Jacaranda trouble

GunGoose

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Hello, I am new here and somewhat new to bonsai, I have been trying to grow bonsais for a few years now but always manage to kill them. Currently I have a few bonsais that are a little over 2 years that I have grown from a seed. One of them is a jacaranda Mimosiolia. I have been watching this tree closely but it always seems to oscillate between looking fine and looking "sick or unhealthy. The lower leaves often seem to turn brownish and dies, however it seems to be growing new sprouts off the top. I was a little worried I was overwatering it so I have been trying to reduce how much water it takes.

I currently live in Washington and have brought it in doors for the winter. I read the like to have a lot of sun so I have a sun lamp for it. Am I making any mistakes? Should I be watching out for anything like sickness or bugs?


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eugenev2

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Hello, I am new here and somewhat new to bonsai, I have been trying to grow bonsais for a few years now but always manage to kill them. Currently I have a few bonsais that are a little over 2 years that I have grown from a seed. One of them is a jacaranda Mimosiolia. I have been watching this tree closely but it always seems to oscillate between looking fine and looking "sick or unhealthy. The lower leaves often seem to turn brownish and dies, however it seems to be growing new sprouts off the top. I was a little worried I was overwatering it so I have been trying to reduce how much water it takes.

I currently live in Washington and have brought it in doors for the winter. I read the like to have a lot of sun so I have a sun lamp for it. Am I making any mistakes? Should I be watching out for anything like sickness or bugs?


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So currently your in winter, so this could be a normal winter reaction as it is a tropical tree and will go dormant in winter conditions, many jacarandas look like that locally during winter, but it its hard to tell from the pictures or make recommendations without knowing Hardiness zone, as from what i understand Washington's weather varies from 4a to 9a.
 

GunGoose

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Thanks for the reply! I think my hardness zone is 8a. Good to know that this might just be the winter season.
 

ABCarve

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They drop their leaves in winter. They bloom before the leaves come out. Yours isn’t old enough to bloom.
 

ABCarve

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Would their branches also fall off?
It’s not a branch. It’s a compound leaf.
 

GunGoose

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It’s not a branch. It’s a compound leaf.
Interesting, go to know. The pictures of the trees in the link you sent look way larger then mine and are about the same age. I had originally planted my tree in a larger pot since I thought it would grow bigger, but was told to repot it in a smaller pot recently. I must have been doing something wrong....
 

eugenev2

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Interesting, go to know. The pictures of the trees in the link you sent look way larger then mine and are about the same age. I had originally planted my tree in a larger pot since I thought it would grow bigger, but was told to repot it in a smaller pot recently. I must have been doing something wrong....
So they are extremely vigorous growers in the correct environment, mine grew about 1.8m/6feet in a year, but to be fair it technically counts as two seasons as i planted the seed in early summer and it is now again early summer. My region has a hardiness zone of about 9b which is said to be within the best temperature zone for them, so i left them outside even during winter, but it might not be feasible for you. The smaller pot is not the wrong advice, it simply depends on how you want to grow it and what kind of attention you can provide it, if you can watch them carefully, planting in the ground or large container/grow box would be fantastic. Else growing them slower will provide you with the opportunity to catch the explosive growth before it happens.
 

GunGoose

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So they are extremely vigorous growers in the correct environment, mine grew about 1.8m/6feet in a year, but to be fair it technically counts as two seasons as i planted the seed in early summer and it is now again early summer. My region has a hardiness zone of about 9b which is said to be within the best temperature zone for them, so i left them outside even during winter, but it might not be feasible for you. The smaller pot is not the wrong advice, it simply depends on how you want to grow it and what kind of attention you can provide it, if you can watch them carefully, planting in the ground or large container/grow box would be fantastic. Else growing them slower will provide you with the opportunity to catch the explosive growth before it happens.

