Importance of PLENTY of water

Joe Dupre'

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I tend to use the Walter Pall method of growing. Absolutely works for me! One thing occurred to me while watering today. I FLOOD my plants every day of the growing season. The airy soil allows that. I water until the water runs out of the bottom for a few seconds. This gets rid of excess fertilizer, flushes out any stagnant water and pulls in fresh air. This "fresh air" is what stirred my interest. The air we breath is about 78% Nitrogen. What is a very important element in fertilizer?? Why, it's Nitrogen. So, I'm putting "free" nitrogen down into my tree's root system every day. Now, whether or not the tree can take up nitrogen in that form, I don't know. My hunch is that it can. Anyone have any data on this?

I also noticed something else. I have a few trees growing in the shade and sometimes just give them a short watering instead of flooding them. I've noticed that they don't grow as well until I give them a really good flooding once a week.
 

hin175

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simple answer, plants cannot use nitrogen in the air, or in the air in the soil.

A little bit more elaborated answer would be : some plants (e.g. the ones in the legume family - Fabaceae) can, with the help of symbionts (mostly bacteria). But most of the plants we cultivate cannot.
 

zanduh

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Plants absorb nitrogen after it has been broken down by bacteria. The nitrogen in the air is N2 which is a very strong bond and very difficult for bacteria to break down. You actually need something like lightning to split N2 naturally.
 

cmeg1

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I like the oxygen and continual flushing.......tree not nitrogen fixing.......
Lots of water is very good in a free draining media.
I use straight perlite.

What strength? And how often the feed? Just curious.I am currently going typical full strength bloom formula to strengthen my trees I just brought outdoors to prepare for winter dormancy.
I feed every watering...........as I understand it the excess salt actually lessens water uptake by the plant to a slightly stressing degree which then creates the oils,terpines and strengthening mechanisms for plants..........flushing in this scenario is a win win........as I do this to have at least 50% runoff in my lower strength every watering method.
 
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sorce

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You actually need something like lightning to split N2 naturally.

This makes me wonder if there are bacteria and fungi that fit the bill.

I doubt we know.

Sorce
 

cmeg1

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This makes me wonder if there are bacteria and fungi that fit the bill.
There are nitrogen fixing bacteria to add to media if so desired...actually very cool and will survive nicely in a mineral ion( salt) media.Hydro growers like myself add microbes on a weekly basis.Myco fungi not needed at all if using instant available type phospherous.....root will expell it for a pathogen( so I’ve learned in the science).
 

zanduh

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This makes me wonder if there are bacteria and fungi that fit the bill.

I doubt we know.

Sorce

I looked it up and there are specialized prokaryotes that can do it but it seems that all the examples provided either lived in the ocean or live symbiotically with plants such as legumes which we know aid in the process of nitrogen fixation. So I don’t think there exists a standalone bacteria that we could add to our soil for the fixation. I’ll keep reading though.

Edit: above Cmeg had more information than me about additives that do exist :)
 

cmeg1

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I am curious to break down the 5x strength fertilizer method .....and open media method ......if this is what the poster of this thread is doing...or have I already?
Not unheard of in hydroponic gardening as people can pour as much as 5. EC NPK on their flowering plants for this increased brix effect!!!!
That’s like 3x right there,so 5x seems fun as heck really.....perhaps weekly is beneficial for the neede flushing....hence plenty of water......great science really.
 
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cmeg1

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So I don’t think there exists a standalone bacteria that we could add to our soil for the fixation. I’ll keep reading though.
Look into NPK Raw microbes or his parent company Kalix.
He mentions in the hydro course I bought from him that he integrates the nitrogen fixing bacteria in his formula’s.
 

zanduh

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I am curious to break down the 5x strength fertilizer method .....and open media method ......if this is what the poster of this thread is doing...or have I already?

Walter Pall talks about just buying the cheapest fertilizer possible on his blog which makes sense for his application since he has so many trees to do this for. But if we are taking a look at Urea vs. Nitrate Nitrogen vs. Ammoniacal Nitrogen and the time required for each to be absorbed by the roots my guess is that Urea with its 4-5 hour breakdown period (and waste as CO2 and Ammonium) is orders of magnitude more inefficient.
 

leatherback

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Walter Pall talks about just buying the cheapest fertilizer possible on his blog which makes sense for his application since he has so many trees to do this for. But if we are taking a look at Urea vs. Nitrate Nitrogen vs. Ammoniacal Nitrogen and the time required for each to be absorbed by the roots my guess is that Urea with its 4-5 hour breakdown period (and waste as CO2 and Ammonium) is orders of magnitude more inefficient.
Thing is.. If you add enough, it does not matter. Overfertilizing in a way.
 

cmeg1

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Walter Pall talks about just buying the cheapest fertilizer possible on his blog which makes sense for his application since he has so many trees to do this for. But if we are taking a look at Urea vs. Nitrate Nitrogen vs. Ammoniacal Nitrogen and the time required for each to be absorbed by the roots my guess is that Urea with its 4-5 hour breakdown period (and waste as CO2 and Ammonium) is orders of magnitude more inefficient.
Could get creative with the nitrogen form for sure.....how often though? Like once a week?
Approach is actually kind of cool.......
I am totally using a higher rate of fert on my trees for this Autumn season for the increased brix and essential protection agents that are produced from this.
 

Joe Dupre'

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OK, worst case scenario.... Say none of my trees can use nitrogen directly from the atmosphere, BUT, I'm introducing it to bacteria and fungi in my rich, highly organic soil and THEY break it down into something the trees can use. I feed them and they feed my trees. I'd call that a win.

Another angle. While all this nitrogen is being taken into the soil, 21% of that air is oxygen, and oxygen CAN be taken in by the roots. Either way, it speaks FOR watering your trees aggressively.
 

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