Intro.. this hobby escalated quickly!

[Sammy V]

Hi everyone! I'm technically not new, I had a Juniper in college and promptly killed it.. or it may have gone dormant for the winter, and I thought it died.

Just got back into it full force, after passing a roadside bonsai stand 150 times over the last 2 years. It's a 3 year old Juniper, and I'm hoping to not kill this one! I'm a man of many hobbies, and I usually go overboard, so in a matter of weeks I built a small greenhouse in my garage (partially to grow some peppers and random small things, half of the greenhouse space is for the wife). I'm also trying my luck (and learning all I can) to propagate a handful of different species from seed. I get very little direct light in my house, so I figure with a north facing, covered and shaded (in Winter) patio, a south facing garage I can open for direct sunlight year-round, and a temperature/humidity controlled box in the garage with a couple ViparSpectra XS1500 lights, I should be able to keep anything alive, right? Right?? That has yet to be determined...

My only concern so far is the Juniper, it's turning brown in spots, and it's been getting really brittle over the last week. The needles seem dry, but I keep the soil moist at all times. Until yesterday, I didn't know about Junipers needing to go into dormancy (hence why I may have "killed" the first one years ago), and I thought the whole point of a greenhouse was to trick plants into thinking it was Summer all year (rookie mistake?) So since I got it a month ago, I had been keeping it under bright lights all day, occasionally putting it in direct sun, and the box was usually around 70-80F (humidity around 65%). I've been spraying it multiple times/day, so I don't think water is an issue. But now I'm just hoping it's going into dormancy even though I've been keeping it warm, because plants are probably smarter than me. But my question in a nutshell- Is a bronze color and fairly crispy foliage normal for this time of year? I'm in Zone 5 (Denver).

My next addition was a Ficus from the garden store a couple weeks ago (not sure what kind of Ficus). I potted this one, and hoping it does well in the greenhouse for the winter, and indoor/outdoor in the summer. So far so good!

Seeds I'm trying to sprout are Twisted Pomegranate, Coastal Redwood, and Atlas Cedar, and I'm stumbling my way through stratifying a bunch of other seeds that need 4-6 months. My thinking with trying seeds is that they're pretty cheap, and I'll learn a lot whether they fail or succeed.. and then try again!

So far I haven't done any wiring or pruning, I'm really hoping to take a class from a local master soon, but luckily I have years to learn that art. Especially with seeds! Ha. Good thing I'm also patient.

Anyway, there's my long-winded introduction, and some pictures below! Again, I'm super new to this but trying to learn as much as possible- if anything I mentioned or what you see in the pictures is horribly wrong, please let me know!

 

[Potawatomi13]

Best of fortune.

 

[ShadyStump]

Welcome aboard the nuthouse!
Greetings from Cañon City! Some day there'll be another Coloradan here NOT in Denver.

my question in a nutshell- Is a bronze color and fairly crispy foliage normal for this time of year?

Sorry, no. You killed it again.
Junipers need real outdoor sunlight more than any other tree I've heard of.
Don't feel too bad. I've done it, and even knew what I was getting into when I tried. I'm the sort that intentionally tries doomed experiments
I've taken up wood carving in the past year to make myself feel better about it.
Dormancy is triggered by a combination of dropping temperatures and decreasing sunlight. If you'd kept your juniper in there, but the box was a fridge, you'd be alright.

Can't see the bark clearly enough to tell what sort of ficus that is, but they can do great indoors under a good light. I kept a ficus benjamina on my desk at work under a desk lamp with a cheap grow bulb for a while. It's at home now, but still doing fine.

Seeds are fun, and, yes, you learn allot doing it. Right move, even if they take forever.

 

[Topdec]

I'm no expert but I think once you start to see dry/brown/crispy needles on a juniper/conifer I think its already been dead for a while as it takes some time for the needles to lose their green colour! Sorry

 

[rockm]

Your juniper is dead or mostly dead. The olive drab/brown foliage is dead foliage,unfortunately. Junipers don't change texture or color when "dormant." Technically, evergreen conifers such as junipers and pines really don't go dormant, at least not in the same way as deciduous trees change color and drop foliage, hence the "evergreen." When foliage on a juniper changes to light colored and crispy it's been dead for some time.

Indoors, conifers suffer tremendously, too dark and mostly too dry--despite the misting, which comes with its own set of issues--misting doesn't help much. Junipers need intense sunlight to remain healthy as well as outdoor levels of humidity and air circulation which can't really be matched indoors without specialized lighting and constant whole room humidification.

