JBP browning needle tips

Maiden69

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Hi all, my name is Francisco and I am living in Boerne, TX, zone 8b. I have always been fascinated by bonsai trees, but because I was in the military I knew that it was going to be impossible to have one of my own. Now that I am out, I decided to finally start this journey. Right now I don't have a bonsai tree, but a small amount of "small" trees that I am hoping to transform into bonsais in the near decades. My first tree was a 1 gal JBP that I bought from Garden Goods Direct last year and was intended to be planted in the ground as a niwaki. Since then I have ordered a few plants from Brent to increase my "collection" and learn hands on, instead of just reading and watching videos.

What have I done to that tree. At the time I received it I was living in an apartment waiting for our house to be finished and I slipped potted the pine into a 3 gal container, filling the void with potting soil and perlite on a 1:1 ratio. I wired the trunk to give it a little movement (it was dead straight when I received it), I decandled, and reduced a whorl on the top of the tree from 4 to 2. I water the tree almost daily during the summer, at 90-100 degrees it was drying out daily in the San Antonio city area. Now that we are in a "cooler" area I check the soil and water it mostly every other day. We had a few ~25 degree days in December and I placed all the trees in the ground and mulched the sides of the containers in an attempt to prevent the soil from freezing. They are still in the same place with the containers sides covered with mulch. The weather is hoovering in the 40-70's, but this next 2 days we are supposed to be in the low 30's again.

The pine has done well in the container, but when I was out watering yesterday I noticed the browning tips. Normally I water the trees early in the morning (around 5am before heading out for the day). At that time I really can't see anything so I don't know if this has been going for a few days or if it is a result of too much water. I did check the flowchart and it indicates "air pollution", is that referring to the air in the pot? Or ambient air? I am keeping the pine in a container for a while instead of planting in the ground, and I am planning on repotting the tree into a big colander type container and start changing the soil to proper inorganic soil as soon as the candles are ready. I read here and in Jonas website to only change 1/2 the soil at one time, then the other 1/2 after 2 years, so that is my plan.

So the tips are browning with sap oozing from them, and some have this white residue on them between the brown and the green. I did took some picture of the needles, but not of the entire tree. The browning seems to be only on the needles on the apex of the trunk. I do plan on reducing them once the new candles open to let the apex grow as a sacrifice for a few seasons in order to thicken the trunk.

I tried researching, but most of the information I found was for needle cast, tip moth, and tip blight, which this doesn't look like the pictures I found.

Thanks,
F.

JBP needles.JPG

JBP needles2.JPG
 

sorce

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Welcome to Crazy!

Looks like Insects of some sort.

That whiteness at the base of the needles....what's that?

Sorce
 

Maiden69

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Thanks Source.

I ordered Bayer 3 in 1 Insect Disease and Mite Control in case it was some kind of aphids or bugs, but I haven't been able to self diagnose.

That whiteness has been there since the new candles came out after decandeling in July. It's the same texture as the casing covering all the new candles coming out now. I guess this is not normal either? This is my first spring with a pine so all I have seen were the open spring candles in summer and the new new candles after decandeling in July.
 

sorce

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Can you get a better picture of the needle bases?

Something is sucking sap out of it, I reckon they juice enzymes or something that makes the sap more flowy which is why is gets drippy everywhere.

I just had a scale infestation on a ficus that smelled like pumpkin. Smell may guide you.

The work defined, certainly seems enough to send signals of weakness to pests, which is likely why it got hit. So if you can keep them maybe 20-40% healthier after work, you can stay in a safe zone. Though if this was the one NOT from Brent, that may also be the source of the problem.

This extensive work is necessary sometimes to achieve a goal, so you're not wrong. It may have just needed a little more health before work.

I'd keep it isolated.

If Bayer 3 in one is like an RPG that blows giant holes in shit, Simple Health, is the Sniper preventing problems in the first place.😉

Sorce
 

Maiden69

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Yes, this one was NOT from Brent. I have 2 other smaller (I got them as 4" pots) ones that got slipped potted upon received in November and will probably won't be touched for a while.

I will move it away from the other trees and take more pictures as soon as I get home from work.

Thanks,
 

KiwiPlantGuy

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Hi,
I think the pest is Wooly Aphid, which most insectides should cure it.
Charles
 

Shibui

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If there is a woolly insect sucking on pines it is far more likely to be Pine bark adeljid than woolly aphid. Await better shots for a more accurate diagnosis.
Brown needle tips are not usually from sucking insects.

I would suspect fungal disease like dothistroma but the brown does not seem to be in the usual bands on the needles.

Dehydration can sometimes cause tips of pine needles to brown. The damage is usually caused some weeks before symptoms appear so most have forgotten that they forgot to water one day back then. how long have you had the tree and how well has it been watered?
Starvation or nutrient deficiency can also cause older tips to die as the tree takes mobile nutrients to help new shoots grow. How long have you had the tree and what is the fertilizer program?

Some brown tips on older needles is not a problem. If new needles look healthy I would not worry. The older needles will die next summer anyway.
 

