Just collected my first Bald Cypress, in need of some advice on potting & after-care

[SU2]

So after a bunch of scouting trips I finally found an appropriately-sized specimen to collect, waded into the 1' deep water and cut it out (accidentally cut a good part of the base....sucks knowing that the 'front' is already determined before it even buds!) After cleaning a lot of its neighbors' roots out of it (as Bill of Bill's Bayou says of this in a collecting video- 'That's just rude'!), I was still left with a very hefty root-mass - I'm going to cut it back some more before potting it (unsure exactly how much, am seeing @Zach Smith planting collected b.cypress w/ incredibly small roots, though if I'm in a situation where I've already got these lovely long strands of roots that've got TONS of fines/feeder roots, it seems smart to keep what'll fit in the container- would love to know the proper approach on this!)

Potting it is something else that's got me concerned, Bill keeps his submerged for the first year (like a coarse substrate that's in a non-draining container and kept w/ standing-water) but at the same time I don't know if aeration is a part of that), I'm concerned that it would just get stagnant/gross really fast that way and am hesitant to use a non-draining container- but I really don't want to break good-practice here! Am kind of hoping it's a 'water is better but a damp/water-retaining soil mix is fine just not as fast' situation, I'd much rather have it survive than thrive in its first year so if it's just a trick to get good roots initially and it increases the chances of root-rot of any sort, I'd sooner have a slower-growing specimen that's more likely to survive.

I've cut it down since the pictures, I did an angled-cut of ~9" (8" on one side, 10' the other), in expectation of getting at least 1 or 2 good leaders to bud from the tall half of the 'spear tip' top it now has, would love to know how much you guys would've cut!

Last big uncertainty is the 'root base', like the center/top area of root-mass, my specimen is a little bulgy there ie not 'pot-friendly', so was planning to use concave cutters to nip away at that and get it flatter before potting (it's been in a bucket of water for ~12hr now, about to go change the water - have heard of people putting stuff in the water in such situations, can't help but think a little epsom salt would be a good thing right now but have no idea what the proper dosing/mixing rate for this would be so am not doing it as of yet!

This isn't just my first b.cypress it's my first coniferous tree! Any & all advice/tips/suggestions would be greatly appreciated!!


[edited-to-add: I'm sure it goes w/o saying but want to be sure- those couple radial roots that protrude from the side of the trunk a few inches up from the base, those are to be removed right? Would it be better to cut flush or to use concave cutters? Thanks again for any advice offered on this, despite having cut that surface root I'm still really digging this tree and want it to survive & thrive!!]

 

[Zach Smith]

Looks like a promising specimen. Regarding roots, here's the thing: all of those relatively fine roots you've brought home on your collected tree are not going to be transporting any water to the tree; they're hardened off already. The fresh new white feeder roots that grow off of them (and the larger chopped roots) will do that. So while it's comforting to have those finer roots you brought home, they don't really add to the recovery of the tree. Anecdotally, the BC I've collected with all of those fine roots tend to recover slower than those where I've ended up with four or five large chopped off roots. This isn't a scientific observation, mind you. But no matter what amount of roots you bring home, the tree has to want to live, to paraphrase John Naka, and it will throw new roots to make that happen. Another thing to be aware of regarding BC collected as big sticks: they grow foliage first, then roots. Watch your new shoots. They will extend a few inches during the initial recovery/regrowth phase. It's at that point that roots need to start growing (this almost always happens). If they do, then the shoots resume their push and and will grow up to 2-3' in the first year after collecting; if they don't, that means no roots grew and the tree then dies. And one more tidbit: I have collected very large BC with nice buttressing roots flaring into the ground where I got no new root growth off the flaring roots in year one, but then went on to grow roots in year two. So as long as the top of your BC is growing, you should get the root growth you want. Just don't panic and start carving those "dead" roots too soon.

