Good/best phosphorous (and/or potassium) sources?

[SU2]

I was wrong in thinking I needed wayyy more nitrogen during spring/summer, anyways I've got so much 24-8-16 on-hand and I want to get a separate phosphorous (and maybe potassium?) to mix-into the powder I have (along with my minerals powder) to make something more balanced, but I'm seeing guano, rock phosphate, all kinds of animal-product-meals (feather/bone/etc meals), and am just getting more and more confused - wishing miracle gro had a bag of 0-20-0 (and 0-0-20) so I could just tweak it as I liked!!

Thanks for any suggestions on what to pursue here, I know I've gotta find something to fortify my nitrogen-heavy 24-8-16 MG fertilizer (plus separate minerals ;D ) and am just unsure which general 'type' of product is best for phosphorous (am also curious about potassium although I've got much less of a grip on what it's for and as such am not looking to get it as badly as I am phosphorous, I know the phosphorous is going to help all my spring growth harden-off which is hugely important!!

 

[sorce]

Brother you don't need phosphorus you need popcorn!

Grab yourself a bag and watch 6-8 hours of these free Mirai Live stream archives.

Your plants aren't going to use anymore of anything that is already in your 312 fert.

Which is arguably the most useful ratio.
Which is why you see so many.

Bougain...miracid...megabloom...supermater....
All Bullshit to sell products.

Your trees don't even need fertilizer to live.

Ryan explains why not to fert sick plants, or during the summer better than anyone I've heard.

Not only are you going to kill Your trees....

Worrying about this shit is going to end up doing you harm!

When you finish watching those videos...
Google Walter Pall and watch every video you can find.
Read every article.

While you are doing this....
A few days I reckon...

Ignore your trees except for water..

I'll bet by the time you get back to them....

You are armed with all the knowledge you need to get back to fixing your plants...

Only thing is...

You won't have anything to fix because they will already be healthy!

Because you stopped Fucking worrying about them!

Sincerely!

Sorce

 

[63pmp]

Potassium di hydrogen phosphate.

KH2PO4


dissolves quickly and completely.

 

[SU2]

Brother you don't need phosphorus you need popcorn!

Grab yourself a bag and watch 6-8 hours of these free Mirai Live stream archives.

Your plants aren't going to use anymore of anything that is already in your 312 fert.

Which is arguably the most useful ratio.
Which is why you see so many.

Bougain...miracid...megabloom...supermater....
All Bullshit to sell products.

Your trees don't even need fertilizer to live.

Ryan explains why not to fert sick plants, or during the summer better than anyone I've heard.

Not only are you going to kill Your trees....

Worrying about this shit is going to end up doing you harm!

When you finish watching those videos...
Google Walter Pall and watch every video you can find.
Read every article.

While you are doing this....
A few days I reckon...

Ignore your trees except for water..

I'll bet by the time you get back to them....

You are armed with all the knowledge you need to get back to fixing your plants...

Only thing is...

You won't have anything to fix because they will already be healthy!

Because you stopped Fucking worrying about them!

Sincerely!

Sorce

I love mirai and have watched a minimum of 10hrs (that's guessing, it's probably double that), I've read tons of Pall but haven't checked his youtubes, though thanks for the reco I will! I spend almost the entirety (95%+) of my online time on bonsai-related stuff, learning isn't mutually-exclusive with doing, and the reality of the situation - unless you disagree - is that I've got a 24-8-16 fertilizer which isn't good to use (at least that was the verdict in the last thread), so, to have a 'good' fertilizer, I'll need to alter those #'s and that's why I've started this thread, to hear what's best/practical for phosphorous (as most products I see are mixtures, and I want just phos., so it's really 'mineral-type' phosphates versus 'animal-meal-type' phosphates, just hoping to find which people tend towards because I will need it for the next time I fertilize (and I like ordering online anyways - I hope I didn't give the impression I was looking for phosphorous to apply now, as that isn't the case!

And FWIW I've been ignoring the trees quite a bit these past days (except watching for caterpillars- a problem that seems safe to say is over with ), I've been re-building my nursery area and just generally upping the cleanliness & aesthetics of the area - I don't play with my trees for the sake of it!

 

[SU2]

Potassium di hydrogen phosphate.

KH2PO4


dissolves quickly and completely.

Is that synonymous with 'potash'? If not, which would you use? I googled the chemical name and found bags of the stuff on ebay, looks like exactly what I'd need for my mix (that + 24-8-16 + minerals mix!)

Thanks

 

[jacob letoile]

Just use up the fert you have. The tree will take up nutrients in the ratio it needs, not the ratio you give it. The nutrient in shortest supply will limit the growth.

