introduction and a few questions on Indoor

Need2Tinker

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First things first my name is Randall, I live in Oregon, I'm totally new to the art on bonsai but I'm well involved with hobbies that take time and patience. I've had reef tanks for about 10 years.
My first question, does anyone have any first hand experience with a light like this that will actually grow an Indoor plant like a tiger bark? http://www.bonsaiboy.com/cgi-bonsai...e34&ss_parm=A4481527f08c714e2d45db5602c52a898
I've tried to search and couldn't come up with much forgive me if it's been covered a million times!
Also is there a specific book or online source that is a great help with training, wiring etc? I'd say keeping the plant alive (my outdoors) should not be an issue I've had gardens etc. Thanks for the help in advance and any tips are much appreciated!
 

sorce

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Welcome Randall !

You may have an old coral light that would work better.

Hundred trees won't fit under there!

Eventually, you'll need more space!

Sorce
 

RickMartin

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Welcome to the community. If you were into reef's then you have a light that will work better. I have my reef light on my fukien tea tree and it does great.

Rick
 

Need2Tinker

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I have a 2 foot t5ho 2 bulb fixture I used over my sump. Would that be adequate for a couple plants? I've got a tigers bark and a Chinese elm on the way right now.
 

Ross

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Hi There,
Welcome to the site. There is much to learn here and many experienced folks who can help you along the way. In my experience, there is a big difference between keeping a plant alive indoors, and keeping a well-proportioned bonsai indoors. In theory it's possible to grow bonsai indoors, but in practice, it is not feasible unless you are willing to invest some serious coin. You may be able to keep a couple ficus, a chinese elm, or a fukien tea alive indoors for a few years, but it will be a waste of time unless your goal is to keep some lanky trees alive on your windowsill or in your makeshift greenhouse. You need the sun, wind, rain, etc. that only nature can provide. If you look at the bonsai put forth by those growing solely indoors, you mostly see ficus with sparse foliage, huge leaves, white residue on leaves and pot rim, and insect problems. That is no slam on those individuals, as most have no other options, and have been working incredibly hard to achieve even those results. My advice would be to make every effort to obtain local/native trees and keep them outdoors and well-watered year-round. Full-sun allows trees to quickly grow more, smaller, denser, and healthier leaves/needles.

Wow that was a long reply, hope I didn't cause controversy or offend anyone, I'm just shooting from the hip.

Ross
 

Need2Tinker

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Awesome, thanks for the reply Ross. My plan is to let them go outside in the early spring I am just afraid getting a plant from a Florida nursery and plopping it outside in Oregon when it's 30 outside may stress it.
 

Ross

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Awesome, thanks for the reply Ross. My plan is to let them go outside in the early spring I am just afraid getting a plant from a Florida nursery and plopping it outside in Oregon when it's 30 outside may stress it.

You are correct sir, most tropical plants will die if placed outside below freezing, so don't do that. Any tropicals you want to keep around will need to be babied through the winter indoors, shuffled in-and-out during the spring, and kept outdoors all summer. We've all been there. I grew some stuff indoors for a couple years while I lived in an apartment, but when I got a yard it was a revelation. I eventually sold or gave away all my "indoor trees" and went out and collected (dug up) a whole new batch of trees to basically start fresh with. If I had done that right off the bat, I would have saved myself a lot of time. In Oregon, you have a lot of options that I can't even grow in Dallas, like Fir, Spruce, White Pine etc... Most trees you bring from other climates will have special needs, whereas local/native varieties are evolved for your area and will be easier to care for in that they can handle your high and low temps summer and winter with little or no protection.
 