 

[SU2]

Looks like a promising specimen. Regarding roots, here's the thing: all of those relatively fine roots you've brought home on your collected tree are not going to be transporting any water to the tree; they're hardened off already. The fresh new white feeder roots that grow off of them (and the larger chopped roots) will do that. So while it's comforting to have those finer roots you brought home, they don't really add to the recovery of the tree. Anecdotally, the BC I've collected with all of those fine roots tend to recover slower than those where I've ended up with four or five large chopped off roots. This isn't a scientific observation, mind you. But no matter what amount of roots you bring home, the tree has to want to live, to paraphrase John Naka, and it will throw new roots to make that happen. Another thing to be aware of regarding BC collected as big sticks: they grow foliage first, then roots. Watch your new shoots. They will extend a few inches during the initial recovery/regrowth phase. It's at that point that roots need to start growing (this almost always happens). If they do, then the shoots resume their push and and will grow up to 2-3' in the first year after collecting; if they don't, that means no roots grew and the tree then dies. And one more tidbit: I have collected very large BC with nice buttressing roots flaring into the ground where I got no new root growth off the flaring roots in year one, but then went on to grow roots in year two. So as long as the top of your BC is growing, you should get the root growth you want. Just don't panic and start carving those "dead" roots too soon.

Thanks a ton for the info, very very happy you saw this I've still got it in a bucket (fresh water since yesterday) as I'm unsure what the heck to do w/ it, I hear of the fully-submerged approach and am still convinced I'm missing some crucial aspect (I just can't fathom that a container w/o aeration can have stagnant water and that it'd be good...), so after root-pruning ~1/3 of the base (mostly the bottom-most parts to make it shallower) I just put it back in the bucket and added an incredibly light dose (like 1/20th label) of Epsoma Garden Tone, a real good 3-4-4 organic w/ microbials, while I figure out if it's ok to simply use something like lava-rock + sphagnum peat + sand or something to make a super water-retaining mix *that still drains*, the non-draining is making me think mosquitos/rot/etc and am still having trouble swallowing that!

I cut those two side roots and made sure the water in the bucket was right below them, want them callousing / not trying to throw roots! Also used several zip-ties to anchor roots in favorable positions, though your post has me wondering how big a deal they are...I guess I'd still think that more surface area (on all those hardened-off feeders/fines) would mean it could generate more quicker but I know nothing of how this tree acts lol, do you do fully-submerged for the first year like Bill does?

sawzalled-off the bottom-most root-base


applied some IBA to areas after cut, I know it's going right back in-water so probably pointless but whatever!


Final roots, zip-tied into place where needed (this was all a ~20min operation and I did it during light-rain so think it was as unstressful as possible to the tree!

[those ^ 4-5 ~1/4"-thick radial roots- should I have cut them off entirely? The best thing about it still being in a bucket, I can still work the roots if needed!]


Aaand as he sits now, still in a bucket because buckets are all I have that fit him *and* don't have drainage holes....I figure that, since water's fine, it's ok to figure this out w/o panic/racing, since it can live just fine in water til I've chosen (still would like it in a real container *asap* lol!!)

 

[Zach Smith]

I don't do the submerge thing. Not disagreeing with Bill, it's just not something I do as my material is mostly sold the same year it's collected and having them in water would not be conducive to that end. For me it's chop, dust, and pot in unscreened bonsai mix (50:50 pine bark mulch and Riverlite/Haydite). Water when needed in winter, daily in spring, twice daily in summer, fert in late winter through fall.

 

[SU2]

I don't do the submerge thing. Not disagreeing with Bill, it's just not something I do as my material is mostly sold the same year it's collected and having them in water would not be conducive to that end. For me it's chop, dust, and pot in unscreened bonsai mix (50:50 pine bark mulch and Riverlite/Haydite). Water when needed in winter, daily in spring, twice daily in summer, fert in late winter through fall.

I'm still waiting to find out whether submersion requires artificial aeration but think I'm going to just setup a very high WHC(water-holding-capacity) mix probably 25% lava // 75% DE, do a real thick drainage layer to raise the 'saturated zone' at the bottom of the substrate, should be about as moist-as-possible (maybe add some sphagnum? I dunno, I tend to regret using the stuff every time I choose to do so....I think 75%DE will keep things plenty wet!)

