JBP candling timing differing advice

[iant]

I was reading my local bonsai club newsletter and they have advice about spring candling for JBP this year. They were recommending earlier as we had a warm early spring.

"Mid April
4. Black Pine - Spring candle nipping is done when the needles on the new candle are open and spread. Usually done in May or June, but because this winter was warmer some pines will be ready to cut back in April."

from: http://www.gsbf-bonsai.org/kusamura/Archival Issues/KUSAMURA0420.pdf

I thought that candling timing was more related to how much time you had left in the summer and early fall so as to limit the new buds extension to keep things tight. In California this is late as we have a fairly warm fall. From the advice of Kusamura it looks like their advice this time is more related to how much time has passed since things warm in the spring.

I think folks in the Bay Area usually candle in late June or early July. So late April seems a bit early.

I'm sure there are several ways to do things.

Here's a few pictures of how one of my pines is looking now. I took a shot of the top, the bottom, and the whole. Thought I'd check if anyone had any thoughts?
My inclination is to wait to late June.

Ian
p.s. I only candle the parts that I'm trying to keep compact (i.e. not growing out.)

 

[cmeg1]

Yea.I am new at pines and this year I am thinking also how much time is left in growing season for the new shoots to form after pruning shootes.

 

[Smoke]

In this thread I said I was about two weeks away from candle pruning. I was asked why so early? Pruning pines is not so much going by a calendar. You can't just prune pines every june 10th and expect the tree to respond perfectly. Kenji Miyata has taught me that pines and junipers have to be watched and let the tree tell you when the work needs to be done. Much like watering. You don't water cause you think the tree should be watered, you water when the tree needs water. That may be two times a day or once a day, based on how we have formulated the soil mix to respond to our watering lifestyle and work schedule.

I will be pruning my pines early because the candles have elongated very long this season due too mild weather. The longer the candle gets, the larger the branch gets. If this seasons needles get out of whack, they can be tamed the next season. Branches out of whack means bad news for a pine. Just too much work to start over.

 

[iant]

Thanks Al,
I had read the beginning of the other thread before but hadn't read the bottom parts. I see your point about the branch getting larger (the longer the candle gets.) I assume by that you mean thicker. When you cut the candle you limit the branch length... but if it's already thickened the branch more than you want then that's a problem. I suppose that's why some break a long candle in the spring prior to decandling.
Ian

 

[Smoke]

Thanks Al,
I had read the beginning of the other thread before but hadn't read the bottom parts. I see your point about the branch getting larger (the longer the candle gets.) I assume by that you mean thicker. When you cut the candle you limit the branch length... but if it's already thickened the branch more than you want then that's a problem. I suppose that's why some break a long candle in the spring prior to decandling.
Ian

Yes to all, excellent!

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

This article may be useful:
http://www.nebaribonsai.com/Nebari_Bonsai_112109/Projects_files/Candle-Cutting 071011.pdf

You're getting good advice and it seems like you're grasping the concept well. Unless you're really worried about the shoots thickening up too much in the next few weeks (probably not the case at this stage of development), I'd say you're right on timing in late June/early July. More important than when to start cutting is knowing when the tree will stop growing, then you can "back into" the timing of candle cutting.

I know I need about 100 days to grow new needles and set buds, and I know I can count on growth into early November, so candle cutting for me is done in early July. The last 2 years I started a little too early, and the weaker branches got too much time to grow, and the needles were a bit too long.