mirai sale

[JudyB]

I believe I collected about 30 deciduous this year. My friend collected about 100. Trust me, I’m on it. About 10 will make good bonsai. Photos below are from the apex of an old Japanese maple grown in New Mexico by Connie G. I air layered it last summer.

mmm, want... LOL.

 

[MACH5]

mmm, want... LOL.

Lay off lady! You like them shohin now remember!

 

[parhamr]

Owen does indeed. We will see about Andrew, Bjorn was supposed to be all about it, but doesn't seem as oriented that way as I had expected.

Andrew is 100% on board with deciduous for himself. This year I think he obtained four specimen deciduous for his own collection.

btw he is done with his apprenticeship and now out on his own (but I’m sure he’ll probably stop by Crataegus for some peak season work here and there)

My impression is in the PNW we are trying to figure a few things out about vine maple (where to find the best and how to optimize the dig time) and the Oregon White Oak (how to best use the sweat technique for post-collection recovery).

 

[Cadillactaste]

I think Ryan is really interested in deciduous, maybe he is not selling many because he is still working on them. I think Ryan is realtivily young, for him to have many good deciduous he would have had to start them before his apprenticeship.

I've heard this from another source as well...but I guess I see him as a conifer guy. He's learning deciduous.

 

[Adair M]

Look at Walter Pall’s thread “European Beech #5”. He opens up the thread with the comment: “Finally looks mature after 25 years”.

Well, yes, and no. You can still see where all the primary branches were chopped. Yes, there’s lots of great ramification, and yes, it’s a wonderful tree, and all, but, it STILL needs more time. It’s not that Walter hasn’t done a good job, he’s done a great job! But, it still looks like a tree that’s been chopped and redeveloped.

Please don’t misunderstand what I’m saying. I certainly can’t do any better! No, Walter has done everything in his power to advance the tree. But, it just needs more time. And there’s nothing anyone can do about that. Other than continue to work it.

And that’s the thing about deciduous trees. They take lifetimes to develop!

Mr. Ebihara developed a spectacular Zelkova Serratta, in his back yard, and no one knew about it. Worked on it for 30 to 40 years before it was “discovered”. He was offered $1 Million Dollars for it. He turned it down. He said he had spent his entire adult life working on it, and didn’t want to sell it.

 

[MrWunderful]

Ive started About 100 of deciduous (maples, elm, tilia, etc. ) from seed over the last 8 years. Check with me in 25 years

Thats one of the things that most alluring about deciduous bonsai for me, is the amount of time and planning required. Good thing I got into bonsai in late 20s.
Im hoping to try and study with Andrew once his garden gets set up and he starts doing study groups.

 

[0soyoung]

Ive started About 100 of deciduous (maples, elm, tilia, etc. ) from seed over the last 8 years. Check with me in 25 years

From seed, it will be a little longer.

 

[namnhi]

Look at Walter Pall’s thread “European Beech #5”. He opens up the thread with the comment: “Finally looks mature after 25 years”.

Well, yes, and no. You can still see where all the primary branches were chopped. Yes, there’s lots of great ramification, and yes, it’s a wonderful tree, and all, but, it STILL needs more time. It’s not that Walter hasn’t done a good job, he’s done a great job! But, it still looks like a tree that’s been chopped and redeveloped.

Please don’t misunderstand what I’m saying. I certainly can’t do any better! No, Walter has done everything in his power to advance the tree. But, it just needs more time. And there’s nothing anyone can do about that. Other than continue to work it.

And that’s the thing about deciduous trees. They take lifetimes to develop!

Mr. Ebihara developed a spectacular Zelkova Serratta, in his back yard, and no one knew about it. Worked on it for 30 to 40 years before it was “discovered”. He was offered $1 Million Dollars for it. He turned it down. He said he had spent his entire adult life working on it, and didn’t want to sell it.

Is this 1 million offered is a documented fact or just joke that got pass along? Long enough that no one really knows and it stuck.

 

[leatherback]

Is this 1 million offered is a documented fact or just joke that got pass along? Long enough that no one really knows and it stuck.

it is no joke

 

[parhamr]

I think Ryan is really interested in deciduous, maybe he is not selling many because he is still working on them. I think Ryan is realtivily young, for him to have many good deciduous he would have had to start them before his apprenticeship.

It’s true. I haven’t been to Mirai much this year, but in previous years he typically has a big pile of freshly dug, field-grown deciduous material in the late winter.