When you say 'dust', you mean dusting w/ rooting hormone/IBA right? Just want to be sure! Am going to put it in a container this morning, it's in its 2nd bucket of water now while I was figuring this out (thanks for the reply, it's literally what I was waiting on- from you or anyone but from you is just tops!- to know before potting-up), think I have an oil-pan or mortar-mixing bucket that'll be a good shape for it

Would you say I'm approaching fert right when, at this early post-collection stage, I used organic Epsoma GardenTone (3-4-4 with microbials, but diluted to the point it's probably 0.25-0.3-0.3/gallon) and Epsom Salts (10%Mg+/13% Sulfur, at a rate of like 1/16th TSP/gallon), have those dissolved in the water it's sitting in and am planning to use that water to 'water-in' my substrate as I'm potting it (may add some un-dissolved GardenTone to the mix as I'm putting it into the container)

I'm still unsure about something, you'd said:

So while it's comforting to have those finer roots you brought home, they don't really add to the recovery of the tree. Anecdotally, the BC I've collected with all of those fine roots tend to recover slower than those where I've ended up with four or five large chopped off roots. This isn't a scientific observation, mind you. But no matter what amount of roots you bring home, the tree has to want to live, to paraphrase John Naka, and it will throw new roots to make that happen. Another thing to be aware of regarding BC collected as big sticks: they grow foliage first, then roots. Watch your new shoots. They will extend a few inches during the initial recovery/regrowth phase. It's at that point that roots need to start growing (this almost always happens).

Just to be sure we're on the same page, are you saying that if this were you, you'd go ahead and cut-off those roots now before potting it? How aggressive, like bring them back to half their current length, or entirely back to the stump- it sounds like you're saying the latter but just want to be damn-sure of this before doing it ;D

Would love to hear a guesstimate on time-til-budding, I find it's usually within a week / week and a half that I'll see the first epicormic buds swelling on trunk-chopped bougies & crapes (and ruby loropetalum - but w/ Oaks, both Live and Laurel Oaks, I've yet to see any budding....have a few that I'm just waiting til spring to see if they survived their dormant-collection!) B.Cypress seems to bud about as profusely as a crape would, am guessing that the thick bark will add a week (am estimating 2wks-til-budding but am just basing that on gut-feeling and nothing else ;p It's getting warmer here (no day below 74deg forecast this week!) and daylight-hours increasing, have a feeling I'm just on the cusp of too-late to collect more b.cypress - there's another that I've set my sights on and am hoping to get to it in the next couple days before these things come out of dormancy!!)


Thanks again for the replies, massive help here I really appreciate this

Thanks a ton for

 

[JoeH]

I potted my two in non draining containers with a gravel/soil mix and water every couple days when hot out. BC are pretty sturdy trees and take well to root reduction/abuse. I get the impression you are over thinking this. The aeration and all that is not needed.

 

[SU2]

I potted my two in non draining containers with a gravel/soil mix and water every couple days when hot out. BC are pretty sturdy trees and take well to root reduction/abuse. I get the impression you are over thinking this. The aeration and all that is not needed.

ADHD lol, I tend to over-think everything (at the same time, my thread on Reddit about this b.cypress had people telling me I shouldn't have even pulled it if I wasn't sure of these things already..)

What do you think of the 3rd pic in post #3? Would you be cutting more of those roots off before containerizing it? That's how it currently looks and I'm about to go and put that in a shallow-ish oil-pan w/ DE & lava rock (~75/25% mix), just unsure how much more roots to cut....

I was considering doing the no-drainage thing without standing-water (ie just water it when the top looks dry, that'd be leaving some level of water-table in there at all times) but, in getting things ready to containerize just now, I found another problem w/ that- I need to drill holes into the oil-pan so I can tie-in the tree! This thing is so tall, and the roots so small, that it's a tip-over waiting to happen, really wouldn't be comfortable having it w/o anchoring and I don't know any methods that don't require holes in the container....guess I could always set it inside a 2nd oil-pan if I choose to go the submerged route! Get to have my cake and eat it, too!! Will setup an anchored container using an oil-pan now, leaving me the option to just put another oil-pan under it and have my sealed/non-draining container if I so choose! Only real problem is the uncertainty over whether I should be chopping more of those roots off or not, Zach says they're not feeders but IIRC they'd be more surface-area for feeders to grow from, although OTOH Zach says anecdotal experience is that hard-chopping the roots tends to be better...have a worry that's only w/ especially vigorous specimen, I'm far more interested in making sure it survives, than in having max-growth my first year!

