I would pay $20,000, sacrafice my first born, and cut off my arm

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@yenling83 What a great example of wanting something enough, going for it, and getting it. I would say this thread shows that luck does not have much to do with your success thus far, you have put in the work and crazy determination!

I aggressively agree with your words on collecting. Maybe you do need to be a little "crazy" to collect seriously good trees. I think the fact that it is so hard is what I love about it. You mentioned that feeling when you don't know how your going to get a tree back to your truck, I was just feeling that this week!

Please keep it up, I hope to meet you in person one day.
 

yenling83

Omono
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@yenling83 What a great example of wanting something enough, going for it, and getting it. I would say this thread shows that luck does not have much to do with your success thus far, you have put in the work and crazy determination!

I aggressively agree with your words on collecting. Maybe you do need to be a little "crazy" to collect seriously good trees. I think the fact that it is so hard is what I love about it. You mentioned that feeling when you don't know how your going to get a tree back to your truck, I was just feeling that this week!

Please keep it up, I hope to meet you in person one day.
That would be awesome, very impressed with the trees you've been collecting!
 

yenling83

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@yenling83 if I ever do come to the USA on my BBB trip, is your garden open to visitors?

J.

Very kind and flattering of you, however I have a fairly small collection, I'm also in the middle of the Bay Area and Los Angeles, maybe 4-6 hr drive from either the Bay or LA. I think there's much better gardens/places to see in CA than my small collection. A side from trees that are near show ready, I have a ton of trees grown from seed, cutting and airlayer, all really long term projects i'm working on growing trunks-all not very exciting right now. If you were in the area, feel free to hit me up, but I'd recommend checking out other more established Bonsai Gardens. Someday, I hope to have a really impressive Bonsai Garden, right now I just have some benches and project trees i'm working on. Thank you!
 

FedericoMelis

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If someone would take me on a legitimate collecting trip in the Sierra's or in the desert.

No, not really-but that's how I feel. I would pay a lot of money to go on a good collecting trip.
I'm sure lot's of other's on this forum feel similar to me.

Few Questions:
1. Is there a way for someone like me to go on a legitimate collecting trip without knowing many people in the bonsai community? I guess REBS bonsai club offers a collecting trip, but it's limited to 8 people and filled up already.

2. How do groups like this go collecting in the Sierra's without getting in trouble? How do they go about getting permits?

3. Is there a way where if you pay hundreds you can go on a legit collecting trip?
If you every visit Europe I'll take you collecting mate.
But I'm quite sure you won't be able to carry the plant back home unluckily
 

FedericoMelis

Yamadori
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@Kyleboldy2003 asked me a few questions via PM, I hope it's okay i'll share here-hope that's okay.

First thing I didn't understand is that Collecting CA Junipers is generally a totally different thing compared with collecting Sierra Junipers. One of the biggest reasons for this is the environment in which they grow, mainly the fact that CA junipers grow in the dirt and Sierra grow on granite. Both are exposed to the harsh environment which give them all those beautiful characteristics we want for Bonsai. Sierra Junipers are often naturally dwarfed because their root systems are confined to small pockets of soil. Their roots often cannot extend further into the soil because the granite rock is confining them. This is fantastic for Bonsai, because under certain situations you can remove/collect a tree with a nice root system already. The majority of Sierra's that grow in Granite should not be collected as the roots dive deep into granite cracks and would die upon collecting.

With California Junipers they are removed from dirt, sand, clay, etc. They don't grow on rock and extracting them requires a completely different tool and skill set to extract them successfully. I have collected CA and Utah Juniper from dirt with some success, however i'm not an expert in that area and I've decided to focus only on collecting trees from rock where I know my success rate will be very high. I believe that in general the survival success rate for CA junipers is not very pretty, because it's much more challenging to collect a substantial system of fine roots. I know of a few people who have very high success rates with them, but I also know of many people who have low success rate. Often people getting into collecting don't consider aftercare as much as they should. It's important to have a plan for every little aspect of a trees care after you collect it.

This advice only applies to, "pocket trees" with a nice root system after being collected. I think the single best aftercare resource you could get your hands on currently is the Mirai Live video where Randy Knight breaks down exactly what he does. I recommend sifted pumice, a nice tight box, being able to move your trees to different micro climates within your yard, learning to get the correct balance of water and oxygen, leaving the majority of an intact root ball with the original field soil and leaving your newly collected trees on the ground.

To find good locations, start with searching online. There are a million ways to do it, but then at a certain point you'll have to find some roads and start driving/exploring. Then you'll have to find out who owns or manages the land. I've put in a lot of miles, sometimes I'll drive for a few days and not find any good spots. Def stay away from National parks, always ask permission. I've found that asking Permission is an art in itself. Always be extremely friendly, try and build some rapport, and explain that you will leave no trace minus the specimens you want to collect. If you can ask in person that's always better. Maybe find somewhere where you can get permits, then offer to trade locations with a collector who has permits in another location. With the mountains, first you'll spot big old ones growing on rock, you want to find trees with crazy deadwood, twist, curve, ibo jin, etc. then you'll want to look for the little old ones around those big old ones:)