 

[Adair M]

Is this 1 million offered is a documented fact or just joke that got pass along? Long enough that no one really knows and it stuck.

It’s no joke. It is known as “The Million Dollar Zelkova”. Oh, yes, the people who came to buy the tree from him were very forceful, insisting that he sell the tree to him. This was before he was well known. And they thought they could intimidate him.

 

[yenling83]

I don't think its true that no one is committed to D tree collection. I think there is plenty of it going on. Thing is, ancient collected conifers have sucked all the air out of the room as far as what's "fashionable" in North American bonsai for buyers Why do you think all those conifers sold so quickly and why does Ryan deal mostly in old collected western alpine conifers?

Zach Smith has been mentioned as one of the dedicated deciduous collectors.. He's been collecting quality D trees for literally DECADES. I have a Bald Cypress I. got from him back in the 90's. It's pretty far along in development. Probably could be seen as "finished" as far as that goes. Additionally, Alvaro at Cho Bonsai is digging up some spectacular old deciduous trees in Texas and the southwest.

Neither guy gets much credit for what they're doing. "Collected Conifer Inc." gets all the notice and envy from buyers with deep pockets. Those ancient twisted trees sell for big money and collectors can turn a hefty profit without much development work. Don't get me wrong, old North American conifers are spectacular for bonsai. They're flashy, people like shiny things...;-) Just take some wire and bend them into the shape you want...;-)

D trees take a BIT more time, but not a lot. You can get a pretty great bonsai in a few years from fast-growing species such as Cedar Elm (or any kind of elm), bald cypress, or apple, and a few more species.

Respect.

Do you have any info or a link to Zach Smith or a link? I'm familiar with Alvaro, but not Zach.

 

[MrWunderful]

From seed, it will be a little longer.

Im getting over an inch per year on my zelkovas, might not be as long as you think 35 years is a long time!

 

[LanceMac10]

Respect.

Do you have any info or a link to Zach Smith or a link? I'm familiar with Alvaro, but not Zach.

Bonsai South | Better Material Means Better Bonsai

bonsai-south.com

 

[leatherback]

Im getting over an inch per year on my zelkovas

Height? Or girth?

 

[GGB]

Also .. what deciduous trees are supposed to be collected. I can't think of species on the mid atlantic (outside of elm) that is well suited to bonsai. Most of the best stuff comes from the mountains too, where conifers tend to grow. I think it's probably a handful ofthings coming into play.

 

[TN_Jim]

Owen does indeed. We will see about Andrew, Bjorn was supposed to be all about it, but doesn't seem as oriented that way as I had expected.

This spring Bjorn welcomed our monthly meeting of the Nashville Bonsai Society to Eisei-En. It was entirely dedicated to deciduous material. This was a fine day and felt very much an open group experience, definitely not just a demo. Good things.

 

[MrWunderful]

Height? Or girth?

Thats what sh.........

never mind

girth, I can get 5-6’ of height!

 

[parhamr]

Thats what sh.........

never mind

girth, I can get 5-6’ of height!

Don’t forget girth growth slows down as the circumference expands!

 

[rockm]

Also .. what deciduous trees are supposed to be collected. I can't think of species on the mid atlantic (outside of elm) that is well suited to bonsai. Most of the best stuff comes from the mountains too, where conifers tend to grow. I think it's probably a handful ofthings coming into play.

Most of the best stuff isn't from the mountains around here in the Middle Atlantic. They're from everywhere from old gardens to coal slag heaps and vacant lots--I found a spectacular black cherry trunk on a dead end road where teenage partiers' trucks had smashed it repeatedly over the years... Stop thinking about pristine mountaintop trees as the ideal. They're not and they're not collectible here in the eastern U.S. anyway. Most mountaintops around here are protected land, state or federal.

As for species--there are many, Carolina hornbeam, hophornbeam, hawthorn, old smashed apple trees in abandon orchards, old landscaping plants (you're not going to get 200 year old azalea or boxwood in Colorado--but they're common in these parts in old yards and properties), blackhaw, blueberry, snowbell, old wisteria, privet, crape myrtle, sweetgum, red maple--acer rubrum (if you're looking for a challenge, as well as American Beech), yaupon holly, pitch pine, common persimmon,

these are only a few. There are species that haven't been tried, so you can also pioneer if you find a tree with a decent two feet of trunk and nebari...