 

[SU2]

Oh another thing- I never sealed my trunk-chop, is that something that needs to be done w/ B.Cypress? I never seal any of my trunk chops (or carvings/grindings/cuttings/anything), but my total # of species is quite low (and has *nothing* coniferous) so am unsure if I'll have the same luck not sealing the top of this guy....I know Bill *does* seal, am starting to think I've erred and am unsure if it's too-late or if I should go get some wood-glue/putty/etc on top of that chop!

Edit- Am also unsure on location/placement, whether full-sun (right off the bat, today) is the correct approach- I recall reading or hearing that but didn't transcribe it to my notes so unsure :/

 

[Zach Smith]

I'm still waiting to find out whether submersion requires artificial aeration but think I'm going to just setup a very high WHC(water-holding-capacity) mix probably 25% lava // 75% DE, do a real thick drainage layer to raise the 'saturated zone' at the bottom of the substrate, should be about as moist-as-possible (maybe add some sphagnum? I dunno, I tend to regret using the stuff every time I choose to do so....I think 75%DE will keep things plenty wet!)

When you say 'dust', you mean dusting w/ rooting hormone/IBA right? Just want to be sure! Am going to put it in a container this morning, it's in its 2nd bucket of water now while I was figuring this out (thanks for the reply, it's literally what I was waiting on- from you or anyone but from you is just tops!- to know before potting-up), think I have an oil-pan or mortar-mixing bucket that'll be a good shape for it

Would you say I'm approaching fert right when, at this early post-collection stage, I used organic Epsoma GardenTone (3-4-4 with microbials, but diluted to the point it's probably 0.25-0.3-0.3/gallon) and Epsom Salts (10%Mg+/13% Sulfur, at a rate of like 1/16th TSP/gallon), have those dissolved in the water it's sitting in and am planning to use that water to 'water-in' my substrate as I'm potting it (may add some un-dissolved GardenTone to the mix as I'm putting it into the container)

I'm still unsure about something, you'd said:

Just to be sure we're on the same page, are you saying that if this were you, you'd go ahead and cut-off those roots now before potting it? How aggressive, like bring them back to half their current length, or entirely back to the stump- it sounds like you're saying the latter but just want to be damn-sure of this before doing it ;D

Would love to hear a guesstimate on time-til-budding, I find it's usually within a week / week and a half that I'll see the first epicormic buds swelling on trunk-chopped bougies & crapes (and ruby loropetalum - but w/ Oaks, both Live and Laurel Oaks, I've yet to see any budding....have a few that I'm just waiting til spring to see if they survived their dormant-collection!) B.Cypress seems to bud about as profusely as a crape would, am guessing that the thick bark will add a week (am estimating 2wks-til-budding but am just basing that on gut-feeling and nothing else ;p It's getting warmer here (no day below 74deg forecast this week!) and daylight-hours increasing, have a feeling I'm just on the cusp of too-late to collect more b.cypress - there's another that I've set my sights on and am hoping to get to it in the next couple days before these things come out of dormancy!!)


Thanks again for the replies, massive help here I really appreciate this

Thanks a ton for

Dusting means with rooting powder. I can't comment on your fertilizer regimen, I use time release inorganic exclusively. You may have to do some experimentation.

As for root-chopping, a good rule of thumb is to cut enough to fit the eventual bonsai pot. If you do this, you'll find yourself cutting off more than you planned. But you do not want to have to root-chop again when it comes time to go to a bonsai pot. Trust me, I have been there in my earlier days and it was never necessary to leave those big roots so long.

 

[Zach Smith]

Oh another thing- I never sealed my trunk-chop, is that something that needs to be done w/ B.Cypress? I never seal any of my trunk chops (or carvings/grindings/cuttings/anything), but my total # of species is quite low (and has *nothing* coniferous) so am unsure if I'll have the same luck not sealing the top of this guy....I know Bill *does* seal, am starting to think I've erred and am unsure if it's too-late or if I should go get some wood-glue/putty/etc on top of that chop!

Always seal all trunk chops and cuts over 1/4 inch in diameter. BC too. The wood is sponge-like, and transpires like the dickens when the tree wakes up. As for when will they bud, when it gets warm enough and the tree decides to. Down here it varies from February to April.

 

[SU2]

Dusting means with rooting powder. I can't comment on your fertilizer regimen, I use time release inorganic exclusively. You may have to do some experimentation.