Roadside sellers often use extremely bad soil. Those sellers also typically are only moving merchandise and don't have much skill level at keeping what they're selling alive beyond getting them from a wholesaler and onto their sales bench. Under the rocks on the surface, the soil in your pot looks pretty bad.

 

[Taste]

The juniper will slowly turn into crispy toast over the next month or so. As said, they begin showing the sign of death after they've grasped it. Your ficus looks like a microcarpa cutting, which can live in the greenhouse youve set up, and will enjoy those conditions,and if met with proper lighting and humidity it will reward you.

 

[Lorax7]

Your juniper is dead or mostly dead. The olive drab/brown foliage is dead foliage,unfortunately. Junipers don't change texture or color when "dormant." Technically, evergreen conifers such as junipers and pines really don't go dormant, at least not in the same way as deciduous trees change color and drop foliage, hence the "evergreen." When foliage on a juniper changes to light colored and crispy it's been dead for some time.

Junipers can change color somewhat during the winter. The foliage color shifts to be a bit purplish. It’s possible that it’s too warm for them to do this in your locale. They will do it here in Michigan. That said, I agree with your assessment of the color of the juniper in the photos. That’s dead foliage, not a winter color shift.

 

[Colorado]

Hi everyone! I'm technically not new, I had a Juniper in college and promptly killed it.. or it may have gone dormant for the winter, and I thought it died.

Just got back into it full force, after passing a roadside bonsai stand 150 times over the last 2 years. It's a 3 year old Juniper, and I'm hoping to not kill this one! I'm a man of many hobbies, and I usually go overboard, so in a matter of weeks I built a small greenhouse in my garage (partially to grow some peppers and random small things, half of the greenhouse space is for the wife). I'm also trying my luck (and learning all I can) to propagate a handful of different species from seed. I get very little direct light in my house, so I figure with a north facing, covered and shaded (in Winter) patio, a south facing garage I can open for direct sunlight year-round, and a temperature/humidity controlled box in the garage with a couple ViparSpectra XS1500 lights, I should be able to keep anything alive, right? Right?? That has yet to be determined...

My only concern so far is the Juniper, it's turning brown in spots, and it's been getting really brittle over the last week. The needles seem dry, but I keep the soil moist at all times. Until yesterday, I didn't know about Junipers needing to go into dormancy (hence why I may have "killed" the first one years ago), and I thought the whole point of a greenhouse was to trick plants into thinking it was Summer all year (rookie mistake?) So since I got it a month ago, I had been keeping it under bright lights all day, occasionally putting it in direct sun, and the box was usually around 70-80F (humidity around 65%). I've been spraying it multiple times/day, so I don't think water is an issue. But now I'm just hoping it's going into dormancy even though I've been keeping it warm, because plants are probably smarter than me. But my question in a nutshell- Is a bronze color and fairly crispy foliage normal for this time of year? I'm in Zone 5 (Denver).

My next addition was a Ficus from the garden store a couple weeks ago (not sure what kind of Ficus). I potted this one, and hoping it does well in the greenhouse for the winter, and indoor/outdoor in the summer. So far so good!

Seeds I'm trying to sprout are Twisted Pomegranate, Coastal Redwood, and Atlas Cedar, and I'm stumbling my way through stratifying a bunch of other seeds that need 4-6 months. My thinking with trying seeds is that they're pretty cheap, and I'll learn a lot whether they fail or succeed.. and then try again!

So far I haven't done any wiring or pruning, I'm really hoping to take a class from a local master soon, but luckily I have years to learn that art. Especially with seeds! Ha. Good thing I'm also patient.

Anyway, there's my long-winded introduction, and some pictures below! Again, I'm super new to this but trying to learn as much as possible- if anything I mentioned or what you see in the pictures is horribly wrong, please let me know!


View attachment 461351

Welcome!

 

[Sammy V]

Wow, thanks for all the replies! I'm sad to learn that I'm now a serial killer of Junipers, but maybe the next one won't become another statistic.

I read a comment in a different thread that said sometimes bonsais thrive on neglect, and that a typical noob mistake is to try too many things when you're just starting out, and that rings true in my case! Kind of ironic and funny that if I had just opened the garage door and put the tree where nature intended it to be, it would still be alive. Instead, I was trying to recreate nature in my greenhouse box and went way too far trying to keep alive something that has had no problem staying alive for millions of years in the great outdoors. Lesson learned! And there is still a tiny bit of soft green needles, so I have it outside now to see if nature can save it (not holding out much hope though).

Looking forward to lurking less and posting more... I'll share my first success story if and when the seeds sprout!

