How should I go about acquiring Blue Atlas Cedar?

Adair M

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Here’s my Atlas Cedar. I took the wire off last summer, it’s time to rewire. I can also do some cutting back at the same time.

So, let’s say I wanted to cut back the branch I circled in red:

3C6CD084-9F95-4DD0-BB37-CFC5B4BF0B16.jpeg

A good place to cut back to would be where I’ve circled in yellow. Or maybe even back to the bud at the top of the yellow circle.


They’re pretty strong trees, and the buds will pop out next growing season.

Sometimes, you’ll see buds growing directly off a fairly young branch, not at the tip with needles surrounding it. These buds will be viable, but I wouldn’t cut back to one. I always like to first cut back to where there are needles. Supporting a bud. Then later once the “naked” bud has produced needles, cut back to it.

Sorry, I don’t have a link, I’ve learned how to work them by hands on experience with my own tree, and working with Boon on it.

36DD5495-94F2-47AA-8D3A-EA2EA116A1F7.jpegHere’s a picture I took of it when I took the wire off last summer. The branches have moved up a good bit since then, and I need to wire them back down.

As you can see, they do make nice pads.

Oh, one thing to keep in mind is these are sun loving trees. And make sure that each branch gets sun exposure. If a branch gets shaded, it will get thin and look bad. So try not to have one branch directly under another. The bottom branch will suffer.
 

Japonicus

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Here’s my Atlas Cedar. I took the wire off last summer, it’s time to rewire. I can also do some cutting back at the same time.

So, let’s say I wanted to cut back the branch I circled in red:

View attachment 176369

A good place to cut back to would be where I’ve circled in yellow. Or maybe even back to the bud at the top of the yellow circle.


They’re pretty strong trees, and the buds will pop out next growing season.

Sometimes, you’ll see buds growing directly off a fairly young branch, not at the tip with needles surrounding it. These buds will be viable, but I wouldn’t cut back to one. I always like to first cut back to where there are needles. Supporting a bud. Then later once the “naked” bud has produced needles, cut back to it.

Sorry, I don’t have a link, I’ve learned how to work them by hands on experience with my own tree, and working with Boon on it.

View attachment 176371Here’s a picture I took of it when I took the wire off last summer. The branches have moved up a good bit since then, and I need to wire them back down.

As you can see, they do make nice pads.

Oh, one thing to keep in mind is these are sun loving trees. And make sure that each branch gets sun exposure. If a branch gets shaded, it will get thin and look bad. So try not to have one branch directly under another. The bottom branch will suffer.
Hands on indeed. You don't need a link :) Me on the other hand, well you know, just a dry sponge here.

Yes nice pads, you do great work, and if the Atlas bark doesn't darken for better than 30 yrs
how old is yours Adair? Sure wish I had someone like Boon to work with.

Adair I think it was you asked me why am I buying cultivars in my Thunderhead thread, maybe Sorce.
Would an Atlas Cedar glauca only be a cultivar?
I don't know if it's the hoop house lighting, soil or type of cedar, but the one I pictured
that drew me in at NEB (tall no taper, with high trunk movement late on) it has the vivid blue
I want to work with. It's a knock out foliage and the trunk is dark in that picture making a great contrast.
I love that about it. So if I get a 3 yr old seedling or cultivar now I may be dead before the trunk gets that contrast.
 

Japonicus

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Jim Gremel cedars for sale at the BIB show last week... fantastic trees but you definitely pay a premium for those trunks!
Thanks for sharing some eye candy Dav4 :D I can only wish.
I know it takes time to sort through these things and post pictures, read through a thread some,
so, much appreciated.

And @Adair M , thanks for taking the time to do one better than a link, and detail where to
go about pruning. That's how I had in mind, but great tip on the naked bud and cutting above it 1st
within needle support.
 

Adair M

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Hands on indeed. You don't need a link :) Me on the other hand, well you know, just a dry sponge here.

Yes nice pads, you do great work, and if the Atlas bark doesn't darken for better than 30 yrs
how old is yours Adair? Sure wish I had someone like Boon to work with.

Adair I think it was you asked me why am I buying cultivars in my Thunderhead thread, maybe Sorce.
Would an Atlas Cedar glauca only be a cultivar?
I don't know if it's the hoop house lighting, soil or type of cedar, but the one I pictured
that drew me in at NEB (tall no taper, with high trunk movement late on) it has the vivid blue
I want to work with. It's a knock out foliage and the trunk is dark in that picture making a great contrast.
I love that about it. So if I get a 3 yr old seedling or cultivar now I may be dead before the trunk gets that contrast.
That one you liked at NEB is grafted. You can see the graft Union about 2 to 3 inches up from the nebari. It does appear to have rougher bark than my tree. That may be because it is older than mine, or just a characteristic of that cultivar. Mine is a green cedar, that one is definitely blue. Mine sometimes has a somewhat blue color, but later turns green. I’ve found that the blue ones usually don’t get as dense as the green ones. Mine produces particularly short needles. Only 1/2 inch.

About cultivars...