As for root-chopping, a good rule of thumb is to cut enough to fit the eventual bonsai pot. If you do this, you'll find yourself cutting off more than you planned. But you do not want to have to root-chop again when it comes time to go to a bonsai pot. Trust me, I have been there in my earlier days and it was never necessary to leave those big roots so long.

I'm just unsure how much of them to remove - in post #3's third picture (that's how it is right now, ready to go from a bucket to an oil-pan for container), just how far-back would you cut those? If I'm interpreting your earlier post right it seems you're saying remove them entirely? Or at least to <1" long? I guess I'm looking at them and thinking "this is great scaffolding for tons of new feeders to grow from", but again this is my first coniferous specimen ever and you're a pro so I badly want to do what you'd do, not what my ~1yr of work w/ deciduous tropicals has taught me
[edit- you say that it's about fitting into a container eventually- that was my guiding principle when doing the first round of root-pruning, I got it so the roots were shallow and would fit into a short pot - pic#3 in post #3 shows, what I'd have thought at least, to be a *very* pot-friendly root-mass - I think that's why I'm confused at further cut-backs. Do you suspect that if I just left those as they are now that they'd die? Or that, if they were removed, the resultant root-growth would be far more vigorous than if I'd left them on, kind of like how pruning can reinvigorate growth on the top half of a tree?]

Always seal all trunk chops and cuts over 1/4 inch in diameter. BC too. The wood is sponge-like, and transpires like the dickens when the tree wakes up. As for when will they bud, when it gets warm enough and the tree decides to. Down here it varies from February to April.

I tried to edit/delete that post and didn't get to it fast enough, right after posting I swore that was covered explicitly in one of your write-ups and I found it right after, hate how bonsainut has a limited-window for post-editing :/ I've sealed w/ wood-glue (regular Elmer's 'Wood Glue' product), plumber's putty, and just mineral oil or vegetable glycerine- which of these would you use if you didn't have any bonsai-specific stuff on-hand? I never seal my other specimen when chopping/carving and never had problems so kind of gave-up on the idea of sealing stuff, but don't want to 'wing it' w/ this guy I badly want this thing to survive!!

Thanks again for all the help w/ this, get almost star-struck when I have legitimate professionals answering my questions and helping me out ;P

 

[Zach Smith]

I'm just unsure how much of them to remove - in post #3's third picture (that's how it is right now, ready to go from a bucket to an oil-pan for container), just how far-back would you cut those? If I'm interpreting your earlier post right it seems you're saying remove them entirely? Or at least to <1" long? I guess I'm looking at them and thinking "this is great scaffolding for tons of new feeders to grow from", but again this is my first coniferous specimen ever and you're a pro so I badly want to do what you'd do, not what my ~1yr of work w/ deciduous tropicals has taught me
[edit- you say that it's about fitting into a container eventually- that was my guiding principle when doing the first round of root-pruning, I got it so the roots were shallow and would fit into a short pot - pic#3 in post #3 shows, what I'd have thought at least, to be a *very* pot-friendly root-mass - I think that's why I'm confused at further cut-backs. Do you suspect that if I just left those as they are now that they'd die? Or that, if they were removed, the resultant root-growth would be far more vigorous than if I'd left them on, kind of like how pruning can reinvigorate growth on the top half of a tree?]




I tried to edit/delete that post and didn't get to it fast enough, right after posting I swore that was covered explicitly in one of your write-ups and I found it right after, hate how bonsainut has a limited-window for post-editing :/ I've sealed w/ wood-glue (regular Elmer's 'Wood Glue' product), plumber's putty, and just mineral oil or vegetable glycerine- which of these would you use if you didn't have any bonsai-specific stuff on-hand? I never seal my other specimen when chopping/carving and never had problems so kind of gave-up on the idea of sealing stuff, but don't want to 'wing it' w/ this guy I badly want this thing to survive!!

Thanks again for all the help w/ this, get almost star-struck when I have legitimate professionals answering my questions and helping me out ;P

Looking at that last pic you posted, you don't need to cut any more. Even if those roots don't fit your bonsai pot, it won't be a problem to trim them back. My advice is meant for really big radial roots.

 

[SU2]

Looking at that last pic you posted, you don't need to cut any more. Even if those roots don't fit your bonsai pot, it won't be a problem to trim them back. My advice is meant for really big radial roots.

