Mail order JWP

[CodeMonkey]

Recently I took the plunge and ordered a mail order JWP.
It's the first time I've risked buying anything other than very young starter material online.

I'm pretty happy with the experience and the tree seems fairly healthy.
It is also the first import pine I've purchased. Is it usual for them to be planted so high in the pot?

Anyway, looking forward to getting it back to full health and potentially a repot next year. I think I'll need to break this pot to get it out.

 

[BonsaiDTLA]

Fat and stout, just the way I like em.

 

[Kyleboldy2003]

where you get them from ?

 

[CodeMonkey]

where you get them from ?

I got it from bonsai plaza after some recommendations on here.

 

[Adair M]

It’s hard to tell about the nebari with that moss all over it. You could gently scape some of it off. And spray it with white wine vinegar. That I will kill it, and after a week or two, it’ll dry up and fall off.

Repot next spring.

 

[CodeMonkey]

It’s hard to tell about the nebari with that moss all over it. You could gently scape some of it off. And spray it with white wine vinegar. That I will kill it, and after a week or two, it’ll dry up and fall off.

Repot next spring.

Thanks Adair, that sounds like a great idea, I'll do that.

I gave it a gentle scrub to see how easy it came off but it looked like there's a lot of fine roots underneath and I didn't want to damage anything. Your approach sounds like it'll mitigate that.

 

[Adair M]

I wouldn’t “scrub”. That for sure will damage the bark! Let the vinegar do it. Don’t spray a lot, just a little, give it time and see how it goes. You can always spray it a second time if after a couple weeks you still have excess moss.

 

[CodeMonkey]

I wouldn’t “scrub”. That for sure will damage the bark! Let the vinegar do it. Don’t spray a lot, just a little, give it time and see how it goes. You can always spray it a second time if after a couple weeks you still have excess moss.

That sounds perfect. Thanks again.

 

[sorce]

bonsai plaza

Bogus! Netherlands!? Wondering why I never heard of that place.

That's tight.

Sorce

 

[Mayank]

I wouldn’t “scrub”. That for sure will damage the bark! Let the vinegar do it. Don’t spray a lot, just a little, give it time and see how it goes. You can always spray it a second time if after a couple weeks you still have excess moss.

Adair, is white vinegar a good way to remove the green stuff (algae? lichen?) that can stain the bark and especially the deadwood on junipers, etc? Can the vinegar be safely painted on the live veins also?
Also, I don't necessarily want my deadwood to look super white and like the natural, grey look but as a result I would like my live veins to be darker/redder/browner to contrast. unfortunately most of my living veins have flaky bark which is kinda grey and honestly I'd love to see a little more contrast. What is the best way to achieve this? Bjorn has a video where he "cleans" the live vein, uses a blade I think to peel the flaky bark and uses brushes and maybe a dremel tool to expose the red underneath but I'm really worried about damage to the live vein.

 

[Adair M]

Ok, let’s talk about this...

You mention “natural, grey look”. Yes, that’s what they do in YOUR environment, but that’s NOT how they appear in THEIR natural environment! You see, where they live in higher elevations, the air is much drier, the UV is much stronger, and the dead wood, while not “white” is much much brighter and “whiter” than what happens in lower elevations. So, the bleaching makes them actually appear more natural!

Here are some pictures of Sierra Junipers at 10,000 feet:









That deadwood looks “white” doesn’t it? Of course, when you get right up next to it, it’s not as white as it appears from a distance, but we are trying to emulate how it appears when standing back looking at the tree as a whole.

So, yes, that means you should beach out the deadwood. I’m like you, I don’t care for deadwood that appears “painted” with lime sulfur. Natural deadwood has texture with cracks and checks. A smooth, sanded, painted appearance of the deadwood looks too artificial. So, here’s what I do:

1) Wet and scrub the deadwood with water to remove surface algae and mildew. Paint the deadwood with white wine vinegar. That should kill the moss and algae. In about a week.

2) Treatment of the live vein(s) is a personal preference, but I tend to go with the smooth look rather than the “flaky” look. Here’s why: when you look at the trees from a distance, the bark appears rather smooth and cinnamon colored. Up close, they’re still rather smooth because they are subjected to high winds and heavy snows that break off the flakes. Flaky bark, on junipers, shows youth, not age. Remember, the old trees in the mountains are hundreds if not thousands of years old! So, I prefer removing the flaky bark and going with the smooth appearance, like you saw Bjorn doing.

