I Want Back-Budding On My KH! Advise?

just.wing.it

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I've had this tree for a few years now.
I think this is its second year in this pot, I did some major root work in spring of '18.

Its been healthy, but I want more vigor and back-budding on the trunk.

Here's the tree so far this year, just feeding and growing.
Its in full sun.
20190518_194419_Burst01.jpg20190518_194443.jpg20190518_194513.jpg20190518_194600.jpg
Keen eyes will see the dead top.
I need to prune the stump off.
This tree had a bunch of dead branches when I got it.
 

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Korean Hornbeam? will eventually bud out at the top. Eventually, but it will grow out slowly. Don't scar up what existing bark is left facing up in the crown.
 

just.wing.it

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Korean Hornbeam? will eventually bud out at the top. Eventually, but it will grow out slowly. Don't scar up what existing bark is left facing up in the crown.
I'm pretty sure that stump on top is dead wood.
Been like that for 2 or 3 years now.

I'd like more backbudding to fill in some of the Negative Space for now.....and I've toyed with the idea of air layering the other above the first set of branches, in the future, if I can get it growing like crazy.

So far I've not seen the vigor from this one that would indicate to me that its ready for work like air layering....though it is growing strong this year, but still no new buds from the main trunk.
 

BobbyLane

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regarding time to cut back, i do it anytime i want, this one was done in feb, first image taken feb, last image today...

with that said, you could do it now or wait until mid to late june when the tree would of built up maximum strength
 

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just.wing.it

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regarding time to cut back, i do it anytime i want, this one was done in feb, first image taken feb, last image today...
Thanks Bobby, maybe I'll do it sooner....she is quite full and dense already.
fertilise one month in advance ?
Have been hitting it pretty hard with 20-20-20 this year, since it started growing....and throwing a thick dose of fish in there occasionally as well.

Might cut it back today if I can find time....been working on a small veggie garden this weekend. Two 6'L x 2'W x 1'H boxes on the ground...had to dig into the slope a bit, kinda terraced style....top soil and perlite.....wife wanted to try seeds, so we'll see how it goes.
I put up bird netting to keep the sprouts safe.

But I think I'm done with that for now, and some tree trimming may commence.....after this cold beer.
 

just.wing.it

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looks healthy, it should back bud all over by cutting back into old wood
I dont know of you did this intentionally or not, but I looked at the blue lines you made and it gave me the thought that cutting back hard up top and leaving the bottom relatively full may be a good insurance policy....in case it just dies back.... I'm over cautious with Hornbeams nowadays.....cant be too safe!
 

BobbyLane

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I dont know of you did this intentionally or not, but I looked at the blue lines you made and it gave me the thought that cutting back hard up top and leaving the bottom relatively full may be a good insurance policy....in case it just dies back.... I'm over cautious with Hornbeams nowadays.....cant be too safe!
tbh i cant really see whats going on lower down, its all full. i wouldnt be happy with the growth at the tips higher or lower, in my garden this would of been hacked back pronto, takes a few seconds with a pair of good secateurs:)
 

BobbyLane

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you went pretty hard. past the blue lines on the virt, the blue lines were at the closest nodes/knuckles i saw near the trunk. it will back bud for sure, but it might not produce buds from all the short stubs you left without nodes. hawthorn and elm will produce new buds from the cambium of cut branch stubs with no nodes. hornbeam or beech wont do this. so the blue lines were sort of a tester to see how it reacted. but i think its for the best anyway, so lets wait n see. you might end up with buds in new places, from which to build a better structure from. so dont do anymore, just leave in full sun and feed with organic and liquid ferts.
 

just.wing.it

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you went pretty hard. past the blue lines on the virt, the blue lines were at the closest nodes/knuckles i saw near the trunk. it will back bud for sure, but it might not produce buds from all the short stubs you left without nodes. hawthorn and elm will produce new buds from the cambium of cut branch stubs with no nodes. hornbeam or beech wont do this. so the blue lines were sort of a tester to see how it reacted. but i think its for the best anyway, so lets wait n see. you might end up with buds in new places, from which to build a better structure from. so dont do anymore, just leave in full sun and feed with organic and liquid ferts.
Indeed.... went hard...
Started out wide and kept going in and in and in....

