Ideas for this Trident Nebari?

Scrogdor

Chumono
Messages
583
Reaction score
481
Location
Oakland, CA
USDA Zone
9B
Not entirely sure how to handle this root mass. My initial thought is to ground layer it or maybe plant it deep and hope roots sprout higher up. But maybe something can be done with what ever is going on here with the use of root grafts. There is a dead part as seen in the pictures.
 

Attachments

  • 320A371F-8203-44B6-B7FE-D345F13CD394.jpeg
    320A371F-8203-44B6-B7FE-D345F13CD394.jpeg
    172.8 KB · Views: 331
  • BD8A75D7-C8B7-4E3A-93C3-6123CD51C35A.jpeg
    BD8A75D7-C8B7-4E3A-93C3-6123CD51C35A.jpeg
    269.3 KB · Views: 282
  • 7CCAB931-06BA-4BCD-80FA-53C39BA7FDEB.jpeg
    7CCAB931-06BA-4BCD-80FA-53C39BA7FDEB.jpeg
    297.7 KB · Views: 178
  • 62BD23EE-3862-46CE-A931-E21BC7568219.jpeg
    62BD23EE-3862-46CE-A931-E21BC7568219.jpeg
    276.7 KB · Views: 185
  • A8C31F13-4392-4409-B6E5-452CFEE54D00.jpeg
    A8C31F13-4392-4409-B6E5-452CFEE54D00.jpeg
    155.6 KB · Views: 188
  • 7C8F6F30-B8AC-4B6D-A53D-F55E1D1EC304.jpeg
    7C8F6F30-B8AC-4B6D-A53D-F55E1D1EC304.jpeg
    150.8 KB · Views: 186
  • 5DBF3430-2267-4CAE-BFFA-2542219D00E1.jpeg
    5DBF3430-2267-4CAE-BFFA-2542219D00E1.jpeg
    170 KB · Views: 179
  • 7D3F9C38-AF28-4981-B082-0DF56AC28BD4.jpeg
    7D3F9C38-AF28-4981-B082-0DF56AC28BD4.jpeg
    161.5 KB · Views: 255

bwaynef

Omono
Messages
1,972
Reaction score
2,329
Location
Clemson SC
USDA Zone
8a
Hope isn't going to fix this one. Air/ground layering would probably be the route I'd take. You could also threadgraft or approach graft roots. Alternatively, you could slow-layer w/ "windows" cut out around the trunk and plant it deeper ...which is very similar to your hope strategy, but much more likely to yield results you're after.

(I listed them in the order I'd choose, though I'll admit I've failed more with trident airlayers than just about anything else I've tried.)
 

leatherback

The Treedeemer
Messages
13,934
Reaction score
26,861
Location
Northern Germany
USDA Zone
7
Normally I am in favour of planting deep and pruning the roots hard. In this case I do not see that solving the issues in a hurry. I guess I would go in the layering direction for this one too.
 

Scrogdor

Chumono
Messages
583
Reaction score
481
Location
Oakland, CA
USDA Zone
9B
Normally I am in favour of planting deep and pruning the roots hard. In this case I do not see that solving the issues in a hurry. I guess I would go in the layering direction for this one too.
I thought about grafting a bunch of seedlings around the sides, letting them graft and grow out, then pruning the roots hard, but I'd still be dealing with that dead bit. Only thing about the ground layer I'm worried about is the lack of space available while also preserving the length of the first section. Been reading the toughest part about tridents is that they bridge the gap pretty easily.
 
Last edited:

misfit11

Omono
Messages
1,326
Reaction score
2,246
Location
Petaluma CA -Zone 9b
USDA Zone
9b
It should given you scraped away all the cambium. I think you made the right decision. That base is a hot mess.
 

Hack Yeah!

Omono
Messages
1,634
Reaction score
3,178
Location
Marietta, GA
USDA Zone
7b
Was this the final placement of your wire tourniquet? I'd try to snug that up as close to the top cut as possible
 

Scrogdor

Chumono
Messages
583
Reaction score
481
Location
Oakland, CA
USDA Zone
9B
Was this the final placement of your wire tourniquet? I'd try to snug that up as close to the top cut as possible
What would be the reason? I thought the main use was some extra protection against callous reaching. I could still snug it up though
 

Potawatomi13

Imperial Masterpiece
Messages
6,168
Reaction score
4,403
Location
Eugene, OR
USDA Zone
8
One has to wonder why you got (bought?) this one with such major defect😕?
 

