prized for their smooth bark.

 

[Maiden69]

I think that you have to re-visit this tree several times a year in order to have a decent looking tree. Editing the trunks as they fuse and grow together, that way you can manipulate the size and aesthetics of the final product. Definitely not something that a field grown tree grower would do, as they have so many trees to manage every season. But, something doable for a person that have but a few trees to take care of. I think I may try to take on a project like this in the future.

 

[Cajunrider]

Thanks for the info Shibui. I've tried fusing pomegranate before and it didn't turn out well either. Now I know to set that thought aside.

 

[Shibui]

I think that you have to re-visit this tree several times a year in order to have a decent looking tree. Editing the trunks as they fuse and grow together, that way you can manipulate the size and aesthetics of the final product. Definitely not something that a field grown tree grower would do, as they have so many trees to manage every season. But, something doable for a person that have but a few trees to take care of. I think I may try to take on a project like this in the future.

Good thoughts. I was also thinking along those lines when I started some of these projects. Some I've put more time and energy into than others but still no consistent great results.
I'd still like to see some good bonsai using fused trunks because, considering how many are started each year, we see very few mature specimens.

I look forward to your trials and the great results.

 

[Gr8tfuldad]

Thank you for doing these experiments and sharing your results. I’ve had this in my mind for awhile and now I will redirect my time and energy into other projects

On a side note, are you using a coarse mix for your outdoor grow beds? I have lots of land and am wondering if using our natural sandy loam soil is “good enough” for trunk thickening endeavors. Thanks

 

[Shibui]

On a side note, are you using a coarse mix for your outdoor grow beds? I have lots of land and am wondering if using our natural sandy loam soil is “good enough” for trunk thickening endeavors. Thanks

The grow beds here are just plain soil. I've added compost and fertilizer but otherwise the soil is the original ground.
I know that's a bit like how long is a piece of string because soil varies so much from place to place but trees will grow in lots of different soils and will usually grow better in soil than in any pot.
Sandy loam is excellent soil type for growing most trees. I'd be happy to suppress weeds and plant trees straight into sandy loam but you will probably get better growth if you also add some fertilizer/compost/organic matter depending on the actual makeup of your sandy loam.

You may have noticed on the other 'field grown trident' thread https://www.bonsainut.com/threads/field-grown-trident.56406/ That I remove as much filed soil as practical when moving the trees to pots. Sandy loam grows great trees in the ground but not so great in pots.

 

[Gr8tfuldad]

The grow beds here are just plain soil. I've added compost and fertilizer but otherwise the soil is the original ground.
I know that's a bit like how long is a piece of string because soil varies so much from place to place but trees will grow in lots of different soils and will usually grow better in soil than in any pot.
Sandy loam is excellent soil type for growing most trees. I'd be happy to suppress weeds and plant trees straight into sandy loam but you will probably get better growth if you also add some fertilizer/compost/organic matter depending on the actual makeup of your sandy loam.

You may have noticed on the other 'field grown trident' thread https://www.bonsainut.com/threads/field-grown-trident.56406/ That I remove as much filed soil as practical when moving the trees to pots. Sandy loam grows great trees in the ground but not so great in pots.

I’m not too worried about fertilizer, the area I plan on using next season my chickens have been clearing for a few seasons. They poop a lot Before I make new gardens in areas, I let them out for a few seasons, they really till and clear all weed seeds very well. I will amend when needed in the future.
Good info on soil, thank you. No intention of putting soil into pots, I just some folks use coarser soil for ground growing and was wondering if you are doing the same. If I grow in sandy loam soil I will develop thicker roots correct? Since the particle size is so fine? Thanks for the education

 

[Adair M]

I have seen this done. They started with a wooden cone, and attached the seedlings onto the wooden cone with small nails. The nails got covered over as the trunks fused. They also didn’t run all the trunks all the way up. Since the base was bigger around than the top, they let some of the apexes of the seedlings grow out horizontal to become limbs. It still had problems. Since the cone was there, the taper was very uniform. Some seedlings grew faster than others, so there were vertical bulges all around the trunk. Not all the seedlings fused together at the same rate, so it was still very apparent what was happening: artificial looking. And worst of all, trident seedlings are all different genetically, so the leaves coming from each one varied a little from the others. Different sizes, shapes, colors, etc. It looked very much like a “Frankentree”.

So, to have better success at the style I saw, I think it’s good to have an underlying frame, just not a perfect cone. Use rooted cuttings from a donor tree so that the grow rate and leave quality will be consistent. Nailing the trunks to the frame is ok, but some method of binding would help, too. But, the binding needs to be removed and replaced fairly often to prevent scarring. Bending out some apexes to be branches is a good idea, just need to not bind them.

All that said, it’s STILL probably better to do the traditional ”let grow and cut back” method. You’ll get better taper and a more natural looking trunk.

Good luck with your projects.

For some examples of trees similar to the ones I’ve seen, Google “fused trunk trident bonsai”, and click “images”.

 

[Shibui]

If I grow in sandy loam soil I will develop thicker roots correct? Since the particle size is so fine?

I have no idea why that would be so.
Did you look at the mass of fine roots on the trees I posted? All of these were grown in garden soil. Thicker roots develop in any soil if you let them but you can grow masses of fine roots in any soil too.

 

[Gr8tfuldad]

I have no idea why that would be so.
Did you look at the mass of fine roots on the trees I posted? All of these were grown in garden soil. Thicker roots develop in any soil if you let them but you can grow masses of fine roots in any soil too.

Not sure where that idea came from either? I read so much it’s possible I misread or someone misspoke. I’m hoping I have better luck next year with germination rates. This year the only things that germinated well were JBP, Japanese Beauty Berry and Weeds.

 

[dbonsaiw]

Always wondered if a larger trunk could be manufactured by using smaller trees (not seedlings) and approach grafting them at the base of the trunk, as opposed to waiting for them to do essentially the same thing by fusing. Not sure what this would ultimately look like, but don't see why using an approach graft method wouldn't be a quicker option.