Wow that is some crazy growth. I had got my seeds from a bonsai tree kit and had grown them in San Diego for about 2 years before moving. The kit had some strange custom soil that I used for a while before moving it to a larger pot. I thought that moving it into a larger pot larger pot would have made it grow larger since it would have more room and I wanted my tree to be fairly large. However, I was told a few months ago that moving it to a smaller pot would cause it to grow larger since the roots would get crowded and then the growth would go to the trunk and branches (I am not sure if that makes sense but I made the move). Is there anything I should do to speed up growth, or have I missed the window for growth?
 

eugenev2

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Wow that is some crazy growth. I had got my seeds from a bonsai tree kit and had grown them in San Diego for about 2 years before moving. The kit had some strange custom soil that I used for a while before moving it to a larger pot. I thought that moving it into a larger pot larger pot would have made it grow larger since it would have more room and I wanted my tree to be fairly large. However, I was told a few months ago that moving it to a smaller pot would cause it to grow larger since the roots would get crowded and then the growth would go to the trunk and branches (I am not sure if that makes sense but I made the move). Is there anything I should do to speed up growth, or have I missed the window for growth?
I'm not so sure about that advice, if you have a look at the number of old bonsai trees in pots they generally have very little trunk growth in 20 years in part because of the pot, but also because of bonsai techniques such as pruning and root trimming that gets applied, trees in pots are generally in refinement and the focus shifts to things like ramification and foliage size, but it also depends on the approach being used, some people grow there trees only in pots at a much slower pace as there are advantages in doing this.

It's winter for you currently, so i would avoid repotting until spring next year. But comparing growth rates for a bonsai is a tricky thing as there are number of things that come into play with growing trees larger, fertilizing, container size, sunlight, watering, techniques currently being applied and plant genetics. I mention these things as i have 6 jacarandas that i'm currently experimenting on, two where obviously genetically weaker and has never grown as fast as the others and will never be able to compete with the others speed of growth, 4 i did root work and 2 trunk chops to compare the results, root work substantially slows down the plant growth rate, the two with trunk chops are almost twice as thick as the other 4 now.

So if your are planning on repotting next spring and the aim is growth attempt to damage the roots as little as possible. As i mentioned, if you can put it in the ground, this will be first prize, if not grow it in a grow box, if this is not a possibility, grow it in a slightly larger pot. Gardening rule of thumb is about a inch larger pot and upgrading the pot size either every year or every other year depending on the trees growth rate and health until the tree reaches the required trunk thickness. Just be careful on the pot size, as too large a pot could result in the tree sitting in too much moisture for too long a period can get root rot and die. You will need to apply a fine balancing act, as you will need to work on root spread while growing the tree out, but also don't want to disturb the roots too much. The same applies to the foliage, you want it to grow out of hand a bit (which will help thicken the trunk) and then cut it back to a more manageable size (which will slow growth down again) constantly keeping an eye on branches that will be kept for the future tree and branches that are purely there to thicken the trunk
 

GunGoose

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Thanks for the info! I now remember one of the reasons that they wanted me to move to a small part was that the larger pot it was in was retaining a lot of moisture. I currently am not able to plant outside and don't think it is the right climate anyway. I didn't realize genetics would play such a large role, I just assumed that it was 90% environment and 10% genetics. I have growing a few other trees I got in the same kit (2 Pinus Thunbergii and 5 Pinus Aristata that are growing close together and don't think I can separate). All the trees seem fairly small with my Jacaranda being the largest. I probably did put them too large of pots them.... Thanks for all info. I will probably just watch to see how they grow in the smaller pots for a while.

I have a few apple and pear seeds I got from an orchard. I don't often hear about people making bonsai trees with fruit trees? Would it be a bad idea to try?
 

eugenev2

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Thanks for the info! I now remember one of the reasons that they wanted me to move to a small part was that the larger pot it was in was retaining a lot of moisture. I currently am not able to plant outside and don't think it is the right climate anyway. I didn't realize genetics would play such a large role, I just assumed that it was 90% environment and 10% genetics. I have growing a few other trees I got in the same kit (2 Pinus Thunbergii and 5 Pinus Aristata that are growing close together and don't think I can separate). All the trees seem fairly small with my Jacaranda being the largest. I probably did put them too large of pots them.... Thanks for all info. I will probably just watch to see how they grow in the smaller pots for a while.