Awesome thank you! Was hoping that was the answer, would've been cringing while cutting them back further if you'd said to!! [perfect timing too, have my substrates sorted&sifted and ran back inside to see if any replies lol! Time to go put him into his new home ]

 

[Mellow Mullet]

Awesome thank you! Was hoping that was the answer, would've been cringing while cutting them back further if you'd said to!! [perfect timing too, have my substrates sorted&sifted and ran back inside to see if any replies lol! Time to go put him into his new home ]

I agree with Zach, I would not remove anymore roots. I do use submersion and have for many years, it works. Check out this thread: https://www.bonsainut.com/threads/bald-cypress-repot-and-trim.22456/page-2#post-498563 , there are others, too. If it will fit into an oil drain pan, they work great, I use them for some of my bald cypress. I use two for each one, the first one I drill numerous holes in the bottom and then plant the tree in it; then I place it in the second one, "double up" if, you will, you can see it in this picture: https://www.bonsainut.com/threads/bald-cypress-ii.22491/page-2#lg=attachment163648&slide=0. This allows me to flood the container, but allows me to remove it when I want to work on it or when winter gets here. There really is no worry about the water getting stagnant as I still water it every day and it gets flushed with clean water. There is a thread here that shows a picture of the water after removal, I don't remember which one. I am also like Zach, I use the time release inorganic and it seems to work fine. Trees really don't need as much fertilizer as we try to feed them, most of it ends up on the ground under the bench anyways.

Hope it Helps,

John

 

[SU2]

@Zach Smith ,
I'd want this in full-sun right away right? I'd swear I read that on one of your blog-posts but sadly can't find it (even googling "site:bonsai-south.com ***** collect sun" and stuff, actually wasn't narrowing it to your site off the bat and was very displeased how your site didn't show up in my top 10 for a lot of searches I'd have suspected it would've, I hope it's not presumptuous to ask but is the url's SEO in-line?)

I had it in strong sun about half the day, it's getting warm here and tomorrow there'll be almost 80deg sun on it so if full-sun isn't an all-good thing I definitely need to move it (actually I'll move it, til I find out otherwise, lol wouldn't want to err on this!) If it were a bougie, I'd have it on the top shelf of my corner bench, sunlight stimulates budding in bougies but I've got no idea if that's normal or anomalous..)

[edit- I may have misconstrued a reply you'd made to a comment along the lines of 'shade isn't needed after collecting because there's no leaves to transpire', which definitely isn't the same as 'it likes intense light'...it's also crossed my mind that I'd like to have it facing the sun in the same orientation it was when growing in-water, could find out tomorrow and change it if it'd at all matter, part of me wonders if it's not kind of shocking to just be turned 180 (if that's how far it's been turned, I'd have to check the others nearby it to see the algae-pattern to tell what angle it was at relative to the sun/north) Although I'm guessing that won't matter much, it hasn't on bougies or crapes, and just found out that b.cypress have the type of cambial layer that's 'zig-zag' or diagonal where roots can support different parts of the crown/canopy (instead of specific roots serving specific pads/parts of a canopy, like a line from a root through the bark to a pad), so can only presume epicormic buds are all over and can be supported quickly - I don't even have to consider how well it'd rained in the weeks leading up to the collection, as it was living in 1' of water...lol these things are real neat trees can't wait to get more ;D ]

 

[Zach Smith]

@Zach Smith ,
I'd want this in full-sun right away right? I'd swear I read that on one of your blog-posts but sadly can't find it (even googling "site:bonsai-south.com ***** collect sun" and stuff, actually wasn't narrowing it to your site off the bat and was very displeased how your site didn't show up in my top 10 for a lot of searches I'd have suspected it would've, I hope it's not presumptuous to ask but is the url's SEO in-line?)

I had it in strong sun about half the day, it's getting warm here and tomorrow there'll be almost 80deg sun on it so if full-sun isn't an all-good thing I definitely need to move it (actually I'll move it, til I find out otherwise, lol wouldn't want to err on this!) If it were a bougie, I'd have it on the top shelf of my corner bench, sunlight stimulates budding in bougies but I've got no idea if that's normal or anomalous..)

