Lots of Cedar Elms and a big Pyracantha

[jkd2572]

I might be going tomorrow if you're up for it. Shoot me a PM with contact info if you're interested.

Sorry I missed this. Thanks for the invite.

 

[Ross]

Hello all, I thought I'd post a quick update. One of the elms I collected didn't make it, which is too bad because it was one of the bigger and cooler ones. It was one of two that I collected too early, temps had dropped but the tree was still in leaf. The other one I pulled on the same day is alive and well. All 27 of the dormant elms I collected are also alive, as is the big Pyracantha. The Pyracantha had so many buds on the trunk, that I felt compelled to rub off all the buds that were obviously in the wrong spots, and then once it grew a bit, I took off branches in the spots where they grew from the same point on the trunk. I've never had a Pyracantha, but it seems to be growing well with nearly two feet of growth in a couple spots. It has had both ants and aphids on it, but I've managed to keep them fairly in check. I'm attaching a picture of the Pyracantha from a couple weeks ago, two pics of elms collected this year, and a picture of a large-leaf holly I've had for a few years in a garden pot. Thanks for looking!

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

Looking good! Time to wire that pyracantha, exaggerate the movement. Once they get pinky-thick, they're tough to move.

 

[Poink88]

All 27 of the dormant elms I collected are also alive, as is the big Pyracantha.

Wow...you were busy!!!

Trees look healthy. Great job!

Love that pyracantha, I would not worry about wiring it personally and rather go with clip and grow method (or pinching every 2 nodes) ...either now or next year. You'll get better and more convincing structure that way esp since they grow so fast. JMHO.

BTW, note that the thorns of pyracantha can leaf and branch.

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

Love that pyracantha, I would not worry about wiring it personally and rather go with clip and grow method (or pinching every 2 nodes) ...either now or next year. You'll get better and more convincing structure that way esp since they grow so fast. JMHO.

Please show us your Pyracantha done by all clip and grow Dario.

 

[Poink88]

Please show us your Pyracantha done by all clip and grow Dario.

I had a feeling this will come LOL. I don't have a bonsai of it but had several treated that way on the ground of my old house in San Antonio. Believe it or not, one was trained like a pre-bonsai and kept very low. I wish I can go back and dig it up (that would be super cool). Mind you, I still plan on going back and asking if I can buy it.

I do have a tiny one (gallon sized tree-pencil sized trunk) I started working on less than a year if you really want to see (and not just to embarrass me ). Nothing much to look at but the little amount of branch it has is obviously better than if it was wired.

 

[Martin Sweeney]

Looking good! Time to wire that pyracantha, exaggerate the movement. Once they get pinky-thick, they're tough to move.

Ross,

This is good advice. Those shoots need to be wired into a basic structure with movement now to allow future ramification to be built on that structure.

Regards,
Martin

 

[coh]

I do have a tiny one (gallon sized tree-pencil sized trunk) I started working on less than a year if you really want to see (and not just to embarrass me ). Nothing much to look at but the little amount of branch it has is obviously better than if it was wired.

That's quite a claim and one that, to me, requires a photo to document.

Chris

 

[Poink88]

That's quite a claim and one that, to me, requires a photo to document.

Fine, it will be done.

Don't get me wrong, I will still wire it but mainly to reposition the branches...very little to give it the branch character and structure. I use the same technique for all my other tree's new growth...be it yaupon, boxwood, etc. Usually, they tend to look like pom-poms actually before I clean them up. Ridiculous to many but that is my chosen approach.

 

[Martin Sweeney]

Fine, it will be done.

Don't get me wrong, I will still wire it but mainly to reposition the branches...very little to give it the branch character and structure. I use the same technique for all my other tree's new growth...be it yaupon, boxwood, etc. Usually, they tend to look like pom-poms actually before I clean them up. Ridiculous to many but that is my chosen approach.

Dario,

You tell someone not to worry about wiring, but then admit to wiring to position the branches.

Brian is correctly advising Ross to do the exact thing at the right time to achieve what you admit to doing after saying not to do it!

You may inadvertently be causing the issue others are seeking to avoid by giving incomplete advice. I assume this is inadvertent.

Regards,
Martin

 

[fore]

I started a Pyracantha air layer this mos. Should be really cool come Aug! I was wondering the preferred training method for this plant as indeed I did notice that the branches, even small ones, are quite brittle.