 

[Stan Kengai]

I spent the first decade of my journey over analyzing fertilizer and the next 5 years finding an organic fertilizer.

I use "Tone" fertilizers suplemented with fish emulsion early in the spring. Fish emulsion immediatrly after replanting and two more bi-weekly applications. Then immediately apply "Tone". PlantTone, HollyTone, CitrusTone, etc. You can put them directly on the surface of plants in development. More refined plants, you can use in teabags for more controlled fertilizing (specifically pines).

The good thing about the "Tone" fertilizers is that they are for the most part poop, not chemical. Poop stays soft and loose and dissolves and gives good healthy, deep green growth. Chemical fertilizers tend to clog the surface and create a hydrophobic layer. And I'm not sure they are always dissolved or absorbed.

 

[coh]

I'm also not sure how true the adage "the tree will take only what it needs" is? I think I remember a discussion where it was mentioned that when certain elements are present in excess, they can either be taken up in excess or suppress the uptake of others. Sounds like something @63pmp would know about...hint, hint!

 

[sorce]

Cool!!

I don't want you to worry!

Sixty three pimp is definitely the go to!

I use the fish cuz I like the smell!

Sorce

 

[63pmp]

Just use up the fert you have. The tree will take up nutrients in the ratio it needs, not the ratio you give it. The nutrient in shortest supply will limit the growth.

I know this is often quoted by many people, but it is a fertilizing myth. You can over fertilize with particular nutrients, look up nutrient toxicity

potash refers to anything with potassium in it as this is the archaic name. eg potash of sulfur is potassium sulphate.

 

[GrimLore]

0-48-31 Grotek http://grotek.com/product-detail/blossom-blaster/;)

Grimmy

 

[M. Frary]

You people worry way too much about fertilizer.

 

[jacob letoile]

I know this is often quoted by many people, but it is a fertilizing myth. You can over fertilize with particular nutrients, look up nutrient toxicity

Look it up your self and pay attention to what you read. The O.P. is stressing about npk, ratios, not molybdenum poisoning or boron deficiency or ca/mg ratios. You can dump enormous amounts of n, p and k on your bonsai. They are salts and will wash out the next time you water. If your worrying about your 3-1-2 fert, you either grow thousands of trees and dont want to waste money or don't know enough about fertilizer and plants to critically evaluate your information.

 

[M. Frary]

You can dump enormous amounts of n, p and k on your bonsai

Whoever heard of such things.
Say it ain't so!

 

[sorce]

Look it up your self and pay attention to what you read

Without all due respect to our Aussie friend....

He probably wrote the book.

I've been following and understanding Paul as the primo guide to understanding the SCIENCE behind fertilizer since......

http://bonsaistudygroup.com/general-discussion/fertilizer-3072/

@coh knows...@Anthony knows....

Heres the thing though....

Even I'll admit it's too sciency for me.
Likely for most.

Walter's method works!

But for the guy who cares to delve deep into the Science...

You're not going to find a guy more knowledgeable and willing to share as @63pmp

Fact.

Sorce

 

[M. Frary]

Grab yourself a bag and watch 6-8 hours of these free Mirai Live stream archives.

No thanks.
I'll spend that time with real trees or training my dog or watching a Law and Order marathon.

 

[sorce]

No thanks.
I'll spend that time with real trees or training my dog or watching a Law and Order marathon.

Boo!

Sorce

 

[M. Frary]

Boo!

Boo boo for people who listen to this guy.

Ryan explains why not to fert sick plants, or during the summer better than anyone I've heard.

Not only are you going to kill Your trees....

I can see sick plants but just when am I supposed to fertilize? Spring is like 3 weeks. Pretty much the same for fall.
And I dump it to them in summer and haven't lost a single one yet. Bet Walter does too.
So you're going to have 2 conflicting ideas.
Which one to choose?
The one from the guy that's been doing it for a long time and knows his shit.
Or..
From the guy that thinks there are only 3 groups of trees. Juniper,pine and elongating.
I'm going with the guy who doesn't make up groups of trees he doesn't know about.

 

[coh]

Boo boo for people who listen to this guy.

I can see sick plants but just when am I supposed to fertilize? Spring is like 3 weeks. Pretty much the same for fall.
And I dump it to them in summer and haven't lost a single one yet. Bet Walter does too.
So you're going to have 2 conflicting ideas.
Which one to choose?
The one from the guy that's been doing it for a long time and knows his shit.
Or..
From the guy that thinks there are only 3 groups of trees. Juniper,pine and elongating.
I'm going with the guy who doesn't make up groups of trees he doesn't know about.

Did Ryan Neil kick your dog or something? LOL.

 

[M. Frary]

Did Ryan Neil kick your dog or something? LOL.

He'd lose a foot!