Help identify white spots on ponderosa

[SantaFeBonsai]

I don’t believe this is scale based on Bonsai tonight description below but I can’t figure out what it is.

 

[AJL]

Or could they be Adelgids ? aphid like insects that suck the sap from conifers. Often covered in a white waxy material

 

[SantaFeBonsai]

Here’s a pic of adelges

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

Dried sap maybe.

 

[0soyoung]

birdie poop?

 

[Bonsai Nut]

I'm with @Brian Van Fleet on this one. Looks like physical damage with dried sap. The only question - what caused the physical damage? Did you recently work or wire the tree while you might have bent some needles?

 

[Potawatomi13]

Appears as pitch here also.

 

[mossedmoon]

When in doubt... spray. It does look like sap, but I'd be asking myself why. Something's causing damage to the needles, and I'd be spraying Malathion around dusk. An ounce of prevention...

 

[mossedmoon]

I'm with @Brian Van Fleet on this one. Looks like physical damage with dried sap. The only question - what caused the physical damage? Did you recently work or wire the tree while you might have bent some needles?

I've been abusing ponderosa for years and never caused this kind of damage.

 

[Bonsai Nut]

I've been abusing ponderosa for years and never caused this kind of damage.

I didn't think it looked like human damage, but I thought it was worth asking, anyway.

 

[SantaFeBonsai]

It’s not human physical damage that I’m aware of and it’s not bird poop. Doesn’t look like needle cast either. It is dried sap but no sign of what’s causing it and almost all are from the middle of the needle.

I’m leaning towards a fungus and thinking I should probably go ahead and treat with daconil as new needles are elongating. I just don’t feel comfortable treating for something that I’m not sure about.

Potawatomi, is pitch your word for bird poop? ?

 

[Bonsai Nut]

I have been having weird damage problems from critters recently - and I never had them in the past.

Last year I was having problems with tree rats munching on my smaller Chinese elm buds. No other part of the tree - just the buds. I placed traps in the area and haven't seen any damage in the last six months. (I'm not using the slang term for squirrels - in SoCal tree rats are actually a "thing").

Now I am having a problem with a small bird(s) snipping off leaves from one of my larger (6' tall) field elms that I am growing out to increase trunk caliper. Not eating them - just snipping them off one side of the upper part of the tree. Little bastard comes in early morning almost pre-dawn hours, and attacks my tree... leaving a little pile of leaves around the base of the trunk. I have moved the tree and hopefully the bird will decide to go elsewhere.

I don't think the damage in this case is caused by an animal. I don't have a clue what is causing it, but my first guess would be some sort of insect. It doesn't look like whatever is causing the damage is eating the needle, unless it is puncturing the needle to get the sap(?) I don't think it is fungus, because I assume the damage would be less specific and more widespread. These are little pinpoints of damage.

 

[wireme]

I’m leaning towards scale. They overwinter as eggs under the scale. What we see here may be the residue left behind after they’ve hatched and crawled off. In the crawler stage right now and unprotected by developed scale so susceptible to control measures now if I am right. I’m not sure at all though. I’ve found that DE powder applied during the crawler stage does pretty welll.

 

[Bonsai Nut]

Note this area on your photo...



I think it is a clue to what is going on. If you can locate this spot again, it will tell us a lot. If this little blemish has gotten larger, it would suggest something progressive going on inside the needle (like fungus). If it has remained the same, it would indicate one-time damage as if an insect started to bite or lay eggs and was disturbed... and moved to another needle location.

 

[wireme]

Here’s some pondy scale. After the eggs hatch and they crawl off...dunno,maybe.

 

[0soyoung]

I had something similar appear on needles of a particular mugo of mine a few years ago. I presumed it to be scale, sprayed NEEM a couple of times, and it went away. Haven't seen it for at least three years now.

 

[Potawatomi13]

It’s not human physical damage that I’m aware of and it’s not bird poop. Doesn’t look like needle cast either. It is dried sap but no sign of what’s causing it and almost all are from the middle of the needle.

I’m leaning towards a fungus and thinking I should probably go ahead and treat with daconil as new needles are elongating. I just don’t feel comfortable treating for something that I’m not sure about.

Potawatomi, is pitch your word for bird poop? ?

You don't know this term for conifer blood? Have known this since childhood. Never have called conifer pitch "sap".

 

[SantaFeBonsai]

You don't know this term for conifer blood? Have known this since childhood. Never have called conifer pitch "sap".

I’m from east Texas, it’s either sap or syrup, you “pitch” a tent. ?

 

[SantaFeBonsai]

Note this area on your photo...

View attachment 240269

I think it is a clue to what is going on. If you can locate this spot again, it will tell us a lot. If this little blemish has gotten larger, it would suggest something progressive going on inside the needle (like fungus). If it has remained the same, it would indicate one-time damage as if an insect started to bite or lay eggs and was disturbed... and moved to another needle location.

I tried to find that needle,,,



But Bnut I’m sure that spot you squared grows to the same size as the others. They all end up that size and eventually become brown of both sides but the needles don’t die,,, yet.

 

[SantaFeBonsai]

Well I posted this question to the Mirai pro member q&a and it became available today.

Ryan Neil was quite certain it is dothistroma. He also stated that it is an indicator of a compromised root system which makes sense because prior to this spring the tree had not been repotted for 7seasons and was quite root bound and had very little percolation.

Treatment will be an alternating combination of daconil and copper to protect this years new growth, the repot last feb should help as well.

Something that was quite surprising and relieving was Ryan’s take on fungal issues. It’s not something that will hurt the tree significantly if addressed but something that allows you to see an area of improvement in your everyday care. While I acquired the tree in ‘17 and knew it would need a repot in the future I had to have been over watering. I wasn’t concerned about needle length as I was trying to feed and water heavily through 2019 for additional back budding which has occurred but the over watering compromised the tree’s natural ability to fight off the invasion.

Thanks for all the responses!