Need2Tinker

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You are correct sir, most tropical plants will die if placed outside below freezing, so don't do that. Any tropicals you want to keep around will need to be babied through the winter indoors, shuffled in-and-out during the spring, and kept outdoors all summer. We've all been there. I grew some stuff indoors for a couple years while I lived in an apartment, but when I got a yard it was a revelation. I eventually sold or gave away all my "indoor trees" and went out and collected (dug up) a whole new batch of trees to basically start fresh with. If I had done that right off the bat, I would have saved myself a lot of time. In Oregon, you have a lot of options that I can't even grow in Dallas, like Fir, Spruce, White Pine etc... Most trees you bring from other climates will have special needs, whereas local/native varieties are evolved for your area and will be easier to care for in that they can handle your high and low temps summer and winter with little or no protection.
Thanks! I had to have the elm they are beautiful trees and I kind of figured I'd have to spend some extra effort on it, I'm going to make a trip out to our local nursery that specializes in bonsai and get some advice on which trees will do well/are native to the area and pick up a few after Christmas! I can already see I'll have multiple plants everywhere pretty quickly haha.
 

RKatzin

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Hi Randall, welcome from a fellow Oregonian. What part of the state are you located in. Freezing temps, I'd guess somewhere on the east side. We hardly ever freeze here, not long and not deep, here in the Rogue Valley. Happy growing, Rick
 

Need2Tinker

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Hi Randall, welcome from a fellow Oregonian. What part of the state are you located in. Freezing temps, I'd guess somewhere on the east side. We hardly ever freeze here, not long and not deep, here in the Rogue Valley. Happy growing, Rick
Hi rick, I'm at the top of a hill in Oregon city, it doesn't get horrible but last year we had about 2 weeks last year with below freezing temps. I'm still new to this so I'm not sure what the little guys can withstand!
 

sorce

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Need2tinker,

Ross is mostly right...for a hip shot. There are many folks though that do grow nice trees indoors, and a lot of us just use fluorescents.

The only thing I am not a fan of....is the spring shuffle. It is not good for the plant IMO. I take mine in Once at 50 degrees and that's it. No sulking or leaf drop. Think drip acclamation.
You wouldn't toss a coral from tank to tank. One move makes it easier to acclimate.

Excellent places in Oregon. It is our Mecca. No Florida for you! (Anymore)

Pics!?

Sorce
 

Paradox

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Found this guy anyone have any input? Only issue is see is its not height adjustable but stands at 18 inches tall. http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/jump-start-t5-modular-grow-light-systems.html

Not tall enough unless you have only mame and shohin. If you have a place too hang a shop light, it is very easy to make it height adjustable with a long to enough chain and "S" hooks. My setup in the thread you started about indoor light setups is adjustable.

I had another setup from the same company and the light bulbs were not standard size, so you had to order replacements from them and they were more expensive than standard ones. It only had one bulb and wasnt enough so I built the system I posted in the other thread for about the same price as the one you linked which has 6 bulbs (bulbs were sold seperately but I bought a box of 10. The price per bulb wasnt that much)
 
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Need2Tinker

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OK cool. Thank you! My only issue is my wife won't let me hang anything from the ceiling so I may just build a setup like in the other thread.
 

coh

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Count me as one who "shuffles" my tropicals in and out both in the spring and fall. I can't say that it really benefits them, but none of my willow leaf ficuses (I have 2) have dropped a single leaf since coming indoors. Same for a brush cherry and jaboticaba. Water jasmine, on the other hand...haven't been able to figure out how to keep that one happy, indoors or out.

I just feel that keeping them exposed to outdoor light as long as possible is the best thing for them. Indoor lighting (and I use a combo of metal halide, compact fluorescent and regular fluorescent) is just an approximation of the real thing.

Chris
 

Paradox

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Tinker, do you have a basement that doesnt get too cold? Most dont get below 55 or so in the winter. My basement is at 65 deg right now and these lights heat up the area on that table to about 75-80 deg F when they are on.

Just thinking: most basements are the "man's territory" so the wife might not care so much about lights hanging down there. lol


I also move my tropicals outside during the summer when it gets warm enough. The lights are just for overwintering them. Ive had the ficus for 1 year exactly and I got the BRT this summer so Im still learning about them but so far so good I think.
 