3). Applying line sulfur: My technique is to first wet the deadwood well, and let it partially dry back out. Maybe wait an hour after I’ve wet it. Mix the lime sulfur 50/50 with water, and paint the deadwood. Doing it this way makes the lime sulfur soak into the deadwood, rather than lay on top. When first applied, it will be yellow, and it will turn white as it dries. If limesulfur is applied straight, with no dilution, it will appear more like a layer of paint, and be really white when it dries. Almost shiny. My method still shows the natural wood graining and it will be bleached but not stark white. It will have more of a matte finish.

Here are some examples of my trees treated in the manner I described:

 

[Mayank]

Ok, let’s talk about this...

You mention “natural, grey look”. Yes, that’s what they do in YOUR environment, but that’s NOT how they appear in THEIR natural environment! You see, where they live in higher elevations, the air is much drier, the UV is much stronger, and the dead wood, while not “white” is much much brighter and “whiter” than what happens in lower elevations. So, the bleaching makes them actually appear more natural!

Here are some pictures of Sierra Junipers at 10,000 feet:

View attachment 330486

View attachment 330487

View attachment 330488

View attachment 330489

That deadwood looks “white” doesn’t it? Of course, when you get right up next to it, it’s not as white as it appears from a distance, but we are trying to emulate how it appears when standing back looking at the tree as a whole.

So, yes, that means you should beach out the deadwood. I’m like you, I don’t care for deadwood that appears “painted” with lime sulfur. Natural deadwood has texture with cracks and checks. A smooth, sanded, painted appearance of the deadwood looks too artificial. So, here’s what I do:

1) Wet and scrub the deadwood with water to remove surface algae and mildew. Paint the deadwood with white wine vinegar. That should kill the moss and algae. In about a week.

2) Treatment of the live vein(s) is a personal preference, but I tend to go with the smooth look rather than the “flaky” look. Here’s why: when you look at the trees from a distance, the bark appears rather smooth and cinnamon colored. Up close, they’re still rather smooth because they are subjected to high winds and heavy snows that break off the flakes. Flaky bark, on junipers, shows youth, not age. Remember, the old trees in the mountains are hundreds if not thousands of years old! So, I prefer removing the flaky bark and going with the smooth appearance, like you saw Bjorn doing.

3). Applying line sulfur: My technique is to first wet the deadwood well, and let it partially dry back out. Maybe wait an hour after I’ve wet it. Mix the lime sulfur 50/50 with water, and paint the deadwood. Doing it this way makes the lime sulfur soak into the deadwood, rather than lay on top. When first applied, it will be yellow, and it will turn white as it dries. If limesulfur is applied straight, with no dilution, it will appear more like a layer of paint, and be really white when it dries. Almost shiny. My method still shows the natural wood graining and it will be bleached but not stark white. It will have more of a matte finish.

Here are some examples of my trees treated in the manner I described:

View attachment 330490

View attachment 330491

I really do appreciate you taking the time to provide responses and in such a timely manner. And you've got the results to show for it! Having you on this forum is a privilege.
Back to my query. The deadwood was not really my concern as such (well, maybe except for the vinegar part) but rather the living vein and how you clean that.
I only mentioned the natural vs stark white because people seem to get fired up about that and I didn't want to get into a debate about that but I usually moisten the deadwood and after about an hour paint on lime sulfur. If I was to prepare it for a show then I use slightly diluted lime sulfur with a drop of black water color paint to make it slightly off white (demonstrated for me and taught to me by Todd Schlafer a few years ago).
As far as the living vein goes, can vinegar be painted on the algaed over areas without hurting the living vein?
Also, I'm also looking to get the redder, darker look for it not the flaky bark look. What is your specific technique? When I tried removing the flaky bark with a blade only parts came off and parts didn't leaving a striated look. Then I used a stiff brush but it didn't work too well. I was toying with the idea of a dremel tool with a soft attachment but am afraid I'm going to go all the way into the cambium and damage something. Bjorn made it look easy but cleary thats not how it played out for me. If you have any tips/hacks I'd love to hear them!

 

[Mayank]

Here's an example of one of mine where you can barely tell dead from alive.

