JBP candles in development ideas/suggestions

Maiden69

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Hi,

Here are a few pictures of my JBP. The ones in colanders were acquired from Brent, the small one from Kaede-en during winter this year. They were not decandled. Are this normal candles for this time of year? I thought that JBP will develop a single flush if not decandled and develop small buds that will elongate next year. This ones have opened all this years buds, and the big ones are shooting this long green "candles" that appear to not have needles on them. I plan on moving both from colanders into grow bags and in the ground in spring, the little ones will probably be moved into RoR, and possibly grow bag or colander depending on how I feel when the time come.

Should I reduce every whorl to 2 at the end of November/December? So that energy is not wasted pushing growth there for spring?

The first picture is from late May or early June. The rest are yesterday.
JBP 1a.JPG

JBP candle 1.JPG

JBP candle 1a.JPG

JBP candle 3.JPG

JBP candle 2.JPG

JBP candle 2c.JPG

JBP candle 2a.JPG

JBP candle 2b.JPG
 

Shibui

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All look normal to me. in good conditions JBP will often have a second growth spurt and open a second set of candles as the one in pic 'JBP candle 1.JPG is doing. Those strong candles will have a bare section at the base (green part) and the new needles will eventually emerge from the upper brownish part. That sort of growth is normal for strong, healthy JBP in warmer climates. Candles will often enlarge through fall but then stop over winter before completing growth the following spring.

Decandling is a technique I reserve for well developed trees. Different techniques are used to develop younger trees like these but many 'experts' forget to mention the earlier stages because talking about decandling is way more cool.
Be aware that older needles will drop off each year in summer making the trunk and branches longer and bare. Getting back buds on bare pine stalks is difficult so you really need to prune proactively to make sure some lower shoots are available to chop to when the trunks have thickened.

Personally i'd leave all the new buds. More shoots does not waste energy it increases growth and thickness.
Multiple shoots, known as 'whorls' will create local thickening or reverse taper. In many cases those sections will just be cut off later when reducing height, improving taper or change of direction so no problem but if you think you might keep the section as part of the final structure then definitely remove extra shoots before they grow too big and create problems.
 

Maiden69

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Thanks @Shibui I wasn't sure if it was completely normal. This is my second fall with JBP and last year the needles on the tree I had elongated and didn't push long candles like this in the fall. Just small to medium candle/buds like below. I am definitely not candle cutting this pines, as I want them to grow. But I was under the impression from what I read here and the podcast that Ryan did with the Telperion Farm owners that you still have to manage the lower portion so they don't grow too thick, and prune the sacrifices to push energy to the lower branches as well to prevent the tree from ditching them. I seen the pictures that @Adair M posted from Telperion and the sacrifices only have the current year elongating candle with maybe 1 or 2 extra candles and the rest below them until the developing part of the tree are cut off entirely.


JBP candle 4.JPG
 

Shibui

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There always seems to be more than one way to skin the proverbial cat, even if it is a bonsai pine tree. Follow Adair's much used photo if you wish but there are other possible development options.
 

Adair M

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Thanks @Shibui I wasn't sure if it was completely normal. This is my second fall with JBP and last year the needles on the tree I had elongated and didn't push long candles like this in the fall. Just small to medium candle/buds like below. I am definitely not candle cutting this pines, as I want them to grow. But I was under the impression from what I read here and the podcast that Ryan did with the Telperion Farm owners that you still have to manage the lower portion so they don't grow too thick, and prune the sacrifices to push energy to the lower branches as well to prevent the tree from ditching them. I seen the pictures that @Adair M posted from Telperion and the sacrifices only have the current year elongating candle with maybe 1 or 2 extra candles and the rest below them until the developing part of the tree are cut off entirely.


View attachment 399449
Shibui is right that when growing/developing JBP, they’re not decandled. Decandling is a refinement technique used once you have your trunk and primary branches. Then start decandling to create ramification and short needles.

Telperion never decandled those trees in my “famous” picture. They DID cut the lower branches back! It was almost like they used Walter Pall’s “Hedge Pruning” method! Lol!!! There were branches and subbranches going every which way! So, once I got it, I did some selective pruning fir form, and used a lot of gauge 10 copper wire!!!

(They didn’t “hedge” it. But they did do a lot of “cutting back” which created lots of twigging!).
 

Maiden69

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(They didn’t “hedge” it. But they did do a lot of “cutting back” which created lots of twigging!).
Thanks, I think this is what I meant to say. Chris and Gary said they would do some pruning to keep the lower portion in check and produce ramification.
 

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