You have a really nice one there Ross, and I love those Elms too. Good Luck with them!
Chris

 

[Poink88]

Dario,

You tell someone not to worry about wiring, but then admit to wiring to position the branches.

Brian is correctly advising Ross to do the exact thing at the right time to achieve what you admit to doing after saying not to do it!

You may inadvertently be causing the issue others are seeking to avoid by giving incomplete advice. I assume this is inadvertent.

Regards,
Martin

Martin,

I guess I should have been clearer that I am giving him an alternate choice on giving the branches "exaggerated movement" by clip and grow instead of wiring.

Thanks and point well taken.

 

[Ross]

Looking good! Time to wire that pyracantha, exaggerate the movement. Once they get pinky-thick, they're tough to move.

Thanks Brian, I'm glad you chipped in with advice. Your Pyracantha is a sweet one and you obviously know what you're talking about.

BTW, note that the thorns of pyracantha can leaf and branch.

Thanks Dario, I was wondering about that. Are you saying that there is typically a dormant bud at the base of each thorn?

Ross,

This is good advice. Those shoots need to be wired into a basic structure with movement now to allow future ramification to be built on that structure.

Regards,
Martin

Thanks Martin. Your advice is always good, and I know it comes from experience. I think you are a Southern D-tree lover like me, and I always enjoy seeing pics of your trees.

My plan on the Pyracantha is to use guy wires to bring a lot of the branches down close to horizontal, then cut back fairly hard next spring or early summer. I'm not sure how much movement I can even put into the first couple inches of these branches at this point but I'll try. There is a little wire on the tree already, as two branches were in jeopardy of breaking off and had to be wired for support. I nearly broke one of them off (primary branch on bottom right) as I was trying to pull it down with a wire, but luckily it didn't pull all the way off and is growing strongly. I want to pull that branch down and to the right but I have to be careful with it now.

 

[Ross]

I started a Pyracantha air layer this mos. Should be really cool come Aug! I was wondering the preferred training method for this plant as indeed I did notice that the branches, even small ones, are quite brittle.

You have a really nice one there Ross, and I love those Elms too. Good Luck with them!
Chris

Thanks Fore! When you are separating the layer, watch the thorns on the parent plant. I got jabbed with one when I was hauling away the sawn off top of mine and it was a bit painful and took a while to heal.

 

[Poink88]

I was wondering about that. Are you saying that there is typically a dormant bud at the base of each thorn?

While there is a bud at the base (next to the leaf), the thorn itself can grow its own leaves and branch out. In a way, it can become a branch.

I am using "can" because not all of them do this.

 

[fore]

Thanks Fore! When you are separating the layer, watch the thorns on the parent plant. I got jabbed with one when I was hauling away the sawn off top of mine and it was a bit painful and took a while to heal.

Yes, I too got scratched and punctured multiple times as the bush is large and I had to climb in there to get access. I wish I'd thought of wearing leather gloves lol

 

[Poink88]

That's quite a claim and one that, to me, requires a photo to document.

Difficult to show the branches unless I defoliate the plant sorry. This tiny plant was bought a year ago and basically chopped to almost nothing except the trunk and a few inches of branch stubs. It was originally about 3 feet tall stick with some movement at the lower part.

Note that this never got wired (yet).

View attachment 36452 View attachment 36453

 

[coh]

Difficult to show the branches unless I defoliate the plant sorry. This tiny plant was bought a year ago and basically chopped to almost nothing except the trunk and a few inches of branch stubs. It was originally about 3 feet tall stick with some movement at the lower part.

Note that this never got wired (yet).

View attachment 36452 View attachment 36453

Those images certainly do little to support your claim that "the little amount of branch it has is obviously better than if it was wired"...IMHO, of course

Chris

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

Here is a shot of mine from tonight, tried to get some branching to show up playing with mrs.' new camera. Berries are setting nicely, and will look great with the "new" pot.

Very glad I wired the movement in early and often, otherwise it would be very angular and young-looking.

History since I dug it in '05 is here.

 

[Ross]

Here are a couple update pics of the Pyracantha. Sorry for the crummy photos, but I can't really move this thing around by myself to get a plain background. These were taken with my cell-phone to boot...so there's that. The tree is growing well though. Aphids still love it, and it has grown some weird tumor thing on the trunk, but it's coming along. I need to carve it before it fills in much more, but I'm scared to do it myself and would prefer to get some help with that. If anyone in Dallas is good at carving and wants to help, please drop me a line.