Montpellier maples - Acer monspessulanum

[AlainK]

Very cool stuff Alain. Well done.

Thanks J.W.I.

I appreciate.

Fair play

 

[AlainK]

This is a nice variety.

This is a species that used to grow in the Mediterranean area, and along the southern atlantic coast, but it can be grown in most placesi n France now because of global warming.

I'm certain it would thrive in California.

 

[rodeolthr]

I actually grew this maple when I still lived in Wyoming (Rocky Mtn West) zone 4b, elevation 3200ft. It survived several winters (in the ground).....even though I didn't expect it to. I believe it died only because I moved it to a new growing area where I was unable to provide adequate moisture until it became established.

 

[AlainK]

I believe it died only because I moved it to a new growing area where I was unable to provide adequate moisture until it became established.

That's probably true. Montpellier maple is very close to Field maple, I suppose that Field maple being just a bit more adapted to colder climates, M. maples stayed in the south.

I also heard that both species can hybridize, though this is still debated among "specialists" (or at least, differnet sources). But I'm pretty sure it can.

The ones I got from South-West France, around "Brive-la-Gaillarde", where winters are rather mild and summers quite hot and dry leaf out about two weeks before some I grew from seeds collected in "Ardèche", where summers are hot and dry too, but winters can be very harsh (lots of snow there. A place where I'd love to spend my retirement years if any left).

 

[rodeolthr]

Alain,
Do I remember correctly that you have/had either Montpellier or Field maple with exceptionally small leaves?

 

[AlainK]

you have/had either Montpellier or Field maple with exceptionally small leaves?

Not exactly, actually I have a field maple that has slightly larger leaves than the true species, and the lmeaflets are rounder. It might be a hybrid, but I haven't found what the parents might be.

 

[AlainK]

That is a very shallow pot, please keep updating this, I'd like to know how it performs in such a shallow pot.

Hi Judy,

Actually, I'm cheating a bit: I keep it in this pond basket, except when I want to take it out for a couple of days, or for a photo. When I take it out, I just cut off the root(s) that begins to get out from the draining hole.

This is a photo taken on September 29th, outside the place where we have our Sunday meetings once a month now. So far the colours are the same today, dark green, very healthy (others are beginning to take their autumn colours).

 

[AlainK]

"Acer monspessulanum 5" is starting to become interesting.

... but it's evolving soooo slowly.

Where I live has become a very suitable place for this species because of climate warming, but like some other deciduous species, they seem to come to almost a halt if you always keep them potted.

A photo taken today. Apart the first branch that is becoming well ramified, the rest of the tree needs 2,3,5, or even more years to develop.

A real challenge, a lesson to learn about "patience": I think if ever this plant becomes a "bonsai" one day, it will be my sons', or someone else's

Today:

 

[Gustavo Martins]

Hi Alain,

Any fall colour on these?

 

[AlainK]

No, unfortunately.

I was "snowed under work" when they began to change colours, there were a few days of snow and sleet, not the kind of weather that makes you feel like taking a camera out when the days are shorter, and when I went out again, all or almost all the leaves had fallen.

But they're always "butter yellow" before leaf fall.

 

[Gustavo Martins]

Shame. I just put an order for some seeds. Hope they do better here than Japanese maples. They should in theory...

 

[Daniele]

Salut, Alain!
I'm growing some A. Monspessulanum from seeds I collected in 2015 on the plateau north of Cahors, some 50 km from Brive.
I sowed them in 2016; it is their second year of growth.
First year in small pots ( 4 ") and 2017 in the ground (basically pumice, 20 % peat, 10 % sand). They do grow very slow, indeed!
I wired some of them just to create some movement. The fall colour of the leaves is orange-yellow and (it may be my fault) a field maple made its appearance among them....
Your nr. 5 looks quite good! How old is it?​

 

[hendrik]

Hi all,
great topic!
I am Hendrik, new here but "infected" with bonsai for 32 years now, and an absolute maple nut from even before that and have been studying the genus a bit.