Maiden69

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@Shibui, definitely not dehydration. I tend to water almost every 2-3 days because of how dry it is in my area. We had almost a full week of rain/fog, I think that sprouted whatever it is on the pine as the soil in the container is mostly the one that came with the pine from the nursery and a mix of potting soil from HD and perlite. I have the tree since summer last year, watered almost daily during the summer, almost every 2-3 days since November when the temps starting to drop, which in my area is anywhere between 40's - 70's.

I fertilized the tree with acidic Sumo cakes during the summer every 4 weeks. When I got the tree I didn't see any mycorrhizae so I sprinkled a little bit of Great White. And sporadically I will use Ferti-Lome Acid Lovers liquid fertilizer, but I stopped fertilizing the tree in November.

Here are more pictures, I really need to get a tripod or something, this new Iphone zoom is awesome, but my shaking hands don't allow me to take decent pictures.

Full tree
full.JPG

Trunk
trunk.JPG

trunk top.JPG

Branch
branch.JPG

Last summer candle
candle last summer.JPG
 

Maiden69

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I haven't watered the tree in 2 days and the top of the soil still feels damp. I plan on repotting this tree this weekend to move in into a better draining soil. All I have right now is small size soil 1/16"-1/4" as I was waiting for Jonas to get some akadama, but I guess I missed the opportunity because it was sold-out by the time I noticed he received some. I will be ordering medium size from Amazon today, hopefully I will receive it by Saturday.

In comparison, here are picture of my mugo pine that I bought from "evergreen plant nursery" and it's been sitting all the time in the same location next to the JBP. Also, pictures from Brent's pines, a little yellow, but I think it is because of the late fall/early winter slip potting.

Mugo
mugo.JPG

mugo 1.JPG

Brent pine
Brent pine 1.JPG

Brent pine.JPG

Brent pine 2
Brent pine 2.JPG
 

cmeg1

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Moisture...too much with limited oxygen lets the root fungus( which is already absolutely everywhere) propogate and thrive.Soil too dense.
Ph at the roots get wacked from fungus and plant starves with mega deficiencies.

If going organic you need a good ph soil.....soil? 6.4-6.8? I think.
Hydro stones or the like get 5.8-6.4

Root fungus sucks.I have no patience for this....they get tossed so not to infect rest of crop.
Easily avoidable with aeration and oxygen at roots...PHPHPHPHPHPHPH.
It is so easy to ph water.
Chlorine?
Tap?
Well?

If going organic you need more aeration and mychoriza to break down the phospherous.
 

cmeg1

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This is not a bad video series on hydroponic plant propogation.......perhaps do not need the whole series if growingnoutside.....our bonsai soil is hydroponic......taught me alot.


Can really waste years getting the nutrition dialed in....especially reading what people write on internet...UNLESS A COMMUNITY OF SHARING RESULTS AND DECIDING WHO TO FOLLOW!!! Like bonsainut😃
 

Maiden69

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@cmeg1, thanks, not going organic. I am going to go with 1:1:1 akadama/pumice/kyriu as that is what I have on hand right now. Also, I am moving it from the 3 gal nursery container to a 9x9x6 water plant basket.

9x9x6 basket.jpg
 

sorce

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I wouldn't Repot it again.

Sorry I was envisioning pruned candle tips dripping sap not the needles. You sure the needles are dripping sap?
That's the odd part for me.

Sorce
 

Maiden69

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You sure the needles are dripping sap?
That's the odd part for me.

Sorce
yes, it is dried up now but there was yellow sap on them. They are sticky now, but not oozing sap anymore.
 

sorce

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You might have to look closer at these.

Capture+_2021-01-28-08-24-17.png

Might be scale or something else.

I never seen sap leak without pests.

Sorce
 

cmeg1

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Miracle ingrediants for all fertilizer......along with corect ph and CALCIUM....some good reads too!
All the Harley Smith articles are awesome from maximum yeild

Yucca is essential as a wetting agent when mixing fertilizer salts with these GREAT GREAT bio-stimulants.Keeps the mix in suspension as they do not typically play well together( in solution anyway).

 

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cmeg1

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Other than that it is just about water quality,EC, and deficiencies.
THE EASY APPROACH ✌️✌️✌️
 

Maiden69

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I am adding humic acid and biochar (the Andersons HumiChar) to my substrates this year. I have used their HumicDG on my turf grass with awesome results, especially on the nasty clay soil here in the San Antonio area.
 

Adair M

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Welcome to Crazy!

Looks like Insects of some sort.

That whiteness at the base of the needles....what's that?

Sorce
JBP needles retain their sheaths. That’s normal.
 

Maiden69

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I would suspect fungal disease like dothistroma but the brown does not seem to be in the usual bands on the needles.
Found a video in Bonsai Mirai last night where Ryan discuses this on a ponderosa pine... same explanation, the white on the needle between the green and brown tip is dried up sap. Supposedly that is the point where the dothistroma breaks out and releases the spores. Like you said, too much water, not enough oxygen in the roots. I guess I know what I have now and going to do some more research on how to treat it and prevent it from spreading.
 
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