Is this JBP worth the investment?

[Maloghurst]

Hello all, saw this Small needle cultivar of JBP for 50% off, $45.00. Trunk looks pretty good with aged bark and taper etc. not sure about this cultivar though (back budding etc) looks pretty good to me but didn't want to waste my time, money and effort if the experts don't see the potential. Thank you, Mike

 

[Thomas J.]

This tree for the price would be excellent for a front yard tree planted in the ground and made to look as if the owner there were a bonsai enthusiast. But for a tree that would be considered a bonsai in a pot, I really don't think so. Too tall to be considered as such. I guess you'll some comments saying whack it down but then you had better hope for the best in the way of getting a good leader right in the place where you'll need one. As I said it's a lovely JBP now just the way it is for a yard planting, wish I could get one for that price that looks like that for my front yard.

 

[johng]

pros -
kotobuki is a good cultivar
price...$45 is dirt cheap for this cultivar
no visible graft
there are a couple low branches with foliage not too far from the trunk

Cons
it is at least a 10 year project requiring a major trunk chop and then time to rebuild tree
can't see any roots...
could have massively ugly grafting scar under the soil level
would most likely require grafting
asking a question like this leads me to believe you are not terribly experienced

 

[Maloghurst]

pros -
kotobuki is a good cultivar
price...$45 is dirt cheap for this cultivar
no visible graft
there are a couple low branches with foliage not too far from the trunk

Cons
it is at least a 10 year project requiring a major trunk chop and then time to rebuild tree
can't see any roots...
could have massively ugly grafting scar under the soil level
would most likely require grafting
asking a question like this leads me to believe you are not terribly experienced

Thanks for replying, no I'm not very experienced. 2 years working with mostly deciduous bonsai and very little experience with pines. I have done a lot of reading and videos on pine techniques and I can recognize decent material when I see it. But not enough experience to see problems that would arise down the road. Any bonsai (pre bonsai) I purchase will be a 5-10 year journey so no problem with patience if someone can tell me that after ten years I won't have wasted time on a junk tree. Im not able to invest in any mature bonsai and really want the experience of creating it myself.
I believe you are saying this could be a good investment with the reservations of potential nightmare under soil line. I did dig around the nebari a little when I was there and it felt like a pretty tight root mass tapering away from the trunk.

 

[aml1014]

I'd be all over it but as John said that's a long term project which your fine with.
I would pay that price any day for that one with no question!

Aaron

 

[jcrossett]

I'd jump on that in a heart beat.

That trunk size and low branching. And with the right work it should back bud nicely.

I'd pop the pot off and see if it's going to need repotting.

But looks heathy and has a good size bud ready for next year already.

 

[jeanluc83]

I might be inclined to save my money for something better.

Have you been to Bonsai Northwest? I stopped in a couple of years ago when I had some down time on a business trip. Their prices seemed reasonable.

 

[petegreg]

I would take the tall part as a sacrifice branch and that someone has done it for you. You will need some three years to reduce and remove the SB. But you can start wiring and building future tree from the lower branches. If I met this tree, I'd take it.

 

[ColinFraser]

and taper etc.

?
Not really above the first branch or two; were you thinking of chopping to there and regrowing + grafting as has been mentioned?

I agree with the landscape tree assessment - it's nice for that, especially at the price.

 

[Don Blackmond]

The real question: why would you not buy it?

 

[johng]

if someone can tell me that after ten years I won't have wasted time on a junk tree.

That is completely on you...no one can make that promise for you... Give a clone of that tree to 10 people and in 10 years you would have 10 completely different trees...some good, some not so good...maybe 1 excellent.
Most trees have some potential...whether a given individual can maximize that potential is far less about the tree and far more about the horticultural and styling skills of the individual.
I would say go for it as $45 is really not a big investment for any 10 year project...even if the tree never reaches your vision for it...I bet you learn something about the species and yourself along the way

If you still have that tree after 10 years it will be worth more than you paid Potentially 10-20x more if you have the right stuff!

 

[jcrossett]

Tbh that tree may just be great for air layers and cutting I'm not sure about that varient but for 45 it's worth a shot imo.

 

[LanceMac10]

NEBG has a couple of these about 3-4 years old I'd say......for a $150....you can do the math.....

 

[Paradox]

I think it would be more time and work than its worth to try and bonsai that and no guarantee the tree will give you what you need to do it.

Nice tree for the front lawn.

Save up for a better tree grown with bonsai in mind. Youll get a nice tree in less than half the time.

 

[Paradox]

NEBG has a couple of these about 3-4 years old I'd say......for a $150....you can do the math.....

Regarding Lance's comment (not calling you out Lance, just wanted to add to it).

Remember you are also paying for someone's time to do the work to start making the tree into bonsai instead of growing into what you see in the picture above. So while it may be 3x more in price, the time to a nice bonsai is also cut by 2/3 and you know you have something there to work with.

 

[sorce]

I think it's pretty.

Pretty sure it would be no less pretty if all that remained for a while was in the first pic.

I would Probly be passed wether or not it is a good investment and already be trying to find $45 or an excuse for the Sorceress!

Sorce

 

[vicn]

I think that for $45, you will get all kinds of good lessons from this tree. You can air layer off the top. You can chop at the bottom and wire that second left branch up for a new apex. You can practice all of the cool pine practices.....decandling, cutting between nodes to get back budding, etc, so that you can be familiar with how to work a really good pine when you have more cash. You could take this tree to workshops as practice. Not to mention workingg on the nebari.

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

To add some perspective, here is 10 years in the life of a JBP that was grown all along to become bonsai. It's still a few years away from "finished" in my view.
Spring 2007:

Late summer 2016:

I think 10 years with that kotobuki is optimistic, but the price is good, so is the cultivar. Just don't try to make the whole tree into the finished bonsai. Develop a couple low branches into your final branches and use the tall stuff as sacrifice.

 

[Paradox]

To add some perspective, here is 10 years in the life of a JBP that was grown all along to become bonsai. It's still a few years away from "finished" in my view.
Spring 2007:
View attachment 116533
Late summer 2016:
View attachment 116534
I think 10 years with that kotobuki is optimistic, but the price is good, so is the cultivar. Just don't try to make the whole tree into the finished bonsai. Develop a couple low branches into your final branches and use the tall stuff as sacrifice.

Another perfect example of what time and patience can accomplish

 

[Maloghurst]

Thank you for all the responses. Responses pretty divided. The cultivar is good and it's capable of becoming bonsai so I'm gonna get it. Having never seen this cultivar I wanted to make sure it can be used for bonsai. Assuming everyone would know that I plan on chopping and develop a new apex (not using the whole tree). I will definitely learn from the experience. Thank you all! I will keep everyone updated