Help with ID and should I buy

jbogard

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I am interested in buying this pine that the owner thinks is a Japanese black pine. The only thing is that he planted some red and white pines at the same time and he’s not entirely sure which ones were which. Do you guys think it’s a black pine and is it worth buying?
 

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Shibui

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No clear picture of the new candles but it does look like they are reddish brown which would indicate JRP. Needles are also quite long which also fits with JRP. JRP needles are usually softer than JBP but I can't feel the needles on that one.
Most White pines are 5 needle types and this one seems to have 2 needles per sheath - right for JRP but definitely not JWP.
I'd say this is most likely Japanese Red pine. JRP is very good bonsai species. Not quite as fast growing and is more often seen with thinner, more elegant trunks. Needles reduce in length dramatically with decandling techniques.
 

jbogard

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No clear picture of the new candles but it does look like they are reddish brown which would indicate JRP. Needles are also quite long which also fits with JRP. JRP needles are usually softer than JBP but I can't feel the needles on that one.
Most White pines are 5 needle types and this one seems to have 2 needles per sheath - right for JRP but definitely not JWP.
I'd say this is most likely Japanese Red pine. JRP is very good bonsai species. Not quite as fast growing and is more often seen with thinner, more elegant trunks. Needles reduce in length dramatically with decandling techniques.
So it is definitely a two needle pine so that narrows it down! And I think I do remember the candles being a red color. So I guess next question would be if this has potential and I’d this a tree that is suitable for a Texas climate. Hot and moderately dry
 

Shibui

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I only know your climate by reputation. I have a few JRP here and our climate would probably be similar - dry summer with regular day temps above 100F. Winter nights mostly around freezing and a few degrees below to occasional 5 and 6 deg below freezing. Snow rarely.
A few years ago I lost one older red pine almost a year after root pruning but with no real idea why. Others are healthy and thriving. JRP respond very well to the JBP decandling and needle reduction.
Generally grown as a lighter, more feminine? tree in Japan. try searching for Japanese Red pine bonsai images on this site and others for inspiration and options.

This one appears to have plenty of branches to choose from.
Like other pines, buds from bare wood are rare so assess those branches carefully for possibilities to cut back to living shoots and regrow branches with more density and plenty of shorter shoots.
Red pine branches have a rep for being brittle and difficult to bend. I find that younger branches like these bend quite well so another option for increasing density and reducing length is to wire and bend existing branches to for more compact foliage pads before moving on to pine maintenance technique to get further density and shorter shoots.
You may even like to explore grafting options including approach grafting to get growing shoots on bare parts.
 

Leo in N E Illinois

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Looks like JRP - japanese red pine to me.
Looks young enough that depending on your skills could be turned into a decent bonsai. No fatal flaws that I see. may take 5 or more years of growing before the ''final styling'' and moving to a finer bonsai pot. Training pots for the near future.

Wiring JRP - it is not so much that the branches are ''brittle'', they are very flexible. BUT they tear away from the trunk more easily than JBP. Be cautious, about how you anchor and bend the junction of the branch with the trunk.

Back budding - full sun helps. They do back bud, just not as reliably as JBP. They do back bud better than JWP and many other pines.
 

jbogard

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Well since ive been helping the guy who owned the tree out with stuff around his nursery (just trying to learn some stuff) he gifted the line to me! Here’s a few more pics to see what you guys think I should do moving forward. This pine was dug out of a bed this spring, so I’m assuming just let it be for the remainder of the year?
 

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Leo in N E Illinois

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Yes, just let it recover this growing season.

What type of potting medium is it planted in? You should research potting media for pines and repot it next year into a bonsai pine mix. Or you might wait until the second or third growing season to repot again. Also consider a training pot rather than a nursery pot.
 

jbogard

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We dug it and potted into a lava rock mix. He said when he planted them he layered bonsai soil in the dirt but when we dug it up it seemed to have a lot of clay in the soil. From what I understand you want to keep native soil with the tree during collection of pines. Correct?
 

Potawatomi13

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just let it be for the remainder of the year?
Wise choice;).

From what I understand you want to keep native soil with the tree during collection of pines. Correct?
Bare rooting pines normally unwise. Removing native soil done in stages over 2/3 repots 2/3 years apart depending trees vigor.
 
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