If you are buying cultivars from a bonsai place where the grafts or cuttings were specifically made for bonsai, they’re probably ok to use. It’s the cultivars at the big box stores. And general landscape nurseries stock trees that are more suited for, well, landscaping rather than bonsai.
 

mcpesq817

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Adair, thanks very much for sharing. Any advice on repotting (how much roots you can remove, timing, etc.)? I have a green atlas cedar I bought from Brent years ago that I've been training for a semi-cascade. It's in a 15" pond basket that past few years, and it might be time to think about repotting (haven't decided whether to up pot for a bigger trunk, or start working with what I have). Interestingly, it seems to have grown faster than a second one I bought from Brent around the same time that's been in the ground the last few years.
 

Adair M

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Repotting is the same as for any other conifer. Reduce the height of the rootball, make the bottom of the rootball flat, and as smooth as you can make it, remove downward growing roots, do a half bare root, tease out feeder roots on non-bare root side, pot in good soil.
 

mcpesq817

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Thanks Adair. I thought I had read that these did not like to be repotted and were finicky about their roots being worked.
 

Adair M

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I’ve heard that said about every kind of tree!

I did exactly what I described above to my green Atlas Cedar. Didn’t skip a beat.

If you think you need to see it done, go to www.bonsaiboon.com and watch one of his repotting videos. I think you can stream them at a very low cost.
 

Japonicus

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Give Brent a try (item #2150), @Japonicus.
From seed, he says, so there will be no grafts, but give him a call to be sure.
Order confirmed just today. Will ship next Monday
Got a 2 yr graft 1g Glauca :) item # 2155 I believe
Brent does not have a tele...for EGGW, but dang, he's certainly thorough in his email.
I forgot to inquire about current temperatures/dormancy there at his nursery.
Also ordered a Thunbergii Brocade he said I would be surprised at the number of branches
to work with on the Brocade.
Thanks Osoyoung.
 

Japonicus

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A fertilizer with a high Ca and Mg (especially Mg) or Epsom salts will help with the blue color.
Thanks CasAH What about Holly Tone and Mir-Acid renamed now, (forget the new name by Miracle Grow)?
Hydrangea likes acid soil I believe, and the blue is said to respond well to it.
Having used and still rotate Miracle Grow into my menu, it looks like it is made from Epsom salts.
Yes Epsom salt is rich in Mg and is used orally as a supplement for it, or...constipation.
 

CasAH

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Thanks CasAH What about Holly Tone and Mir-Acid renamed now, (forget the new name by Miracle Grow)?
Hydrangea likes acid soil I believe, and the blue is said to respond well to it.
Having used and still rotate Miracle Grow into my menu, it looks like it is made from Epsom salts.
Yes Epsom salt is rich in Mg and is used orally as a supplement for it, or...constipation.

If it has Mg it will help with the blue coloring, especially in the Spring and some in the Fall.
 

KiwiPlantGuy

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Thanks CasAH What about Holly Tone and Mir-Acid renamed now, (forget the new name by Miracle Grow)?
Hydrangea likes acid soil I believe, and the blue is said to respond well to it.
Having used and still rotate Miracle Grow into my menu, it looks like it is made from Epsom salts.
Yes Epsom salt is rich in Mg and is used orally as a supplement for it, or...constipation.

Hi Japonicus,
Just to help clarify, not trying to be a f..kwit, that Hydrangeas do like acid soil BUT if you add “Aluminium Sulphate” as a soluble salt, that will guarantee blue Hydrangeas :).
Just acid, say below pH 6, you get pink flowers with a little mauve.
Hope that helpful, Charles
 

mcpesq817

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Order confirmed just today. Will ship next Monday
Got a 2 yr graft 1g Glauca :) item # 2155 I believe
Brent does not have a tele...for EGGW, but dang, he's certainly thorough in his email.
I forgot to inquire about current temperatures/dormancy there at his nursery.
Also ordered a Thunbergii Brocade he said I would be surprised at the number of branches
to work with on the Brocade.
Thanks Osoyoung.

Nice! I've been thinking about adding one of the blue atlas cedars - I assumed Brent was out because they were off his site. I'll have to check in with him.
 

Japonicus

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Hi Japonicus,
Just to help clarify, not trying to be a f..kwit, that Hydrangeas do like acid soil BUT if you add “Aluminium Sulphate” as a soluble salt, that will guarantee blue Hydrangeas :).
Just acid, say below pH 6, you get pink flowers with a little mauve.
Hope that helpful, Charles
Hey Charles, thanks for the reply.
Yeh, we had acid soil where I grew up, and a 20' spreading bed of hydrangea that was always blue.
Never fed it so maybe all the beech and red oak leaves lent a hand in the colour. The beech leaves
tasted sweeter than the oaks when smoked, that much I do know lol.
https://www.keystonepestsolutions.c...MI7fr15uaU2QIV1DqBCh2fpQcFEAQYAyABEgIbLfD_BwE
Found this ^ aluminum sulphate, not sure I would need it, the Espoma I use is 1% Mg and 3% Ca, 5% Sulphur.
If I ever find the blue hinting at giving way to green, I will try the Aluminum sulphate.
At what rate would you use on your own bonsai?
 
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