I have a few apple and pear seeds I got from an orchard. I don't often hear about people making bonsai trees with fruit trees? Would it be a bad idea to try?
The moisture issue can be mostly resolved by using a more free draining substrate, there are many examples on the forum here of something that might work for you. Most common is APL, akadama, pumice and lava (also referred to as boon mix) but this will depend on availability to you locally, as well as price.

People attempt bonsai on anything and everything, so don't let people stop you from trying. I have no experience with that, so i cannot really comment on them, just be aware of the fruit, i have read articles where they indicate that the fruit start to break branches when the get too large as they don't miniaturize, as leaves do under the correct conditions. So you will need to prune them after a certain point.
 

GunGoose

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The moisture issue can be mostly resolved by using a more free draining substrate, there are many examples on the forum here of something that might work for you. Most common is APL, akadama, pumice and lava (also referred to as boon mix) but this will depend on availability to you locally, as well as price.

People attempt bonsai on anything and everything, so don't let people stop you from trying. I have no experience with that, so i cannot really comment on them, just be aware of the fruit, i have read articles where they indicate that the fruit start to break branches when the get too large as they don't miniaturize, as leaves do under the correct conditions. So you will need to prune them after a certain point.

I am not sure if I had heard of boon mix before. I have been using some bonsai soil blend I got from eastern leaf. I will probably try boon mix if I do another tree. It is good to know about the fruit breaking branches, it would probably make sense to aim for a bigger tree then. Thanks!
 

ABCarve

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Interesting, go to know. The pictures of the trees in the link you sent look way larger then mine and are about the same age. I had originally planted my tree in a larger pot since I thought it would grow bigger, but was told to repot it in a smaller pot recently. I must have been doing something wrong....
The only jacaranda I have seen as nice bonsai have been quite large, 5-6”+ trunks and 40”+ in height. This is because the leaves are so large, don’t reduce very well and need to be in scale with the tree. Most so called jacaranda that you see on the web are actually wisteria. Well executed jacaranda bonsai are very rare.
 

GunGoose

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Interesting, I thought wisteria looked a little more like a willo (although looking closer I guess the flowers just tend to hang down). I assume mine is a jacaranda unless my kit was wrong...

I also just realized the my plant was above the heart for our apartment. I am not sure if that would effect it...
 

eugenev2

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Interesting, I thought wisteria looked a little more like a willo (although looking closer I guess the flowers just tend to hang down). I assume mine is a jacaranda unless my kit was wrong...

I also just realized the my plant was above the heart for our apartment. I am not sure if that would effect it...
Almost 100% sure yours is a jacaranda (they are everywhere here), our capital city is locally known as the "the jacaranda city" as per picture below and we've had a few of the trees through out my life, so not a expert but i know a bit about them.

And yes, plants tend not like to be too close to heaters and such.
 

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Cajunrider

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Interesting, I thought wisteria looked a little more like a willo (although looking closer I guess the flowers just tend to hang down). I assume mine is a jacaranda unless my kit was wrong...

I also just realized the my plant was above the heart for our apartment. I am not sure if that would effect it...
Yours is a jacaranda. It is a juvenile. It looks OK for being a tropical tree in winter inside. The soil appears to be too wet. Yours doesn't have any branches yet. All you have are bipinnately compound leaves. Don't be surprised to see the leaves all drop this winter and you just have a stick left. If you don't get the roots in trouble, it should come back nicely in the spring.
 

Cajunrider

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The only jacaranda I have seen as nice bonsai have been quite large, 5-6”+ trunks and 40”+ in height. This is because the leaves are so large, don’t reduce very well and need to be in scale with the tree. Most so called jacaranda that you see on the web are actually wisteria. Well executed jacaranda bonsai are very rare.
So true. The bipinnately compound leaves of juvenile jacaranda look like branches thus the lure to bonsai newcomers. They come out looking like a tree when young. Unfortunately, jacaranda, poinciana and similar trees need to be fairly large to be good bonsai. My poinciana grows to 5-7ft tall every year yet it only looks like a bonsai early in the spring. In the summer when all the leaves are fully grown, it still looks iffy.
 
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