Deep Sea Diver

Masterpiece
Messages
4,412
Reaction score
9,121
Location
Bothell, WA
USDA Zone
8b
Gosh, a tourniquet would work to flare the trunk as is, but I’d just ground layer this tree. It is as safe as you are going to get as a repair job..

If you do, just make sure the green inside the collar cut is all gone. Use alcohol on the remaining white area jic. I cut a plastic disc to fit on the top edge and wire it in place to get a good root spread. Then it’s merely a matter of backfilling and waiting.

The good thing about ground layers for me is that They are a snap to water and I’m much more inclined to wait a longer time before taking a peek. 😉

Cheers
DSD sends
 

Scrogdor

Chumono
Messages
583
Reaction score
481
Location
Oakland, CA
USDA Zone
9B
Gosh, a tourniquet would work to flare the trunk as is, but I’d just ground layer this tree. It is as safe as you are going to get as a repair job..

If you do, just make sure the green inside the collar cut is all gone. Use alcohol on the remaining white area jic. I cut a plastic disc to fit on the top edge and wire it in place to get a good root spread. Then it’s merely a matter of backfilling and waiting.

The good thing about ground layers for me is that They are a snap to water and I’m much more inclined to wait a longer time before taking a peek. 😉

Cheers
DSD sends
Yeah, this will be my first ground layer attempt. I feel pretty good about it though. Tree is healthy, growth coming out of all sides. I scrapped it pretty good, went around several times.
 

Shibui

Imperial Masterpiece
Messages
7,545
Reaction score
15,209
Location
Yackandandah, Australia
USDA Zone
9?
I cut a plastic disc to fit on the top edge and wire it in place to get a good root spread. Then it’s merely a matter of backfilling and waiting.
My experience says the plastic collar is superfluous on a layer. Tridents love to grow lateral roots. Every layer I have done has produced massive laterals and very few down roots without any intervention apart from the layer.
Everyone is free to put any twist they like on any procedure and I'm sure the collar will produce a great lateral nebari but just be aware the collar may not be responsible for that.

I thought the main use was some extra protection against callous reaching. I could still snug it up though
I agree. It doesn't matter whether the wire is high, mid or low. Just try to have it hard against the sapwood all the way round to get the quickest results.
 

Scrogdor

Chumono
Messages
583
Reaction score
481
Location
Oakland, CA
USDA Zone
9B
So I checked on this the other day, took some peaks. There are 3 or 4 roots coming out of one side, doesn't appear to be any coming out of the other side though, just a ton of callus. Any idea why or way to correct this?
 

leatherback

The Treedeemer
Messages
13,934
Reaction score
26,861
Location
Northern Germany
USDA Zone
7
Time and top-growth. Keep the topsoil moist.

I sometimes clip the growing tips of roots to encourage more rooting to take place but this is not common, nor recommended practice if you want to play it safe!
 

Blksmth88

Sapling
Messages
36
Reaction score
30
Location
Spruce pine, NC
USDA Zone
6B
Don't take this as advice because I don't want to point you wrong. But my guess would be, cover it back and let it go a bit longer. If you get enough roots to sustain the tree I'd assume that it will later start roots where it needs them
 

pandacular

Omono
Messages
1,610
Reaction score
2,725
Location
Seattle, WA
USDA Zone
9a
It's definitely too early for this, but I found it intersting that Ryan Neil re-wounded an air layer that had not taken all the way around the base and packed it up for another year under the layer.
 

Scrogdor

Chumono
Messages
583
Reaction score
481
Location
Oakland, CA
USDA Zone
9B
When is a good time to separate ground layers? I know it's a bit more intense supporting such a chunky tree on new roots vs just an air layer of a branch. Plan on chopping that huge sacrifice branch. When I separate it.
 

Attachments

  • 461C556A-AB31-4061-A820-B7DB3FEBBC1C.jpeg
    461C556A-AB31-4061-A820-B7DB3FEBBC1C.jpeg
    339.9 KB · Views: 111
Last edited:

Maiden69

Masterpiece
Messages
2,306
Reaction score
3,501
Location
Boerne, TX
USDA Zone
8b
I would wait till fall once the leaves start to drop. If you don't have a fall you will need to protect it so it doesn't dry out. Another option would be to wait till spring repot time. On a small branch or tree I would say go ahead now once the heatwave goes away, but not on that one.
 
Top Bottom