For collecting in the Mountains, I use a large pry/wrecking bar, a steel frame pack to tie trees to for the hike down, a sharp folding hand saw, full sized Loppers, trash bags and electrical or packing tape. I use to bring a lot more, but that's what I use 95% of the time. It's great if you can find good trees close to your vehicle, but putting in the miles will get you the best trees. I've also drove many gnarly back roads via 4x4 to find good trees. If you want to really get after it, I recommend being in good shape, at least that way you'll enjoy your experience more and you can cover more miles. When I started collecting I weighed 215 and would struggle to run a few miles. I'm down to 185 now, quit drinking so much, eat healthier and got into trail running. It wasn't all motivated by getting better at collecting, but it's much easier for me to put in the miles while collecting now and I have a lot more fun when out collecting. I like the idea of getting in shape to be a good collector, might be a little silly of an idea, but it is some of my motivation to get in shape. Hope this helps, thank you for asking:)
Can you kindly link me the Randy Knight episode? I cannot find it

Some junipers here are very hard to collect, growing like your CA junipers. Nobody I know attempts it so far, they mostly go for air layering the trunk or big branches.
I have found some incredibly easy ones that grow on pockets, which you can collect with 99% of their rootball in a matter of seconds, but its rare.
The aftercare is still not totally clear to me so I still dont collect junipers
 

Potawatomi13

Imperial Masterpiece
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Federico; Not so sure we can send on Mirai Live episodes if not a subscriber(or at all for that matter). Or even C&P them. If you subscribe you can look up in the Library;).
 

MattE

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i really enjoyed reading this , and all the knowledge i have personally gained from it, What a crazy 10 year journey. i feel limited being in Canada not that big of a bonsai following im having to get my stuff from big box stores and nursery stock, i can collect maples ect but no room to put them lmao . i will just live vicariously though all of you lol
 

FedericoMelis

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Federico; Not so sure we can send on Mirai Live episodes if not a subscriber(or at all for that matter). Or even C&P them. If you subscribe you can look up in the Library;).
Sorry I didn't know that one was a subscribers only video! I meant like a youtube link.
I'll definitely subscribe in the future
 

yenling83

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i really enjoyed reading this , and all the knowledge i have personally gained from it, What a crazy 10 year journey. i feel limited being in Canada not that big of a bonsai following im having to get my stuff from big box stores and nursery stock, i can collect maples ect but no room to put them lmao . i will just live vicariously though all of you lol
Thank you @MattE ! I'm sure there has got to be some great areas to collect in Canada, but might take a lot of looking and driving.
 

River's Edge

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i really enjoyed reading this , and all the knowledge i have personally gained from it, What a crazy 10 year journey. i feel limited being in Canada not that big of a bonsai following im having to get my stuff from big box stores and nursery stock, i can collect maples ect but no room to put them lmao . i will just live vicariously though all of you lol
Lots of Bonsai opportunities in Canada for collecting and acquiring stock. part of the concern might be your location and the climate considerations.
For instance southern Alberta is considerably different from Edmonton or Fort Mac. Sometimes the limitations are space and accommodations.
 

jeezcak3

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Geez.. I am a young guy and still in the learning process. I am in Orange County, CA. I would love to collect something since I already learned how to take care of trees. Would someone guide me to the right direction?
 

Warpig

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Best place to start is looking into if their are any bonsai clubs in your area.
 

a0kalittlema0n

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As one who has dug California Junipers, you have to do it after a lot of good rain which brings out feeders and keeps the dirt from clumping and falling off a ton. Dig a huge rootball and slowly reduce. Also daily misting multiple times and/or placing it on ground on top of fabric cloth with coarse saw dust is a great way to not drown it, then proceed to water it to death (wait what?!).
 

FedericoMelis

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As one who has dug California Junipers, you have to do it after a lot of good rain which brings out feeders and keeps the dirt from clumping and falling off a ton. Dig a huge rootball and slowly reduce. Also daily misting multiple times and/or placing it on ground on top of fabric cloth with coarse saw dust is a great way to not drown it, then proceed to water it to death (wait what?!).
just seen the coarse saw dust approach from Randy Knight, could pine bark chops work the same way?
At some point on the video he talks about an easy substitute but I can't really grasp what he's meaning
 

a0kalittlema0n

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I don't recall a specific substitute, but I can't think of something that retains as much moisture and air as sawdust does.
 

Josh88

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just seen the coarse saw dust approach from Randy Knight, could pine bark chops work the same way?
At some point on the video he talks about an easy substitute but I can't really grasp what he's meaning
If I recall correctly, he suggested the wood shavings used for guinea pig and other small pet bedding sold at any pet shop as an easy alternative.
 

Tycoss

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i really enjoyed reading this , and all the knowledge i have personally gained from it, What a crazy 10 year journey. i feel limited being in Canada not that big of a bonsai following im having to get my stuff from big box stores and nursery stock, i can collect maples ect but no room to put them lmao . i will just live vicariously though all of you lol
The thing with Western Canada, Alberta in particular, is that most traditional Japanese species don’t do well. There are tremendous opportunities for yamadori in the mountains and prairies though. Send me a PM mid spring and I can show you places I’ve found some of mine.
 

FedericoMelis

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If I recall correctly, he suggested the wood shavings used for guinea pig and other small pet bedding sold at any pet shop as an easy alternative.
Yes exactly! But it says something along with that that for some reasons I can't get the grasp of
 
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