Judging Forms

[Dorian Fourie]

Hi All.

I was wondering if anyone had judging forms that they use at any of the shows.

I am interested to see how and why trees are judged and the formats used etc

Thanks in advance
D

 

[sorce]

@Adair M may have one.

I've seen one here before.

But they are different for every show.

I think I heard a bit about them on the critique videos on YouTube.

And the Japanese methods on Bjorn's series.

Sorce

 

[Adair M]

I think I posted one several years ago.

Basically you assign points to the various aspects of the tree. Then add up the points.

For example, the trunk is most important so it is worth 20 points max. So, when judging the trunk, give it a number from 1 to 20, based upon the quality of the trunk

Give other aspects, branches, foliage, pot, nebari, over all style, a max of 10 points each. Rate each aspect from 1 to 10.

Then add up the score. A perfect bonsai would be 70 points. No bonsai is perfect, so none should get a 70!

You can add aspects if you like. The idea is to get a relative ranking. The raw score doesn’t mean much, it’s just a way to rank the trees.

So, when rating the trunk of a pine, look at bark quality, absence of obvious pruning scars, movement, taper, quality of Shari if present, etc. judge t for appropriateness for a pine.

Then, when judging a broom style Zelkova, judge for straightness of trunk, smoothness of bark, lack of scars, lack of taper, good nebari, shape (is the trunk round or oval), thickness appropriate for the height, etc. Rate it on the qualities expected for a Zelkova trunk.

Your final score can be used to compare the Zelkova to the pine. Is this Zelkova a better Zelkova than the pine is as a pine? A Zelkova that gets a total score of 55 (based on its scores of Zelkova characteristics) would be ranked as better than a pine that gets a score of 53 ( based on its total score of Pine characteristics).

Hope this helps.

 

[Dorian Fourie]

Thanks so much Adair. Appreciate it

 

[ColinFraser]

I think I posted one several years ago.

Basically you assign points to the various aspects of the tree. Then add up the points.

For example, the trunk is most important so it is worth 20 points max. So, when judging the trunk, give it a number from 1 to 20, based upon the quality of the trunk

Give other aspects, branches, foliage, pot, nebari, over all style, a max of 10 points each. Rate each aspect from 1 to 10.

Then add up the score. A perfect bonsai would be 70 points. No bonsai is perfect, so none should get a 70!

You can add aspects if you like. The idea is to get a relative ranking. The raw score doesn’t mean much, it’s just a way to rank the trees.

So, when rating the trunk of a pine, look at bark quality, absence of obvious pruning scars, movement, taper, quality of Shari if present, etc. judge t for appropriateness for a pine.

Then, when judging a broom style Zelkova, judge for straightness of trunk, smoothness of bark, lack of scars, lack of taper, good nebari, shape (is the trunk round or oval), thickness appropriate for the height, etc. Rate it on the qualities expected for a Zelkova trunk.

Your final score can be used to compare the Zelkova to the pine. Is this Zelkova a better Zelkova than the pine is as a pine? A Zelkova that gets a total score of 55 (based on its scores of Zelkova characteristics) would be ranked as better than a pine that gets a score of 53 ( based on its total score of Pine characteristics).

Hope this helps.

Exactly - same idea for dog shows - each dog is judged against its “breed standard”, not directly against other dogs of different breeds (otherwise only Scottish terrriers would win dog shows, since clearly they’re the best dogs lol )

 

[ColinFraser]

Exactly - same idea for dog shows - each dog is judged against its “breed standard”, not directly against other dogs of different breeds (otherwise only Scottish terrriers would win dog shows, since clearly they’re the best dogs lol )

The real question with Bonsai is, what’s the equivalent of the “breed standard?”
The kinds of things @Adair M mentions are the idea, but they are not codified formally as far as I know - certainly not to the degree that dog breeds are.

If the standards vary from one judge to the next . . .

 

[ColinFraser]

Here’s an example breed standard. Consider how detailed and specific it is. I bet we could come up with similar types of standards for Bonsai species and styles. Maybe it wouldn’t be useful or relevant, but it is interesting to think about.

 

[Adair M]

The real question with Bonsai is, what’s the equivalent of the “breed standard?”
The kinds of things @Adair M mentions are the idea, but they are not codified formally as far as I know - certainly not to the degree that dog breeds are.

If the standards vary from one judge to the next . . .

Of course the standards vary from one judge to another! Do think Boon would be looking for the same attributes as Walter Pall?

Where it gets tricky is when there are multiple judges for one show. Let’s say they all used my scoring system. But one judge is lenient and gives a lot of 9s and 10s, but another judge is harsher and the best score he gives out is only a 7. Let’s say there were 5 judges. How do you rank the trees? Add them up and divide by 5? Drop the high and low score from each judge and average the 3 remainders?

Or, do you identify the trees each judge picked as the top tree, and have the judges re-evaluate them?

Or some other method?

 

[ColinFraser]

Of course the standards vary from one judge to another! Do think Boon would be looking for the same attributes as Walter Pall?

Where it gets tricky is when there are multiple judges for one show. Let’s say they all used my scoring system. But one judge is lenient and gives a lot of 9s and 10s, but another judge is harsher and the best score he gives out is only a 7. Let’s say there were 5 judges. How do you rank the trees? Add them up and divide by 5? Drop the high and low score from each judge and average the 3 remainders?

Or, do you identify the trees each judge picked as the top tree, and have the judges re-evaluate them?

Or some other method?

I suppose an individual show could have pre-set criteria for categories too - everyone knows going in how a black pine will be judged, and the judges are simply evaluating how well the tree in front of them meets those preselected and agreed upon standards. I’m not necessarily advocating it, but I do think it would be interesting and eliminate some of the hiccups you mentioned.

Certain categories might have stringent standards while others could be more open or subjective. I think if I were putting together a show I would consider devising something like that . . .