Need2Tinker

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Unfortunately I dont. But I do have a perfect big table against One of my walls I'm going to convert to a display stand. I just have to build a decent looking rack system for the lights :)
 

Need2Tinker

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Need2tinker,

Ross is mostly right...for a hip shot. There are many folks though that do grow nice trees indoors, and a lot of us just use fluorescents.

The only thing I am not a fan of....is the spring shuffle. It is not good for the plant IMO. I take mine in Once at 50 degrees and that's it. No sulking or leaf drop. Think drip acclamation.
You wouldn't toss a coral from tank to tank. One move makes it easier to acclimate.

Excellent places in Oregon. It is our Mecca. No Florida for you! (Anymore)

Pics!?

Sorce

This is the elm, it showed up yesterday! I'm heading to our local nursery tomorrow to grab a few more trees.
 

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Need2Tinker

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Went out to the Portland nursery today to grab a juniper and almost left with more than I should have haha
That place has a great selection and great prices! Only paid 39 bucks for this juniper I can't wait for spring so I can repot it and do a little trimming and wiring!
 

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2Sunny

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I hope the original poster won't mind if I add to the conversation. You see I'm in much the same boat.



Hi There,
Welcome to the site. There is much to learn here and many experienced folks who can help you along the way. In my experience, there is a big difference between keeping a plant alive indoors, and keeping a well-proportioned bonsai indoors. In theory it's possible to grow bonsai indoors, but in practice, it is not feasible unless you are willing to invest some serious coin. You may be able to keep a couple ficus, a chinese elm, or a fukien tea alive indoors for a few years, but it will be a waste of time unless your goal is to keep some lanky trees alive on your windowsill or in your makeshift greenhouse. You need the sun, wind, rain, etc. that only nature can provide. If you look at the bonsai put forth by those growing solely indoors, you mostly see ficus with sparse foliage, huge leaves, white residue on leaves and pot rim, and insect problems. That is no slam on those individuals, as most have no other options, and have been working incredibly hard to achieve even those results. My advice would be to make every effort to obtain local/native trees and keep them outdoors and well-watered year-round. Full-sun allows trees to quickly grow more, smaller, denser, and healthier leaves/needles.

Wow that was a long reply, hope I didn't cause controversy or offend anyone, I'm just shooting from the hip.

Ross

No offense taken, but clearly the words of an avid artist!

As one totally new to this forum and the world of Bonsai I was wondering if you wouldn't mind expanding on the subject ever so slightly. You see I am an expert in my own little hobby world of growing hard coral and know the value of an informed opinion, but my dilemma is that I was given an "indoor" bonsai tree for Christmas and as a lover of all things alive I plan on trying my darndest to keep this little tree alive and perhaps even thriving if that is possible . . . so with that in mind here are my questions:

1) Is growing a Bonsai Tree "indoors" truly impossible?
2) Does artificial light make a difference if such light is adequate?
3) If you were in my shoes would you simply throw the tree away?
4) Would a dual 400 watt metal halide fixture with 4 T5 lamps be an adequate light?


And here is some background information on my personal situation.

I believe the tree is an Ulmus Parvifolia. I have had it since Christmas day. It has lost about a fifth of it's foliage maybe a little less. I am using the "chopstick method" to check soil moisture and watering when needed to keep the lower level moist. I have ordered a humidity tray. It gets about 8 to 9 hours of near direct light per day (at least 'til spring when the trees get leaves, but then I can move it outdoors). The room stays 65 degrees plus or minus a couple degrees.

So basically there it is . . .

Keep the tree and make a go of it, or just pack it in now and try an outdoor locally grown tree at a later date?

Thanks for any and all thoughts on the topic.

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and just for grins here's a photo of my aquarium . . .


FTS5-3-1.jpg
 
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