 

[Sammy V]

Roadside sellers often use extremely bad soil. Those sellers also typically are only moving merchandise and don't have much skill level at keeping what they're selling alive beyond getting them from a wholesaler and onto their sales bench. Under the rocks on the surface, the soil in your pot looks pretty bad.

I'll do an autopsy soon and see how it was potted. Maybe I'm not entirely to blame, though I'm certain I didn't help it any.

 

[Sammy V]

Welcome aboard the nuthouse!
Greetings from Cañon City! Some day there'll be another Coloradan here NOT in Denver.

I'm actually in Westminster, that should count as not Denver.

 

[Sammy V]

Can't see the bark clearly enough to tell what sort of ficus that is, but they can do great indoors under a good light.

Oh yeah, I think the garden store folks said it was a fiddle leaf or fig ficus (or is that the same thing?) But the leaves don't look like pictures I've seen of fiddle leaf ficus. Here's a better pic of the bark.

 

[Ugo]

Hi!

I changed my mind about greenhouse.
Im not trying to maintain a specific condition all year long in the greenhouse but Im using it to dampen the major and sudden temperature changes from one day to the other and between season.
So the trees will cool down to dormancy temperature but will take more time then outside.
The temperature will also rise up before Spring if I allow it but the trees will be protected from flash frost.
That will extend my growing season, the trees are protected for direct sun ,dissicating wind and -32deg C but still go into dormancy due to low temperature and shortened light hours.
(All decidious stays in a pitch black room once leaves are fallen while conifers receive a few hours of indirect sunlight)

For example the lowest temperature the trees will see during their dormancy period is between 2 to 5deg C But it takes more time to drop into theses numbers.
Before Spring I let the sun inside, the room can rise up to 12 to 15 DegC while outisde is still frozen solid.
The point is damping the temperature changes. Once there is no more frost coming I can start to move the trees outside under a shade cloth for a few weeks again to dampen the effect of direct sunlight.
So I advise you to use a greenhouse yes but to dampen the seasons changes instead of skipping seasons, to provide less harsh conditions then the outside and by doing that extend your growing season by giving better conditions to the trees.
People mostly aim to extend their growing season but I suggest you aim at damping the temperature and the elements instead of eleminate them.

That doesnt apply to my trees that are not winter hardy (ex: Ficus!) where I have a seperate green house to really skip my Autum and Winter.

Hope it helps!
Hugo

 

[ShadyStump]

I'm actually in Westminster, that should count as not Denver.

Nope! To the rest of Colorado, anything north of Colorado Springs is Denver. The domain of radioactive mutant zombies who've never seen a cow in real life.

Definitely NOT fiddle leaf, and doesn't look like benjamina or microcarpa either. I'm not certain what species it is. I'm no expert, though.
Yes, fig and ficus are synonyms, and there are ALLOT of different species with very different characteristics.

 

[jonfromchicago]

If you're still interested in keeping a bonsai indoors, try getting tropicals instead. Most tropicals can be kept indoors; many have kept tropical trees alive indoors for years, and I have done so as well. By the look of your grow light, it should be powerful enough for tropicals. Check out these species Brazilian Rain Trees, Ficus, Podocarpus, and Portulacaria Afra.

 

[Sammy V]

If you're still interested in keeping a bonsai indoors, try getting tropicals instead. Most tropicals can be kept indoors; many have kept tropical trees alive indoors for years, and I have done so as well. By the look of your grow light, it should be powerful enough for tropicals. Check out these species Brazilian Rain Trees, Ficus, Podocarpus, and Portulacaria Afra.

Great idea, thank you!

 

[dbonsaiw]

Well, if it's any conciliation, if you're not killing trees you're not doing bonsai right. Or at least that's what I keep telling myself.

 

[Sammy V]

Well, if it's any conciliation, if you're not killing trees you're not doing bonsai right. Or at least that's what I keep telling myself.

If killing trees is wrong, I don't wanna be right!

 

[dbonsaiw]

If killing trees is wrong, I don't wanna be right!

The good news is I've only killed trees when I do stupid shit. And then I learn not to do that. Once we calm down on the killing of trees, look forward to years of simply mangling them.

 

[Sammy V]

I think I've calmed down on the killing of trees (for now) and picked up a few more new ones. I'm hoping I don't put them on death row right off the bat. Cork Jade and Hibiscus.
I haven't been able to find an answer on this, but I can/should replant them in a bonsai pot right away.. right? I've got plenty of heat (between 65-80°) and humidity consistently around 65%, if I need it.

No growth on my seeds or moss yet, I probably pre-killed those somehow. But it's only been 2-3 weeks. It also just dawned on me that I have a super healthy 15 year old Boxwood bush in my front yard, and might try a clipping from that.