But the truth is, those branches are all too thick for the thickness of that trunk, in terms of proportions.
I am hoping that this reduction will either give me better transitions from those stubs, or just give me new buds from the trunk......which is really what I wanted here.

Sorry, know many or most will disagree but I find this so sad. It was quite a lovely tree. Best of luck getting it to do what you want.
It was crap on its way back from the gutter, imho......not to mention the anti-nebari this the had when I got it.....crikey....did remove 85% of its roots 2 years ago.....I'm glad its alive and I enjoy the long slender trunk.....but this tree has a bucket of problems.
I wasn't getting the trunk to bud out anywhere......and I'm not scared to do an experiment with it.

I keep hearing and reading that the way to get Carpinus to back bud is to cut back hard.....we'll see.

And as previously mentioned, the branching was chaotic and too long and thick for this delicate, slender trunk.....so this cut back was in order....my only thing is, I've had issue after issue with Hornbeams....there have been some good years.....but I'm skeptical at best.

I'm banking on the fact that this tree was not repotted this year, it has grown very well this year and I've been feeding it heavily this year.....hoping for an explosion of new shoots from all over.

Thanks for looking!
 

BobbyLane

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really?
guess we all have different tastes.to some this large negative space in the tree is 'lovely'
*scratches head*

fwiw deciduous trees are largely judged or are at their best in the naked, without leaf image.i personally enjoy them in all seasons, but naked is when they really shine. its pretty clear to see this tree had major structural flaws and well done to OP for having the balls and vision to see this and make plans to correct the flaws and take it forward.
 

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just.wing.it

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really?
guess we all have different tastes.to some this large negative space in the tree is 'lovely'
*scratches head*

fwiw deciduous trees are largely judged or are at their best in the naked, without leaf image.i personally enjoy them in all seasons, but naked is when they really shine. its pretty clear to see this tree had major structural flaws and well done to OP for having the balls and vision to see this and make plans to correct the flaws and take it forward.
Yes, thanks Bobby.
That long bare section has always been that way....that's what I want to change....
I've often thought of air layering off the top since ita so thin....could make a literati mabye.....that may still happen down the road, we'll see.
 

coachspinks

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Indeed.... went hard...
Started out wide and kept going in and in and in....

But the truth is, those branches are all too thick for the thickness of that trunk, in terms of proportions.
I am hoping that this reduction will either give me better transitions from those stubs, or just give me new buds from the trunk......which is really what I wanted here.


It was crap on its way back from the gutter, imho......not to mention the anti-nebari this the had when I got it.....crikey....did remove 85% of its roots 2 years ago.....I'm glad its alive and I enjoy the long slender trunk.....but this tree has a bucket of problems.
I wasn't getting the trunk to bud out anywhere......and I'm not scared to do an experiment with it.

I keep hearing and reading that the way to get Carpinus to back bud is to cut back hard.....we'll see.

And as previously mentioned, the branching was chaotic and too long and thick for this delicate, slender trunk.....so this cut back was in order....my only thing is, I've had issue after issue with Hornbeams....there have been some good years.....but I'm skeptical at best.

I'm banking on the fact that this tree was not repotted this year, it has grown very well this year and I've been feeding it heavily this year.....hoping for an explosion of new shoots from all over.

Thanks for looking!
I think you did the right thing. I was at the same point with one of mine and cut it back hard. It has rewarded me with a lot of back budding and now there are a lot more options.
 

just.wing.it

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I think you did the right thing. I was at the same point with one of mine and cut it back hard. It has rewarded me with a lot of back budding and now there are a lot more options.
Thanks!
That's good to hear!
Ive been looking at this one for 2 or 3 years now, it was time for a change.
 

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