 

[Adair M]

There’s several ways...

One is to use a dull scraping tool. Dull so that you don’t accidentally cut into the cambium.

Another method is to use a little power washer. There are bonsai specific ones, but they are really expensive. A great alternative is to use a dry cleaners “spot removal” tool. They work great. Practice a bit on some lesser trees, if used too harshly, you can damage the tree.

Sometimes, the tree just isnt ready (bark not thick enough yet) for either of those methods. In that case, use sandpaper.

To get that great contrast in color, when the bark is clean, you can apply Camilla oil, or walnut oil. That will bring out the color.

By the way, I don’t dye the lime sulfur with India ink. I’d rather just dilute the lime sulfur. I think the India ink method is more appropriate for deciduous than conifer. (Grey in the deadwood implies there is some mold or mildew. Which just doesn’t happen up on the mountain. It’s too dry. Mold and mildew greys deadwood where it’s more humid. And that’s where deciduous trees live.)

 

[Adair M]

Oh. You can just spray vinegar in the trunk to kill algae, mildew, moss, etc. I’d put something over the soil first.

 

[0soyoung]

... and, just like that, a JBP thread becomes a juniper thread.

 

[Adair M]

... and, just like that, a JBP thread becomes a juniper thread.

Actually, it started as a Japanese WHITE Pine thread.

 

[0soyoung]

Actually, it started as a Japanese WHITE Pine thread.

You continue to surprise me.

 

[Potawatomi13]

Ok, let’s talk about this...

You mention “natural, grey look”. Yes, that’s what they do in YOUR environment, but that’s NOT how they appear in THEIR natural environment! You see, where they live in higher elevations, the air is much drier, the UV is much stronger, and the dead wood, while not “white” is much much brighter and “whiter” than what happens in lower elevations. So, the bleaching makes them actually appear more natural!

Here are some pictures of Sierra Junipers at 10,000 feet:

View attachment 330486

View attachment 330487

View attachment 330488

View attachment 330489

That deadwood looks “white” doesn’t it? Of course, when you get right up next to it, it’s not as white as it appears from a distance, but we are trying to emulate how it appears when standing back looking at the tree as a whole.

So, yes, that means you should beach out the deadwood. I’m like you, I don’t care for deadwood that appears “painted” with lime sulfur. Natural deadwood has texture with cracks and checks. A smooth, sanded, painted appearance of the deadwood looks too artificial. So, here’s what I do:

1) Wet and scrub the deadwood with water to remove surface algae and mildew. Paint the deadwood with white wine vinegar. That should kill the moss and algae. In about a week.

2) Treatment of the live vein(s) is a personal preference, but I tend to go with the smooth look rather than the “flaky” look. Here’s why: when you look at the trees from a distance, the bark appears rather smooth and cinnamon colored. Up close, they’re still rather smooth because they are subjected to high winds and heavy snows that break off the flakes. Flaky bark, on junipers, shows youth, not age. Remember, the old trees in the mountains are hundreds if not thousands of years old! So, I prefer removing the flaky bark and going with the smooth appearance, like you saw Bjorn doing.

3). Applying line sulfur: My technique is to first wet the deadwood well, and let it partially dry back out. Maybe wait an hour after I’ve wet it. Mix the lime sulfur 50/50 with water, and paint the deadwood. Doing it this way makes the lime sulfur soak into the deadwood, rather than lay on top. When first applied, it will be yellow, and it will turn white as it dries. If limesulfur is applied straight, with no dilution, it will appear more like a layer of paint, and be really white when it dries. Almost shiny. My method still shows the natural wood graining and it will be bleached but not stark white. It will have more of a matte finish.

Here are some examples of my trees treated in the manner I described:

View attachment 330490

View attachment 330491

Some gorgeous ancient trees. Thank you.

 

[CodeMonkey]

Hi all,

Bringing this thread back on track.
Should I be concerned about this white substance on the tree? I've not seen it before on any of my other pines. Kind of hoping it's just hard water residue from the nursery.

Also it seems to have a fair amount of yellowing needles. Looks to me like last year's growth. (Please correct me if I'm wrong)

I've also managed to get about half the moss off so far. Still none the wiser on the nebari. The soil is so compact it doesn't take up water well. I've tried using a toothpick to make some holes but it's not helped much.