[edit- I may have misconstrued a reply you'd made to a comment along the lines of 'shade isn't needed after collecting because there's no leaves to transpire', which definitely isn't the same as 'it likes intense light'...it's also crossed my mind that I'd like to have it facing the sun in the same orientation it was when growing in-water, could find out tomorrow and change it if it'd at all matter, part of me wonders if it's not kind of shocking to just be turned 180 (if that's how far it's been turned, I'd have to check the others nearby it to see the algae-pattern to tell what angle it was at relative to the sun/north) Although I'm guessing that won't matter much, it hasn't on bougies or crapes, and just found out that b.cypress have the type of cambial layer that's 'zig-zag' or diagonal where roots can support different parts of the crown/canopy (instead of specific roots serving specific pads/parts of a canopy, like a line from a root through the bark to a pad), so can only presume epicormic buds are all over and can be supported quickly - I don't even have to consider how well it'd rained in the weeks leading up to the collection, as it was living in 1' of water...lol these things are real neat trees can't wait to get more ;D ]

There's no need for shade with newly collected deciduous trees in winter. I wouldn't fret over orientation, either. Don't dote on the tree too much, they hate that.

As for all that SEO stuff, we do our best. You could try searching at the site for what you need, that might help. There's quite a bit of information there.

 

[rockm]

So after a bunch of scouting trips I finally found an appropriately-sized specimen to collect, waded into the 1' deep water and cut it out (accidentally cut a good part of the base....sucks knowing that the 'front' is already determined before it even buds!) After cleaning a lot of its neighbors' roots out of it (as Bill of Bill's Bayou says of this in a collecting video- 'That's just rude'!), I was still left with a very hefty root-mass - I'm going to cut it back some more before potting it (unsure exactly how much, am seeing @Zach Smith planting collected b.cypress w/ incredibly small roots, though if I'm in a situation where I've already got these lovely long strands of roots that've got TONS of fines/feeder roots, it seems smart to keep what'll fit in the container- would love to know the proper approach on this!)

Potting it is something else that's got me concerned, Bill keeps his submerged for the first year (like a coarse substrate that's in a non-draining container and kept w/ standing-water) but at the same time I don't know if aeration is a part of that), I'm concerned that it would just get stagnant/gross really fast that way and am hesitant to use a non-draining container- but I really don't want to break good-practice here! Am kind of hoping it's a 'water is better but a damp/water-retaining soil mix is fine just not as fast' situation, I'd much rather have it survive than thrive in its first year so if it's just a trick to get good roots initially and it increases the chances of root-rot of any sort, I'd sooner have a slower-growing specimen that's more likely to survive.

I've cut it down since the pictures, I did an angled-cut of ~9" (8" on one side, 10' the other), in expectation of getting at least 1 or 2 good leaders to bud from the tall half of the 'spear tip' top it now has, would love to know how much you guys would've cut!

Last big uncertainty is the 'root base', like the center/top area of root-mass, my specimen is a little bulgy there ie not 'pot-friendly', so was planning to use concave cutters to nip away at that and get it flatter before potting (it's been in a bucket of water for ~12hr now, about to go change the water - have heard of people putting stuff in the water in such situations, can't help but think a little epsom salt would be a good thing right now but have no idea what the proper dosing/mixing rate for this would be so am not doing it as of yet!

This isn't just my first b.cypress it's my first coniferous tree! Any & all advice/tips/suggestions would be greatly appreciated!!
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[edited-to-add: I'm sure it goes w/o saying but want to be sure- those couple radial roots that protrude from the side of the trunk a few inches up from the base, those are to be removed right? Would it be better to cut flush or to use concave cutters? Thanks again for any advice offered on this, despite having cut that surface root I'm still really digging this tree and want it to survive & thrive!!]

"This isn't just my first b.cypress it's my first coniferous tree!"

this is something of a misleading statement. BC are Deciduous conifers, for all intents and purposes they are treated like DECIDUOUS trees. They respond to bonsai treatment as deciduous trees do.

As Zach said, stop F#$%&@ around with it for now. Make sure you bury the surface roots at least three inches below the soil to prevent them from drying out. Step back and be patient.