Acer monspessulanum is a very nice species for bonsai and for gardens as well.
I also find it to be a bit slow growing, a bit like Acer palmatum from seed, however there is a big difference between different populations.
I'm lucky enough to have a well established group close to where i live (in the Netherlands) and found these plants produce seedlings that are much more vigorous than from imported seeds from more southern wild populations. Mind you, the species can be found as far north as the wine regions in southern Germany.
Please note, A. monspessulanum is not closely related to A. campestre. They look alike but are from two different sections in the genus Acer that are morphologically very different (respectively sections Acer and Platanoidea). Hybridization is very unlikely. Campestre has milky sap monspessulanum has not.

 

[AlainK]

I put the root-over-rock in a pond basket with 5-7 mmm pozzolane and pine bark for the rest of the summer so it doesn't dry out, and for the winter so that it won't freeze.

I have so many potted trees, and I'm not retired yet. I had left this one alone until today.

I thought it must have pushed heavy roots down the hole of the small pot, but to my suprise, there were only a few. The tree looked very healthy (dark green leaves), so I decided to defoliate it:

 

[Davidlpf]

Nice trees congratulations.

I've found this couple of articles about montpellier defolation

Part One
Part Two

They are in spanish, but may help you to boost your trees by a "special technique", It seems that the key is a partial defolation, before the leaves harden too much

Greetings from Spain

 

[AlainK]

They are in spanish, but may help you to boost your trees by a "special technique", It seems that the key is a partial defolation, before the leaves harden too much

Thanks for the link.

Spain (and the south of France) have very different climates: I tried partial defoliation, it didn't work too weel.

Here, the temperatures are (still) a bit cooler than in Spain and we have more rainy days in summer.

Also my Acer m. come from two different places: Ardèche, where the summers are very hot but very cold in winter, with lots of snow (the place I'd love to retire!), and Brive-la-Gaillarde, with hot summers but rather warm winters. And the ones from Ardèche leaf out almost two weeks after those from Brive: the genetics are different.

It's a good thing when trees have genetic variation, but they can behave slightly differently depending on the place they come from.

But I'll definitely try next what is advised on the links you posted. Thanks again for the tips.

 

[Gustavo Martins]

I love this species. my 4 seeds did not sprout well, one did but was eaten gonna try again next year

 

[AlainK]

Ola Gustavo,

I love this species. my 4 seeds did not sprout well, one did but was eaten gonna try again next year

If you want to grow trees from seeds, the best provider I know is "Semences du Puy". They are supposed to have a Spanish version of their site, but from I can read, I can speak Spanish like a native!

See for yourself:

https://www.semencesdupuy.com/es/acer-monspessulanummontpelier-maple.html

Anyway, I've never been disappointed with what I ordered from them, and they sell Acer monspessulanum for 5.50€ (about 125 seeds), plus shipping of course but that shouldn't be very expensive.

Out of 125 seeds, I bet that at least 50 will sprout. If none sprout, I'll send you one of my own - no risk if you follow the procedure

For next year, order in late October, early november so you can get fresh seeds.

I don't speak Spanish, but if ever you decide to order from them and have any question, or trouble, feel free to PM me, I'll be glad to help.

Alain K.

 

[petegreg]

Nice trees congratulations.

I've found this couple of articles about montpellier defolation

Part One
Part Two

They are in spanish, but may help you to boost your trees by a "special technique", It seems that the key is a partial defolation, before the leaves harden too much

Greetings from Spain

Thanks for the links. Google translate was so funny to understand, but I've got it. There's not only partial defoliation, but shoot selection and shot pruning, too. When my m. maples get to certain stage I'll give it a try.

 

[Gustavo Martins]

Ola Gustavo,



If you want to grow trees from seeds, the best provider I know is "Semences du Puy". They are supposed to have a Spanish version of their site, but from I can read, I can speak Spanish like a native!

See for yourself:

https://www.semencesdupuy.com/es/acer-monspessulanummontpelier-maple.html

Anyway, I've never been disappointed with what I ordered from them, and they sell Acer monspessulanum for 5.50€ (about 125 seeds), plus shipping of course but that shouldn't be very expensive.

Out of 125 seeds, I bet that at least 50 will sprout. If none sprout, I'll send you one of my own - no risk if you follow the procedure

For next year, order in late October, early november so you can get fresh seeds.

I don't speak Spanish, but if ever you decide to order from them and have any question, or trouble, feel free to PM me, I'll be glad to help.

Alain K.

Thanks. I appreciate it.

I found different procedures described for the germination of this species. What's your technique. Normal cold stratification for 3 months? Any scarification?