Namako

[rockm]

Don't get me wrong. The technique Victrinia shows is pretty cool. I am going out this weekend to get some etching paste to use on some perpetually shiny inexpensive Chinese pots. I think this would do wonders for them.

I was just saying that the namako glazes shown on the pots at the start of the post aren't in real need of such treatment. They aren't really garish. They are what they're supposed to be--glazed pots that can complement a tree. They are less strong than they appear in the photos when paired with the proper tree. A white flowering ume would go with either one. A lily magnolia might go with the second. These kinds of pots are used in Japan for such trees.

 

[Victrinia Ridgeway]

Rock... I would etch them for the same reason they bury pots in Japan... or dip them in rice water... soften the effect of the glaze and add character to the pot. I would not hesitate to take the high shine off of a pot, no matter how expensive... unless there was a historical preservation reason not to. (and *I* am not likely to ever own one of those...lol)

It's just a matter of personal taste... i like satin finishes on fancy glazes...

Your friend,

V

PS make sure you read the whole article Eric did... it's very helpful.

 

[rockm]

Vic,

If you're buying pots with satin finishes, then you probably would pass these up anyway, I guess.

What I'm saying is, these pots are made with a certain aesthetic in mind. Their appeal is the glaze. It's what you buy such a pot for.

I've been trying to find an article on these kinds of glazes I read a while back. It was quite interesting. These are quite traditional and have a long history. The one on the left is called "rabbit's fur" for its resemblance to that critter's pelt.

Used for bonsai, they're not as strong as they might seem by themselves, especially for shohin and smaller sized trees.

 

[Victrinia Ridgeway]

lol... that's my point about taking off the high shine my friend... there are no pots I would pass up if I enjoyed the glaze. Infact I would buy both of those pots in a minute if I ran into them, they are exceptional glazes.

But if I did get some... I might even have to leave them alone, just the way they are... I mentioned our dialogue to Eric and he looked at me funny when I told him they were tokomome pots. He mumbled something that he wouldn't do that to a tokonome... and I looked at him and said, I would...lol

He gave me the dubious look that said I might not be able to find the items required, if I tried.

V

 

[rockm]

"lol... that's my point about taking off the high shine my friend... there are no pots I would pass up if I enjoyed the glaze. In fact I would buy both of those pots in a minute if I ran into them, they are exceptional glazes."

But that's MY point, if you don't like the high shine on the glaze (that is an inherent part of the glaze and an integral part of the pots existence) you're not really "enjoying" it. This glaze is what the potter worked to produce. It's not that easy to do and it's what you're paying for in such a high-end Tokoname pot.

Good Tokoname glazed pots age pretty well on their own and can attain a nice patina over time as rain, fertilizer and sun work their magic.Peter Krebs has a very nice article on this subject along with photos of pots that probably started out with really strong colors and glazes, but shows what they can become:

http://www.bonsaipots.net/index.php?page=patina-on-old-pots

 

[mcpesq817]

Good Tokoname glazed pots age pretty well on their own and can attain a nice patina over time as rain, fertilizer and sun work their magic.Peter Krebs has a very nice article on this subject along with photos of pots that probably started out with really strong colors and glazes, but shows what they can become:

http://www.bonsaipots.net/index.php?page=patina-on-old-pots

Thanks very much for sharing that link. That was very informative. I didn't realize the patina on old pots was highly valued. Granted I probably wouldn't live long enough to see the patina development, but if I had an expensive pot, I wouldn't be messing with the glaze. On cheap pots, I would have no problems doing so.

I like both the pots in the link. Not sure I have any trees that would look good in them at the moment, but the patterns are really cool.

 

[cquinn]

It's quite traditional for Shohin to be in very intensly glazed, even loud pots. Even pines and Junipers in glazed pots for Shohin. I got that tip from Kathy Shaner.

 

[rockm]

So, I went out to Michael's Craftorama this weekend and bought a bottle of the etching cream.

I was intrigued by Ms Vic's post on this stuff and wanted to try it out on a large 15" 8" X 3" (or so) higloss Chinese pot I have.

I followed the article's instruction, caked the stuff on, left it for 20 minutes......got no results, nada, zilch, zero... Not a dent in the glaze. The pot may even be shinier now, since I had to clean it in preparation for the treatment.

I have no doubt this stuff works, but apparently, some glazes are tougher than others. This one looks like it might repel bullets ...I plan on another treatment that might last 45 minutes, although I don't know if there's a window of maximum return with the chemical involved. Also the medium sized bottle which might cover one more application on this pot was $26...

Vic, any ideas?

 

[Klytus]

Wire wool?

Cerium Oxide?

Slurry from a nagura stone?

For rock tumbling you can get various grades of loose abrasive grits graded down to a final polish of Cerium Oxide,i do not know what could be used to create a paste out of it for buffing purposes.

Lard of something?

 

[yenling83]

Rock... I would etch them for the same reason they bury pots in Japan... or dip them in rice water... soften the effect of the glaze and add character to the pot.

Any more info on these two aging techniques? Do you just bury in the ground, and if so for how long before you see any results? I don't really see what this would do?

Rice water? Is that just water, that you cooked rice in? This is supposed to soften the glaze effect?

 

[Klytus]

Maybe i should mention the aim of using abrasives in this instance is to differentially remove a few microns of the impervious glass which may for may not form the exterior of the glaze.

If it's like case hardening of steel it may be that it's softer underneath.

Quite what contributes to the inability of your glass etchant to etch a glaze would seem to depend on exactly what the mixture of the glaze was.

Not being an expert in toughening glass with chemicals and heat treatments to resist corrosives i do not know what this could be.