 

[SU2]

I agree with Zach, I would not remove anymore roots. I do use submersion and have for many years, it works. Check out this thread: https://www.bonsainut.com/threads/bald-cypress-repot-and-trim.22456/page-2#post-498563 , there are others, too. If it will fit into an oil drain pan, they work great, I use them for some of my bald cypress. I use two for each one, the first one I drill numerous holes in the bottom and then plant the tree in it; then I place it in the second one, "double up" if, you will, you can see it in this picture: https://www.bonsainut.com/threads/bald-cypress-ii.22491/page-2#lg=attachment163648&slide=0. This allows me to flood the container, but allows me to remove it when I want to work on it or when winter gets here. There really is no worry about the water getting stagnant as I still water it every day and it gets flushed with clean water. There is a thread here that shows a picture of the water after removal, I don't remember which one. I am also like Zach, I use the time release inorganic and it seems to work fine. Trees really don't need as much fertilizer as we try to feed them, most of it ends up on the ground under the bench anyways.

Hope it Helps,

John

You still water every day- presumably this is because it's growing, I did put some drainage holes into mine (w/ an extremely water-retentive substrate, almost 60-70% DE) but, after it's growing, may still put a 2nd oil-pan under the first so I can do submersion if I want

Would be very interested in the specifics of your time-release regimen, like how frequently it's applied and what its #'s are! And also whether it's for growth/development or refinement

Thanks for the links will go check them out

"This isn't just my first b.cypress it's my first coniferous tree!"

this is something of a misleading statement. BC are Deciduous conifers, for all intents and purposes they are treated like DECIDUOUS trees. They respond to bonsai treatment as deciduous trees do.

Sorry I wasn't trying to be misleading or anything, I was aware they were anomalous for coniferous trees but didn't know it was like that (that, for all intents & purposes, I should be treating them like deciduous trees) That's good to know, I won't be conflating general coniferous-information for what my b.cypress need!!

As Zach said, stop F#$%&@ around with it for now. Make sure you bury the surface roots at least three inches below the soil to prevent them from drying out. Step back and be patient.

Lol Rock!! I swear you picture me out in my garden poking at them, cursing at them, re-potting them over and over - that isn't the case! I collected it, root-pruned it, dusted it and put it in a container- if there was anything superfluous done I'm truly unaware of what it was - would like to know if I'm missing something, because now that I know how easy they are to collect I'm hoping to get several more (at least) before my time runs out - actually on that note, do you (or @Zach Smith !) happen to know how I'd know I'm 'too late' to collect? On Adamaskwhy's blog (he's in Orlando 2hrs from me, *very* similar enviro's), he says "january is bald cypress collection and re-potting month", I'm afraid I may already be about to enter the 'too late' phase and I badly want at least a few more (ideally 10+ more), am real eager to know just how late / how to tell when it's too-late to collect them!

(oh and surface roots are buried well I think, will have to go out and measure to be sure I hit 3"...I'd gotten the roots flat enough that this thing is basically sitting on the bottom of the container, eventually this thing will be able to go into a very shallow pot! If it looks like that substrate-surface is wrong though (or I don't find 3" solid) I'll add more! I put a thick layer of lava-rock-mulch on for good measure after taking the picture:

There's no need for shade with newly collected deciduous trees in winter. I wouldn't fret over orientation, either. Don't dote on the tree too much, they hate that.

As for all that SEO stuff, we do our best. You could try searching at the site for what you need, that might help. There's quite a bit of information there.

I guess my concern is that the current climate isn't that of winter, today's high is 77 (and Sun is 80deg)....still full sun? And re orientation, thanks that's good to know Also I won't be doting on it! It's done and won't be touched for a while now, have finished this one and am ready to go get some more if I can do it in-time, have concerns I'm going to miss the window! Hopefully I can find the time in the coming days to get a few more at least!!

And TBH I always forget about sites' internal search features! Thanks for mentioning And yeah there really is a ton of info there, have read a lot already but haven't finished it yet, am already re-reading some of the key articles!

 

[Zach Smith]

Our collecting season extends through February, though with the caveat that in mid- to late-February you may find yourself collecting trees that have started to bud (this is in South Louisiana). I don't like doing this, but it can be done successfully. Given your location, I would step back a few weeks or more and so once January passes you're probably out of the safe zone. A way to gauge would be to look for new growth.

 

[Giga]

what is that potted in? and next time try and be more gentle with collecting and get clean cuts, kinda looks like a beaver dug it up. Tree will heal better and have a better time sealing would instead of dieing back.